enough sadness to run for all of the times for are everyone involved in this case >> it's not surprising that the victims have come in and obviously the maximum sentence your has the narrative dropped his case, that they believe is true this court knows that there are is other information that was not a part of this case and i leave this court knows the defense was hugely hamstrung and i think that purpose pains at times >> what to do. >> i guess i'm talking about not being able to call her medical professionals not equal to the call for shooter's to stands happening, able to cross examine juries about convince the sure >> those all the

>> friends and i do believe the shooter are putting out tonight, you leave the forensic markers >> and i i >> understand the court has already ruled on that. i understand the tendency, though, after hearing narratives that has been made public cazden should make jennifer crumbley sound monster to those by her to make her sound horrible, mother in legal person. >> and the truth is, it's an effort to put her >> in hand wearing other to save. this is not something that could happen to any of us in the it is something that could happen to any of us >> and people fail what the sentencing memo shows the court through numerous letters of support that this is he does have okay she does have compassion. she has spent night

after night crying, not only herself and her son, but also for victims and for what her son did and what she will live with, knowing he did. and what she missed all the years forward at the end of the day, we asked the court to look at mrs. crumbley's role in the offenses. we asked the court to consider that well, i don't she did not oppose having gotten in the home. she was not the person was responsible for storing the gun and believes it was being stored properly and that it was locked. mr. crumbley obviously testified and all of the evidence at trial. so if she believed there was a string lock, the table, please. sounded weapon this is really troubled me from your silence because he spent a lot

of time talking about the fact that she didn't know anything about the gun she didn't like it. she those responsible for it >> but at one time, she was texting her husband to see whether or not we've got a gun >> and how much? >> she posted pictures of it as for sons this was president >> she shut up >> and i don't know purely aware of this. first jury determined that there was a claim that the gun was the responsibility defendant james crumbley and this is crumbley testified that when she returned to be the range of the sheer department, 27 is the dependent change crumbley was response sour >> you from the car >> first three recognize that the gps the case shows that either defendant james probably in the house, the shooters

video taken, unlocked six hour in the kitchen of the whole so that's not true. that's not true. >> she also testified that cubic cable one >> his head two years time. i the cable-like >> evidence of traveling for that. we know that's not correct it's time we got in the car so that james crumbley could put the gun in the house and store it correctly? >> this is >> probably there were multiple people lax in that house because there were there was more than one lacquer was not just the cable luck sig sauer. there was there was more than one

>> there were not more than one sound. >> but whatever ethan crumbley did the cable luck from the six he >> did all of the other designs. i will obviously go i don't think they have to show that she had no problem with the gun >> and i'm not saying go about. >> i >> said she supported good gotten sheets and object to the

gun but when it came down to it provision breaks in your narrative that she not one >> there's no evidence >> you have been listening to very emotional testimony earlier from the parents of students, teenagers who were murdered by ethan crumbley back in 2021 >> and >> what they're discussing is the sentencing for his parents who were already convicted earlier. this year of involuntary manslaughter. now the question is, how long? >> will they >> be in prison i want to go straight to jean casarez, who has been following this trial since the beginning, and jeanne, these four students killed at oxford high school

not just for students, but also there was a teacher who was wounded and six others also were wounded just to afford a fourt, not just for students were murdered and listening gene to their parents talk in such vivid and yet kind of mundane terms about what it was like not only the de, that they were killed regular days for their teenage kids, but also whole of the things that the kids will miss in their lives because of ethan crumbley 15 at the time murdering them in cold blood. and the question is, the culpability today of their parents. we know that they've already been found culpable, but how much they will serve to pay their whatever debt that can be paid >> dana, those those victim impact statements were so

carefully carefully crafted and planned out to show the emotion, to show the repercussions of what happened to show a timeline of when they were one to know where the gun was they're wondering where their child is, and the judge has to take this into consideration and fashioning the sentences is an important piece for her as she does all of this, not the defense right now is arguing mitigating factors that jennifer crumbley was not s a guest house behind

her home and she will allow for jennifer to get out of prison, be in home confinement with a gps monitor in that guest house for the duration of any sentence that is something i think we've never heard of before, but that is what they are proposing for jennifer's punishment to be at this point >> yeah. and gene the idea that you said it is a very novel question about whether or not this is a way for her client, the mother, jennifer crumbley, to avoid being imprisoned >> i also just >> want to just quickly ask you jean about the argument that she made that i am his mother and it wasn't necessarily i'm obviously paraphrasing

