welcome to "ac 360 even later." it took us a long time to come up with the name. it's been a long week and long 16 days. 16 days of a government shutdown and head-spinning rhetoric during negotiations until congress finally made a deal to end the shutdown and extend the debt ceiling last night. president obama today called it a manufactured crisis, said things have got to change going forward. >> to all my friends in congress, understand that how business is done in this town has to change. because we've all got a lot of work to do on behalf of the american people, and that

includes the hard work of regaining their trust. our system of self-government doesn't function without it. and now that the government is reopened, and this threat to our economy is removed, all of us need to stop focusing on the lobbyists and the bloggers and the talking heads on radio and the professional activists who profit from conflict and focus on what the majority of americans sent us here to do. and that's grow this economy. create good jobs. strengthen the middle class. educate our kids. lay the foundation for broad-based prosperity and get our fiscal house in order for the long haul. that's why we're here. >> chief congressional correspondent dana bash has been following all the twists and turns, and she joins us now. so what comes next? >> reporter: what comes next is everybody hoping and praying that this doesn't happen again. except maybe if you're ted cruz

who said through a source close to him to me tonight that he is not giving up on the idea of perhaps this happening all again and forcing this to happen again, at least trying to. >> mitch mcconnell has said it's off the table, we won't do another shutdown. >> reporter: oh, yeah. he's definitely learned his lesson, as did most republicans around here. there really has been a lot of wound licking, a lot of reflection. and what's been interesting is that the republicans, even those who thought this might have been a good strategy from the beginning are saying, some have said that they let john boehner down the house speaker and maybe didn't understand the consequences of not playing out the strategy from a to z at the beginning, meaning z was still that half of that building is still controlled by democrats, and the white house is still controlled by democrats. and you know, the republican leaders both mitch mcconnell and john boehner, they knew that they were going to get the blame. they understood that. but they felt that they didn't have a choice because we've

talked about it so many nights in a row now of that pressure. and it really is real real pressure on them from conservatives. but the question is going to be whether or not the people who some of them call themselves the sane caucus inside the house republican world, whether or not they are going to be more aggressive. because part of the issue is they do have a majority but it's a silent majority so far. whether they're going to be more vocal about wanting to work with democrats. because many of them really do. >> although the message from some of the tea party supporters and tea party-backed candidates is the mistake was not being tough enough, the mistake was that some republicans were wishy washy an didn't stand with us. we weren't united. >> reporter: absolutely. that is going to continue to be that message. there's a reason for that. because there is a real constituency out there for that kind of idea, the idea that you have to come here and stick to principle. and the reason why the debt is so high, the deficit has ballooned to astronomical numbers is because people came here and became part of the

establishment and they didn't stick to their principles. that's always going to exist. the question will be whether or not people who have come here for 2 1/2 years since the class of 2010 tea party wave came in get more comfortable as legislators and maybe realize that throwing bombs is okay sometimes but it's also if you want to get things done sometimes you have to as one congressman said to me, go a couple of downs and not just throw it into the end zone in the game. >> and ted cruz continues on. as you said, he says i'm not taking the shutdown off the table. >> reporter: anderson, i have heard so many stories about him inside meetings with fellow republicans as the saga has gone on. they have been really aggressive, almost yelling at him saying, why are you doing this to us? we're going to lose seats. we're in the going to take back the majority in the senate which obviously is their goal if they want to achieve his goal which is to try to defund obama care. and it just doesn't -- he's like teflon. he doesn't seem to mind.

and in fact, he's emboldened by the anger that he's feeling here by his fellow senators because what he's hearing from the constituency that elected him is atta boy. >> interesting. dana bash, appreciate it. thanks very much. senior white house correspondent brianna keilar also joining us now. brianna, the president saying there are no winners here. but behind the scenes does the white house feel this was a victory for them? >> reporter: anderson, i think white house officials certainly feel like the strategy this time around worked much better than what we saw in 2011. the president back then negotiated in earnest. this time with house republicans. this time he really sidelined them and ultimately at least in the polls he fared better. so i think part of the message you were hearing from him today is this kind of hardball strategy is here to stay. of course there's this question of does that tone really mean that there's going to be bipartisanship here? i think white house officials feel like there are external factors at play. some republicans may be tempted to try the strategy again.