something that i did wrong this could happen to any of you. i can't imagine given forgive me. i'm gonna go right now back to the courtroom. james crumbley, the father of ethan crumbley, who was sentenced to life in prison for murder, is now going to plead his case on his sentencing >> before i address this court directly. >> i wanted >> you something that i had never been able to do throughout this time until now >> i want to >> see i can't imagine the pain and agony the families for the families that have lost her children. and what they're

appearance seen him, but they're going through as a parent or biggest fear is losing our child or children the lose a child is on imaginable >> i >> my my heart is really broken for every everybody involved >> i understand my words >> are not going to bring any comfort >> i understand they're not going to relieve any pain quite frankly, they probably just don't believe me however i really wanted to families of madison baldwin hana st. juliana tate, myre mirror and justin shilling to know how it's really helps really sorry, i am and how devastated

i was when i heard what happened to them i cried for you and the loss of your children more times than i can count i know you're paying in los will never go away >> part of you will be missing forever but please know that i am truly very sorry i am sorry for your loss as a result. >> what my son did i cannot express how much i wish that i had done what was going on with him or what was going to happen because i absolutely wouldn't have done a lot of things differently again, my my part

pours out to every single one of you it, really does judge matthews, i'm not going to i'm not going to overdo a lot of things that we're already said but i know the full amount of pressure that you have on you and the responsibility that has been placed on you throughout this case the upmost

respect for you and i'm simply going to ask that you sentenced me in fair. and just way you presided over my trial and heard the evidence that was presented against me you know that what my son did >> i was not aware of >> or that he was planning for that he obtained access to firearms in my house there was absolutely no evidence that suggested that as my attorneys cold, you, i've been on locked down for 23 hours a day i have not been able to speak to my son since november 30, and he we'll speak with my wife since december 3 >> i know that i have experienced pails and compassion to what those families who've lost their

children and countless other victims experience every day because of what my son did but i want you to know i2 green for everyone >> as i've explained for everyone, that's been affected by what my son pled guilty to doing and i'll continue to feel that this is pain for the rest of my life as well >> if i could go >> back and change things if i could go back and do things differently and maybe none of us would be here today so again, i asked, your honor to impose adjusting their sentence based on the truth about what you've heard during my trial >> i'm asking >> the court to sentence me to time served. and placed me on probation for the maximum time

allowed. the gps tether first of long is the court deems necessary i also want to address one last thing >> and that's to what tate beers debts and it's time >> that we all know the truth we have been prohibited from telling the. >> whole >> truth, the whole truth has not been told and i'm with you, mr. mayor >> i >> too want the truth because you have not had you had not had the truth at all. the truth has not been presented to you

>> thank you >> thank your honor >> i can >> submit a sentencing memorandum, your honor, i'm not going to belabor the points that i made in my memorandum. if i do believe that it was thorough, however, i do want note for the course that it specially in statements that have been made about james that we lacked remorse, that he doesn't feel bad and you try to put up as you just heard, james crumbley, the father of michigan school shooter, ethan crumbley throw >> himself at the mercy of the court as the judge decides what his sentencing will be, just as a reminder james crumbley, just like his wife, jennifer, or each separately convicted on four counts of involuntary

manslaughter and one of the reasons at least for james is because prosecutors said that the parents >> showed a chilling lack of remorse and for him, for james crumbley, the prosecuting attorney, karen mcdonald said that crumbley called threatening saying there will be retribution, believed me jean casarez, i know that you're still here with us. that is a very different approach that you just heard him take. now, which to me sounded a lot more contrite then jennifer crumbley in her speech, just shortly before he spoke a tearful saying that i know you don't believe me to the family members of the four teenagers, who his son killed i'm sorry for your loss. i would have done a lot of things

differently and i to grieve for your children gene dana, a very interesting point at the end when he said that to parents, he said, i want to echo what taped mirrors father said, we want to know the truth. you do not know the whole truth. you don't know it. >> and that goes along with i think in a legal issue that may come about on appeal because both parents wanted their son, ethan crumbley, to >> come into the courtroom during their trials and to testify because ethan had texted to his friend in the middle of the night i have asked my dad to help me. i need mental health. he told me to suck it up and take a pill well, once he was arrested, ethan crumbley, he had a jail psychiatrists talk with him and assessing him, but asking him about different things. and one of those things was the texts that he wrote about his mental health he told, according to testimony in the miller