you heard dana talking about ted cruz. but i think they're banking on some of those other republicans concerned about the national brand for republicans and certainly the toll that that may take with independent voters. >> an in terms of the president's agenda, he's called today for immigration reform. did they really think they can get something like that done? >> reporter: not just immigration reform, a farm bill and also a budget deal, things that have certainly eluded the white house as far as a bipartisan deal at this point. i think the white house officials admit that this budget crisis and before it the syria situation certainly got in the way here. but you heard the president outline his agenda. and he is insisting that he's going to press through with it. you talk to white house officials, and they certainly admit that it's tough right now going into the next year, the mid-term elections. you have republicans who are going to want to be careful because they're afraid they'll be primaried from the right. i think they definitely see 2015 as perhaps less headwinds because they think the republicans will try to moderate

going into the presidential election. but what's clear, what i picked up from listening to president obama today, is that no matter he's pressing ahead. and he's going to be no matter what trying to drag republicans kicking and screaming if that's what it takes. >> brianna, thanks. let us know what you think. you can follow me on twitter #ac360later. up next the bill congress passed wasn't just about the government shutdown and the debt ceiling. more than $2 billion for a river dam constructions project for instance was in there. we're going to take look at the fine print inside the bill when we continue. the wright brotherse the first in flight. [ goodall ] i think the most amazing thing is how like us these chimpanzees are. [ laughing ] [ woman ] can you hear me? and you hear your voice? oh, it's exciting! [ man ] touchdown confirmed. we're safe on mars. [ cheers and applause ] ♪ hi. [ baby fussing ] ♪

the bill that reopened the government today and raised the debt ceiling is 35 pages long and will keep the government funded until january 15th. surprising additions that some folks might have missed call them earmarks or pork or extra they weren't originally part of the bill. jake tapper keeping them honest. >> great news. panda cam is back. more importantly, the federal government is open for business. but in order to get that compromise bill done, there were of course some shoe-horned extras. some conservatives cried pork after a $2 billion authorization for the olmstead lock and dam project was added to the bill.

>> we're here on the ohio river on the olmstead lock and dams project. >> the money will continue to pay for this massive army corps of engineers project on the ohio river on kentucky's border. it was dubbed the kentucky kickback blaming the addition on senate minority leader mitch mcconnell. >> i'm pleased to get a first-hand briefing of a project that i and others have been working on providing the funds for. >> mcconnell has long supported the dam project. here he is on a visit in 2009. this morning he fired back at critics on wvlk raid yes dio in electionsing t lexington. >> there was no earmark. the army corps of engineers requested the funding. the house and senate had a chance to review it and none asked for it to be taken out. >> mcconnell's negotiating counterpart senate majority leader harry reid agreed last night. >> this is not an earmark.

it saves the taxpayers lots of money. >> it turns out officials say stopping and restraight the project would have cost over $2 million if the authorization had not gone through. and president obama had the same provision to continue the project in his 2014 budget. >> rather than talking about shutting down the government, it's time to talk about shutting down the waste. >> tom schatz is president of citizens against government waste. >> getting a provision to fund a dam opens the door for similar projects in the next c.r. this project has tripled in costs. it's behind schedule. and if regular order had prevailed it's unclear whether that would have been funded at all in the normal energy and water appropriations bill. >> other additions to the bill to reopen the government include $175,000 which will be paid to the widow of senator frank lautenberg. such a payment is standard practice. it might be worth noting the senator was one of the wealthiest mention of congress.

roll call reported he was worth worth more than $50 million in 2011. finally let's call this one the edward snowden effect. the privacy and civil liberties oversight board will get $3 million. they're a white house oversight group set up to guard americans' right to privacy against overreach by government cyber intelligence. >> so jake, what is mcconnell saying about all this? >> he's saying first of all this isn't an earmark. he points out accurately that president obama had the money for this in his 2014 budget and the house and senate have passed it. and his office also says that he's not the one who put it into the bill, that it was senator lamar alexander of tennessee and democratic senator diane feinstein of california who do take credit or blame for putting that in there. that said, this is washington, d.c. and when somebody is negotiating a major deal and just happens to end up with billions of dollars for a dam in his state, well, as president clinton once said, if

i see a snail on top of a fence post it didn't get there by itself. >> what are other lawmakers you're talking to saying? >> well, i think that the people who are really anti-pork like senator john mccain are upset that this didn't go through the normal process. most republicans are saying because they understand this is something probably very important to the senate minority leader mitch mcconnell who is facing a tough re-election fight, possibly, are saying well i wish it had gone through the normal process but they are not specifically criticizing the actual dam or the actual project. >> all right. jake tapper, thanks, jake. >> thanks, anderson. still ahead tonight, how did two convicted murderers walk out of a florida prison? sounds like something out of a movie. it actually happened and the murderers are still on the loose and their victims' families are living in fear. the outrageous story next. before copd...

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learn more at capella.edu and this park is the inside of your body. see, the special psyllium fiber in metamucil actually gels. and that gelling helps to lower some cholesterol. metamucil. 3 amazing benefits in 1 super fiber. police in florida are searching for two men convicted murderers who walked right out of prison. they were identified as joseph jenkins and charles walker. both men 34 years old. both inmates serving life sentences in the same facility although they were mistakenly freed about ten days apart. mistakenly let go. the question is how does that

happen and how do the families of their victims feel about it? john zarrella joins me from orlando. >> john, how did the authorities figure out they were mistakenly let go? >> reporter: anderson, they found out from the family of one of the victims. the family called the state attorney's office here in orlando and said, hey, how come this guy is out of prison? the state attorney's office then notifies the florida department of law enforcement and the department of corrections and tells them what's happened. and of course at this point we do not know how the family found out about the release. >> do the police have any ideas or lead about their whereabouts? >> reporter: well, authorities are saying that they believe that at least one of the men may be here in the orlando area. but of course, they've been out for two weeks, three weeks, almost a month in one case. so they could very well be anywhere. >> and they were released because fraudulent court papers were sent with a fake signature of the judge.

so clearly these inmates must have had some help from someone outside, correct? >> reporter: oh, no question about it. in fact, judge perry said look, my signature is all over the internet. it's easy to find. it's out there. anybody could have gotten their hands on it and forged my signature along with the other documents that were forged. so there's no question that they had some outside help. and it's interesting that both of these men, they're not related to the same case. individual cases. but both of them get these early release notifications. it's certainly some outside help. >> yeah. all right, john zarrella, appreciate it. for more on the story go to cnn.com. just ahead tonight, check back with the senate chaplain barry black who used his pulpit to scold lawmakers during the shutdown. why he says he sees a silver lining in the battle that just ended. >> making them instruments of truth and justice. a confident retirement.

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over the past two weeks on capitol hill one voice stood out not because it was the loudest or most outrageous. it was a voice of calm and reason. that actually counted as being pretty unique around here. he opened each senate session as usual with a prayer and did not mince words. chaplain black's words reached far beyond the senate floor. "saturday night live" did a skit

about him to give you an idea. i talked with the chaplain in the middle of the shutdown. we talked again today. >> how do you feel this is finally over? people were referring to you as the last sane man in the senate. >> well, i don't agree with that characterization. but i am as elated as so many americans are that this impasse has been taken care of, that this challenge has been met. >> what was the reaction you got from serving members of the house and the senate to some of your prayers? >> well, most of the feedback that i received was positive. obviously there are probably some people who feel that my prayers should not have been as pointed as they were. >> why did you feel it was important to be pointed? >> i think thought is critically important that a clergyperson does not utter in prayer an

intercession irrelevant platitudes. my prayers reflect the environment that i'm in. >> do you think this nation has been made stronger by what happened, or has it weakened us? >> i am convinced that there are blessings in adversity. and i think that you're strong in the broken places. if you look at the history of our nation, we've overcome far greater obstacles than what >> what does that mean to be strong in the broken places? >> i think that sometimes the bone that is broken and mends is stronger than the rest of the bone. and so i think that very often it's the same with an individual. david said in the 119th psalm verse 67 "it was good for me that i was after afflicted" so i think that many times afflictions, hardships have a