hearing, which was ethan crumbley's precursor to his sentencing hearing he sold told the jail psychiatrists that he lied. he said, i never asked my dad for help, never lie. just said that to my friend the parents wanted that testimony to come into the trial to show that they did not know mentally what was happening to him. but the appellate attorneys for ethan crumbley said no. first of all, he is not going to waive his fifth amendment right to come in and testify to that. secondly, these are medical records were not waiving those medical records. so there was no way for the parents to counter that text that he wrote to his friend unless they took the stand to say, we didn't know that james crumbley opted to not take the stand. that's his constitutional right. so that came in without anything to counter it >> very interesting. and yeah there's no question that what you said is true. we will probably see and hear a lot of that on appeal and just two

reiterate what the judge is deciding how much, if any, prison time each of these individuals, the parents of ethan crumbley, should get and they each face up to 15 years in prison. and we're going to take a quick break. but before we do, i want to remind people the individuals, the teenagers that we're talking about, who we're murdered in the, prime of their lives before they were even getting started really with their lives, madison baldwin, age 17, tate myre, age 16. hana st. juliana, age 14 justin shilling age 17 >> we'll be right back how would really happened sunday, april 28, bit nine on >> cnn, which like are we operating asking the right question? can greatly impact

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>> one aleve works all day. so i can keep working nine i just want to leave 12 hours uninterrupted pain-related. >> i'll leave. >> who do you take it for? >> and >> for fast topical child iv e x >> get more breaking news at this hour. donald trump's legal team is about to leave in new york city courthouse after a hastily called hearing about the latest gag order placed on the former president in his hush money case. cnn's kaitlan poll. lance is following these developments. caitlin, what happened inside that courtroom? >> well, our team in new york is falling this quite closely and things are moving quite fast here. dana, there was this appeal that donald trump, his team took to the court today over gag order that he is under where he can't speak about

witnesses, court staff, the da's office, even the judge's family, his attorneys in those arguments said he might be rude, but this isn't incitement. he this is something that is causing donald trump irreparable harm and there apparently was a request to delay the case on the table as well from his team. that's not going to happen according to the reporting we're getting out of our team in new york just after that appeal was heard, we get the decision just a few minutes ago. there isn't going to be a delay of the trial because of this gag order issued the da's office was clearly successful in arguing to the appellate judge that the witnesses are hesitant that this gag order is within the law, so there's going to be a flurry of things that happen as we await the

beginning of this trial on monday and that flurry, right now he's donald trump's team making these requests to delay to move the case out of new york to challenge the gag order and the appeals court in new york supreme court, they're looking at these quite quickly and giving same day decisions. yeah. that was just gonna say, i mean, not only the same day like five minutes after the hearing was over, i want to stand by for one second, caitlin, i want to bring in former us attorney for the southern district of new york, elie honig le what's your read on what just happened in that courtroom in new york? >> well, then is zero surprise on this one. first of all, even if there was going to be some modification, some change to the gag order made by the appeals court that would have nothing to do with this trial starting as scheduled on monday, april 15. and second of all, this gag order is very narrow. it's actually quite remarkable to hear donald trump say it infringes on his rights or it's impeding his ability to defend himself because all that the gag order does is it prohibits donald trump from commenting publicly about jurors, about witnesses, and then about core and prosecutor staff and family members he is free and he has taken full

advantage of his freedom to attack the case. the judge himself and the de a himself. so it's no surprise donald trump lost this one, as caitlin said, he's been losing these arguments really quick. quickly. i think collectively the judges in the new york state system are sending a message that this thing is going on monday and he's not getting out of it. yeah. it's hard to understand the trump attorney argument that having him not talk about the judge's family or potential jurors, is doing the former president and irreparable damage. this is going to happen it seems in six days. so what's going to happen as soon is our first is jury selection. i want to read a part of the questionnaire for potential jurors have you ever considered yourself a supporter of or belong to any of the following? the q and on movement proud boys, oath keepers, three percenters, bungalow boys, and tufa ellie, can you i mean, the question is pretty straightforward the idea

is, they're trying to weed out people who are pro trump. we should also give some context. this is manhattan and this is a place where joe biden won by at six donald trump by 12.3%, i guess there's could be part of that 12.3% in the potential jury pool >> the identity this questionnaire is really interesting because it's doing a dance of sorts. what it's trying to do is figure out where do you stand on donald trump. do you have views for or against him that are so strong that you can't possibly rule fairly on that case now they do to asked that question straight up? is there anything about your views of this case or donald trump and put that out in fairly. we can put that up. forgive me. question number 34. as you continue to talk, didn't mean to interrupt, you know >> and then there are other questions that they don't ask that you would think would be logical to ask. like, did you vote for donald trump in 2020, run we registered democrat and

republican, but in lieu of those direct questions they ask these glancing questions like the one you just showed, are you aligned with q and honore aligned with antigua? there's other sort of less out there ways that they tried to get at that they say, where do you primarily get your news from what source they say? have you ever? been to a trump rally or an anti-trump rally? have you ever worked for or against the trump political organization? but but i'll tell you, what the lawyers are looking for. love the textbook, say we're looking for fair jurors who can call it right down the middle. this is a competitive exercise. the lawyers are looking for jurors who are inclined for their side. if you're the da frankly, you want people who disliked donald trump and if you're trump's team, you want people who support him. i know it's about the facts and the law two, but let's be realistic jury selection. this is a competitive exercise which is always kaitlan, a competitive exercise, no matter what kind of courtroom you're in even more so when the courtroom is effectively a very important campaign, stop or a an

important campaign event. >> yeah. and one thing we're seeing right now, dana, is there's going to be a continued conversation. arguments motions, very quick decisions that happens outside of the presence of the jury. so they get this jury is seated. we're gonna go through jury flexion. we'll watch that. but what's presented to the jury is not even the only thing that's going to happen in court. so there's going to be what trump says to the cameras that campaign type events of him walking in and out. we're not going to be seeing the proceedings live, are going to be hearing about them through our reporters who are in the room watching and then there's the legal arguments. and then what the jury itself. so this >> is going to be a taste of what's to come when this hearing starts. and that is let's go to our reporter who was in the courtroom for that gag order appeal that happened very quickly. kara scannell, i believe we've your with us

there. you are, cara. what happened inside your dana so the judge denied this motion to stay the trial so they could make arguments on the gag order. and trump's lawyers came in saying that the gag order is restricting trump from defending himself in this case. and they said they're seeking limited relief. they want him to be able to address to witnesses who have been outspoken about this stormy daniels and michael cohen. they also said that trump should be able to call out what he views as political interference. one of the prosecutors on this case as in focusing on his ability to speak about emotion that has been publicly filed. that is when they've asked the judge to recuse himself, you'll remember the judge had altered his gag order that he put in place to cover for his daughter because trump was focusing on work that she does for democratic groups. now the prosecutors argued that this was much more than what they were asking for. they wanted to stop the trials so they can make these arguments. they said that this is far too late. they could have brought this case up on appeal once the judge had issued the gag order, even before he amended it, but they waited until now, just one week before the trial. how this

is going to play out is that this judge denied for now, but a full panel will get briefs on whether to stop this trial. based on this argument. now, those briefs are due on april 15th. that is the day this trial starts. there will not be oral arguments and the judges will issue a written decision sometime after the 15th. once jury selection is underway, that is the first part of this. and then they are going to still try to continue to challenge the gag order even after this initial decision on whether the trial starts on time is made dana qarrah, thanks for running out and giving us that report. a lot of breaking news this morning so far. stick around. we'll be right back. >> once waiting for something new in kept wanting more and the lead tuesday on tbs is here. >> rodrick overs begins tonight at nine on tbs

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to file a claim of appeal by right. an application for leave to appeal if you cannot afford to hire an attorney to represent you on appeal, and your request an attorney an attorney may be appointed for you you may request an attorney by completing the request for appointment of attorneys section of the form that will be provided for you and by returning the form to this court or to the michigan assigned counsel system at the address on the form if you wish to preserve your automatic right to appeal, the four must be received within 42 days after sentencing. if you that submit the form within 42 days from today, you may still file an application patient for leave to appeal if the form is received within six months after sentencing do each of the defendants i've knowledge receipt of the appellate rights >> now breakfast forms here.