positive impact. someone once said god sometimes puts us on our backs to get us to look up. >> final question. kind of a silly question. but i don't know of any person in your position who has had a role on "saturday night live." i don't know if you happened to see it this past weekend where someone pretended to be you. it is a huge honor. did you see it? >> i understand that. i'm an old school. i'm way back to the john belushi days. but i would say to keenan he did a wonderful job. i am grateful that he didn't wear a clip on barney five bfe time. he had the bow tie spot on. he needs to lower the pitch a little bit. it's not "let us pray" but "let us pray" and work on being just a little less truculent and irr irreverent but the premise was

beautiful. >> very smart guy and funny guy as well. someone who has a sense of humor about himself which you don't see a lot of on capitol hill. we'll be right back. [ horn honks ] [ passenger ] airport, please. what airline? united. [ indian accent ] which airline, sir? [ passenger ] united. whoa taxi! [ british accent ] what airline, then? [ passenger ] united. all right. [ spanish ] what airline? [ passenger ] united. ♪ [ mandarin ] which airline? [ passenger ] united. [ arabic ] which airline? [ passenger ] united. [ italian ] where are we going? [ passenger ] united. [ male announcer ] more destinations than any other airline. [ thai ] which airline do you fly?

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on the other side who think that my policies are misguided. that's putting it mildly. >> on the left, van jones, on the right, s.e. cupp. in the crossfire. representative steven horseford, a democrat of nevada and representative luke messer, an indiana republican. a new start or more of the same? tonight on "crossfire." welcome to "crossfire" i am van jones on the left. >> i'm s.e. cupp on the right. in the crossfire tonight a pair of freshmen congressmen who have just got an crash course in how things get done here in washington. the president took an opportunity today not to bring two political parties together or to assure the country that he will get us back on course. instead, he took swipes at republicans, lectured us about how government should work, and of course criticized washington. >> we know that the american people's frustration with what goes on in this town has never

been higher. that's not a surprise. that the american people are completely fed up with washington. >> you know, van, the way the president always sniffs at washington dysfunction, you'd think he'd been living in duluth for the last six years. like he left for the weekend and came home and the kids had trashed the apartment. i mean, it really is sort of mind boggling. mr. president, this is your town. this is your congress. this is your mess! >> well, listen. no matter what this president does, you guys are going to knock him. when he doesn't go on television and tries to stay out of the way you tell him he's missing in action. when he goes on tv he's arrogant. no matter what this president does he gets beat up on. and i'm sure he's exasperated as are our guests. let us get you guys in here. representative steve horseford, a democrat from nevada and representative luke messer an

indianaen republicans. you both are freshmen. >> baptism by fire, right? >> crazy way to start. let me start with you. we're already off to the same kind of a thing. i hear from a lot of conservatives that this president, he never reaches out. he never tries to negotiate. he's just -- he's a dictator, he's a tyrant. let me throw some facts at you and you tell me why i'm wrong. i don't see it that way at all. this president has reached out. i remember when he got inaugurated. republicans met before the tea party, before he'd done anything and said we're going to block him on everything. not just the bad stuff everything. i remember mcconnell saying it's going to be a one-term presidency. i remember people yelling at him "you lie" on the congress floor. i remember with the stimulus bill, $300 billion in tax cuts. republicans voted against tax cuts to vote against him. health care bill, romney care, republicans voted against their

own principles on that. >> don't let him get away with all of that, congressman. >> time to respond. but here's my question. don't you think the president has done anything right? can the republicans take zero responsibility for the tome? >> oh, no. i think all parties have a responsibility for the tone here in washington. i think the president is the president of the whole country, not just the president of the democratic party. and when you have events like took place over the course of the last couple days, it doesn't help matters for him to try to do your job, van, or the job of other democratic commentators. he needs to bring folks together. you know, steve and i have worked together, gotten to know each other as freshmen. i think one of the mandates of our class is that folks expect us to come here and at least get along. there may be times on principle that we don't agree, but we ought to try to get along. here's the big thing, though, as i think some of the whining out of our party about his comments today, the reality is what he said today won't matter near as