would you prefer us to it it doesn't matter either way. >> either way >> thank you. i'm going to ask everyone, we may see that all the defendants had taken out of the courtroom. >> i think we're going to finish their apollo. >> they're gonna miss are currently has going to finish just all right. >> well, we'll wait for that finger on i would just ask that knowing no one stand up. it makes the deputies nervous

>> major development in that courtroom. the judge sentencing jennifer crumbley and james crumbley two ten to 15 years in prison, which is precisely what prosecutors wanted the judge to do. i want to go straight to jean casarez, who has been following this trial since the beginning, gene well, the judge in pronouncing this decision said, first of all, this is not a case about guns, it's not about guns in the private home. it's about repeated actions over and over and over again by

the parents that amounted to gross negligence that the father, james crumbley, allowed access to that gun to his son that the mother, jennifer crumbley glorified it. and at the school meeting that day, the morning two hours before the mass shooting, when they were shown these math drawings of bullets and blood everywhere my life is useless she said, is this over? and just wanted to get back to work. she said it was very stark. the non carrying aspect of this. and also when jennifer testified that she would not have done anything differently, she said it may have been misunderstood, but it really, really had a stark, stark reaction amongst the victims she said the guidelines were not enough, so right there because the guidelines for these crimes were four to seven years. so you knew something else was coming. the judge said she'd prayed about this. he was up nights worrying about this, thinking about the fact that there is rehabilitation that needs to be done for these

victims, but also deterrence. so that no one else in this country would do something like this. they have to see that and then she pronounced the sentence ten to 15 years. 15 years is the maximum for this offense >> i want to go to a renato mariotti. it's well on this renato, i know you forgive me. i don't think we're not ready yet, jeanne, i just want to put this in context. you have covered unfortunately, your fair share of trials, particularly when it comes to shootings and even, and especially school shootings. >> the >> fact that the parents are being held culpable in this case by involuntary are four and voluntary manslaughter. again, they were already convicted of that, but that they are going to be sentenced to ten to 15 years in prison for that culpability. how significant is this moment

>> absolutely. so significant prosecutors around the country are watching this case. they are looking at this case when i interviewed karen mcdonald shortly after the conviction, i said, do you believe that this is president setting for other processes? computers in this country to follow suit of what you did. her response was they need to ask the question, where did the gun come from regarding the minor child? where did it come from? >> that >> can launch the investigation right now. and i think that in regard to gun violence, prosecutors are looking at this because someone needs to be responsible. and if you have a minor child and you have a gun in your home knowing there's a minor child and it is not locked. it is sitting around it is loaded and something happens there have been cases where there is child neglect charges for a parent, but not homicide.

this is what makes this case stand out from any other case that is bruyne brought before in this country? >> okay. i think we're not is with us now. we're not just pick up where gene left off about the historic precedent that was just set in michigan. and also, i mean, jeanne was talking rightly about the use of the gun and what the prosecutor, karen mcdonald has told her about the need for parents to be more mindful of having loaded guns when they have teenagers around. but the other aspect that gene was talking about that the judge was talking about isn't just the weapon, but the apparent disregard with which the shooter's parents treated, the warnings that came from the school about the behavior and the mental status of their son.

i mean, the fact that that is part of a reason to convict and two sentence to so many years in prison. is also pretty remarkable >> it is remarkable. it is unique. i do think that this is a moment of parents typically when they're making a choice for their child, they're not thinking about potential prison time as a consequence. and this is significant. this is not five days in prison, and are talking years in prison. i mean, it's a significant sentence. no question about it. >> and i have to say >> you have to think about this in the context of the broader debate that we've had been assessed as a society by firearms there has not been as much regulation of firearms. there's been a lot of debate about that. and now you're

seeing the criminal laws being used in a more aggressive fashion by prosecutors in response to that. in other words, if truly, guns are going to be more prevalent. now, the onus is going to be on parents to safely store them if ultimately the end of the day we're saying that school shootings are a matter of personal responsibility. well, if it's a minor, parents have to see these warning signs, whether it's a dark drawing, like there let's hear or as the judge mentioned warning science coming from the school itself >> it's >> going on, i think sparked a lot more debate in the months and years to come >> as it should really significant day for this kind of crime. as you said, when it is a minor, but also one when it comes to first and foremost, the feelings of and the grief of the people we heard from earlier today in that courtroom, the parents of madisyn baldwin tape near hana st. juliana, and justin shilling the four teenagers who were murdered in cold blood by a 15-year-old in michigan in 2021 we continue to remember them. thank you so much for nato gene also. thank you for bringing us your reporting and expertise. we're going sneak and another quick break. don't go away