much as what he does over the course of the coming weeks and months. >> oh, that's completely -- that is completely true. but congressman horseford, for as long as we've known him the president has been talking about trying to transcend politics, change the tone in washington. he said anytime 2008 and 2012. how was his speech today just focusing on the rhetoric, which could have been an opportunity to really transcend? how was the speech today a message, a scolding message to republicans, how is that real change? >> i don't see it the way you just said. it's not about scolding republicans as much as it was to thank our public servants who work hard every day to provide critical services to my constituents, to luke's constituents, throughout this country. they got beat up during this government shutdown. they got used as a punching bag. and the only reason that the government is open today is because senator reid, leader pelosi, the house democrats' unity and the resolve of the

president. if it were up to the republicans we would still be shut down. 800,000 people would still be on furlough. our economy would be suffering. >> mitch mcconnell gets no credit in your calculus? >> mitch mcconnell for doing his job, for agreeing to pass a funding bill and averting a default? >> he was just doing his job but the president transcended today by voting for more government function. >> i think it is much more product tentative focus on moving forward. we've got a budget to balance. but i can't let that pass. the reality is house republicans passed 13 different bills. i think one of two of them steven voted for. that would have kept areas of government open. the folks would have gotten paid. this was all used by -- as political leverage by the president and harry reid, to force the result that they got. listen, they won this phase of the debate. they did. because essentially the bill that passed last night is a bill that the president would have signed on september 30th. but we now need to move forward. and our nation's leader needs to

be a part of making that happen. helping that happen. >> congressman? >> nobody won from this first of all. the american people unfortunately who have been struggling are the ones who paid the biggest price. $24 billion of lost economic activity because of 16 days of a gop shutdown. it was unnecessary, it was reckless, it was irresponsible. it never should have happened. and i'm glad that we now have reopened the government, that we averted a crisis. s & p recorded record points today because we did our job yesterday. and it's the job that we need to keep doing. >> let me ask you a question. i mean, we did have 16 days it was pretty rough for everybody. certainly rough for the workers you just referenced, rough for republicans, rough for everybody. but last night you voted against opening the government. you voted against lifting the debt ceiling. if everybody had followed your leadership, sir, today we would be in economic catastrophe. how do you justify that vote?

and what do we think about from you going forward? how do you justify that vote? >> i voted no yesterday because it was a bad deal for the american people. the president got a blank check on the national debt into the middle -- the middle of next spring. the date is february but it could be pushed with extraordinary measures into march and april. >> you'd rather the government be shut down right now and in default right now? >> the president's had some great rhetoric in the last couple weeks. but lost if that rhetoric is this. that 27 times in the last 40 years budget spending reduction deals came in conjunction with the debt ceiling increase. presidents reagan, clinton, george herbert walker bush, even this president a few years ago. >> you have done a great job of making sure we're aware of that history. the history i'm concerned about is last night in your vote. would you be happy if right now we were in default? >> nobody wanted to be in default. but frankly the president didn't negotiate. now we're where we are. >> that's just not accurate,

luke. the president's budget is $238 billion less than the funding bill that we just approved that funds government through january. that was the budget that paul ryan himself proposed. had you guys just accepted that in july we would have been able to keep our government open, averting the default, and we could have been focusing on a jobs bill, passing immigration reform, moving our country forward. there's a lot of other things we could have been doing. the president and democrats met the republicans at their own budget number. but the republicans couldn't even take yes for an answer. >> this is what passes for negotiation now, this president and the democrats. they decide what thing we don't like we should take and then they decide something they don't like, too, and that's a compromise. that's not the way that real compromise works in real life. sure doesn't work that way in my marriage. probably not yours either. and what we need to do now is not focus on the last 12 days or 16, 17 days, and focus on what