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when barbara switch to turbotax, >> i wrote for generations of family tradition. >> i want to make perfume >> so i need barbers, new psychic counts by guaranteeing her maximum refund intuit's turbotax close captioning is brought to you by you, cora, help maintain a healthy urinary tract with you, cora, i can having utis for ten years. >> you cora. we make uti relief products. we also make proactive urinary tract health products. you core is a life stage right today at your core.com >> but a lot of breaking news this morning outside of washington, there's a big story developing here to congress's back from recess. and so are the tensions inside the house. republican conference. in fact, they're escalating congresswoman marjorie taylor greene is doubling down on her calls to oust speaker mike johnson. today's she's put an all her grievances with his leadership and escaping five-page letter accusing johnson of quote,

selling out republicans by being quote, in total, lockstep with democrats agenda she's blaming him for jeopardizing their razor thin majority by not serving his own gop conference that elected him. cnn's manu raju is now with us from capitol hill, mano yeah. look, mike johnson is >> coming back into the lion's den of sorts. he has a very complicated legislative agenda. i lots of pressure coming from both sides within his own conference. and that threat from marjorie taylor greene to call for a vote seeking his ouster. remember any one member of the house can do do just that. we saw that happen in historic and unprecedented fashion last year when matt gaetz pushed out, kevin mccarthy as speaker, eight republicans at the time joined with democrats to vote out mccarthy. will that happen again? large? part has to do with mike johnson's dealmaking to keep the government open. but now how he will handle the issue of ukraine aid. so

central to the, his political future as push, there's a major push among supporters to get that done immediately, johnson has not said how he would proceed on that as he's talking to republicans about a different approach than the senate now, marjorie taylor greene made her grievances, no, not just in a letter to her colleagues, this morning, but also last night in a town hall back in georgia he's. >> also, worked with hakeem jeffries and the white house not with his members. that is not what a republican speaker of the house says. maybe a democrat speaker actually i will not tolerate a. speaker of the house that i voted for to sell us out i will not tolerate it >> now the question is how many republicans will join her in this effort? and will democrats actually step in and try to save mike johnson? there would be expected to be voted does actually kill this resolution to oust him from the speakership if and when that

comes to the floor will democrats side would johnson, which was not the case with kevin mccarthy, law that's do with how they see how he proceeds on the issue of ukraine. but again, mike johnson has not detailed how he plans to proceed, given the sharp divisions within his own conference on proceeding with ukraine aid. so he's heading in this difficult period how he asked and how he responds to all this. still uncertain, but he has not spoken as we understand to marjorie taylor greene yet, despite her threats for now, last couple of weeks. >> so that was going to be my question. ukraine is going to play a big role in how this potential vote to vacate the speakership goes down. he was talking over the break about proceeding somehow. what are you hearing about that? >> yeah. this is expect to be different than the sentence pass version that passed almost two months ago, that senate plan $95 billion for israel, ukraine, and taiwan a did not have anything to do with the border security issues. of course, republicans had battled against the bipartisan border security deal in the senate, but the senate move forward as aid package absent that, now,

johnson is trying to add some border security provisions as well as nil there'll that ukraine aid potentially make that ukraine aid a loan. and dana, that's the question we'll democrats be okay with that. well, they save johnson if he moves four with his different backends, all huge questions for the speaker so many questions, a lot of drama, and you really don't know how any of that is going too. and thank you so much for that reporting mondo appreciate it. thank you for joining this very busy day here on inside politics. cnn and new central starts after the break >> carbon, see an sunday, april 21, step nine. >> i won't let my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis symptoms define me emerge as you with trump via most people saw 90% clear your skin, eye four months. and the majority stake clearer. i'd five years. cbs allergic reactions may occur, can fire, may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight until your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms or if

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