we're going to do to avert the next shutdown. >> let me talk to you about that next thing coming up. because i'm going to admit, republicans lost on obama care. they didn't defund it, they didn't delay it, they barely got any changes made to it. but on the other thing that republicans wanted to accomplish, attaching spending cuts, defeicit reduction, entitlement reform. we now have two months to negotiate on the debt ceiling which is what republicans have wanted. and i promise you, congressman, republicans will get what they want at least in part attached to that debt ceiling deficit. so don't you think it's a little premature for democrats to be wagging their fingers at republicans and declaring victory? >> again i don't view this as a victory first of all. second of all, the debt ceiling is about past and current financial debt and obligations, not about future debt and obligations. if luke and the republicans want to negotiate about the budget going forward, then fine.

they should have passed a clean funding bill and averted a default. and instead of holding us hostage. you talked about negotiation. my wife doesn't negotiate with a gun to my head. she comes to me and says let's talk about something -- >> that kind of rhetoric is what's contributed to the problem here. it's not what happened. it's not a fair description of where we are. >> well listen, we're going to obviously keep this conversation going. we're just getting started. we still have to talk about what happens next. your point. when we get back i'm going to shock everybody. i'm talk going to talk about the ways that ted cruz is like dr. martin luther king and the ways that he's not. >> oh, wow. >> stay tuned. ♪

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welcome back. in the crossfire tonight we have democratic congressman steven horseford and republican congressman luke messer. now look, i'm going to shock everybody tonight. there is something about ted cruz that i actually admire. and there's something about him that really concerns me. he took bold action for something he believes in. every leader i admire has done

that, including dr. martin luther king jr., my personal hero. but here is the difference. and here's what really bothers me about ted cruz. senator cruz will not take personal responsibility for his own actions or for the consequences of his actions. he says, this is not my shutdown. this is obama's shutdown. now look. dr. king never called a rally or a march and then said, it is not my rally. this must be bull connor's rally. dr. king's tactics were controversial, they were provocative. but he owned them. ted cruz should have taken personal responsibility and said yes, i did this and here is why. don't blame other people for the shutdown, senator cruz. own it. and the fact that you won't makes me fear you're not going to be a great leader but a misleader. so with that i want to turn to you. you have been allied with senator cruz. i know you share a lot of the same views. but i know your dad. and i am very concerned that we're setting a bad example of the adults now whatever we believe not taking personal responsibility. are you concerned about that? >> i agree.

i mean, i agree that folks on both sides of the aisle need to take personal responsibility. we talked earlier about the president's comments today. by reality is the government shot goth shut down. that's not the way it's supposed to work and we need to find a way through it. i think the real test decision about the last two weeks is going to come next year as obama care rolls out. if obama care is a rousing success then the last two weeks are going to look a lot like they do today. if obama care is a big failure, it will look much different. >> can i ask you one quick question about this? i didn't get this clearly from you last time. we did have the shutdown. you did not vote to reopen the government. you had your reasons for that. but we're going to be in the same situation again. you've got a bunch of people saying different things. mccain, mcconnell saying never going to have a shutdown. cruz says might have a shutdown. where are you on another shutdown? >> i think we need to go to work today. i was glad to seat budget work leaders working.

the american people won't excuse another shutdown. we have got to work together all parties to make sure we find a compromise that keeps the government open. >> the congressman says we have to stop careening from crisis to crisis. but in my mind it seems like we're just careening from policy failure to policy failure. whether on immigration or gun control, syria, these budget messes, it doesn't seem like the president's managed to accomplish much. he is winning on politics. i give you that. absolutely. but what is the achievable policy that he's really planninged to sort of like batten down in his second term? >> look, this president has worked extremely hard, despite the obstructionism that has happened in the congress, to move our country forward. under this president in the last two years our economy has added more jobs every month consecutively month after month. he wants to pass comprehensive immigration reform and has put a very clear plan forward.

i'm proud to be sponsoring hr 15 which mirrors the policy that he wants to see implemented. but you know what, he needs a congress that will work with him and not against him. senator reid in the leadership in the senate is working with him, but unfortunately speaker boehner and a faction of republicans in the house have blocked him in every way. >> all this talk of republican obstructionism really makes it seem like obama and democrats see him as a victim. will that be his legacy, one of victimhood instead of leadership? >> no look. this is about helping our president succeed for the country. this is about america succeeding. i believe in a country that can still do great things as the president talks about. but we need a congress that will work with him to achieve that. and right now we have too many republicans who are about ideology, who are about an extremism, who aren't about doing their job on behalf of the american public. >> i think we got to improve our

tone a little bit here. but one of the lessons of events of the last few days is that it's very hard to move big public policy without public sentiment on your side. the president has more powers of persuasion than anyone in the world. more tool -- if he calls a press conference people will come. he said the other day that one of the coolest things about being president if you call anybody in the world, they call you back. but when the president decides to try to order people to do things instead of trying to persuade them to do things, he's going to have a small presidency. >> well, speaking of message, and we are now trying to move forward to figure out what we can expect going forward. there seems to be some mixed message or some confusion about what we should learn in your party. rush limbaugh had this to say today. i wanted you to hear this sound and then i want to read something to you. you give me your take on this. what should we take from this? rush limbaugh. >> i was trying to think earlier today if ever in my life i could

remember any major political party being so irrelevant. i have never seen it. i have never seen a major political party simply occupy place holders as the republican party is doing. >> so now that's him going after the establishment, after the mainstream of the party. and then at the same time, you have conservative activist grover norquist. he's blaming the opposite crowd. he says if you make a mistake as big as what they did, the ted cruz crowd, you owe your fellow senators and congressmen a big apology and your constituents because they did essentially nothing. now who is right? is grover norquist right? should you take his lessons or is rush limbaugh right? who's right? >> what i will tell you is this. now is not a time for finger pointing or punditry on finger

pointing at least for me. i will tell you this. i try to learn in life. i haven't lived a perfect life. i've made my mistakes. when things haven't worked out the way i wanted them to i've tried to learn. i can tell you, i have no regrets on our policy or principle here. but even myself as i look at it the last nine, ten months. i don't think my tone's been perfect everywhere we've gone. if you're going to work together as leaders you got to be able to talk to each other. so i think we've got to work through that. frankly i think the key to the future of the republican party is the focus on the things where we agree. we all agree that government ought to be smaller. we all agree taxes ought to be lower. none of us like obama care. we need to focus on those things instead of things that divide us. >> i could not agree more. this fetishizing of tactics and who's conservative enough and who's too conservative is killing us. but if you're not going to choose between rush limbaugh and grover norquist, and wise decision by the way, let me get you to weigh in on two other things. i think that what we've seen

over the past few weeks and months has been two camps interpretations of what happened in 2012. so to the ted cruz wing, they think, well, we lost because we weren't conservative enough. mitt romney lost, and i, ted cruz won. proof is in the pudding. then you have the paul ryan camp, i think, that says, i'm plenty conservative. i think we lost because our message was inartful and negative. and i think that's where you're seeing this diffvergence. i like to think i can see merit in both ted cruz and paul ryan. but it seems there's a dividing line. what's your take on that? >> again things didn't turn out like we'd like. it's the land of geniuses. everybody has an idea what we ought to do. here's what i think. nobody lit their hair on fire to stop the last 14 days.

virtually all these bills were passed because of the republican support and why. people trying to stop obama care and the people that elected us expected us to do everything we could to try to stop it. we did. we've done everything we can. it didn't happen. now as a party we need to focus on the rest of the things. >> are you worried we're going to cannibalize a little? >> we better not. >> here's my question. i think the question a lot of american people have, which is why is it that obama care had to be used to prevent our budget from being funded or to risk defaulting for the first time in u.s. history? >> again, steven, i reject the premise. the president may well have to delight individual mandate, anyway, if his web site doesn't work in just a few months. had he send that delay on september 30th we wouldn't be here. >> i serve on the oversight committee. they voted 40 some times now to defund or delay or obstruct the

implementation of affordable care act. not one hearing have we had on trying to make it work right. don't you have uninsured people in indiana like i have in nevada? >> yeah. >> 30% of my constituents in nevada are uninsured. they're children, they're mothers, they're veterans. all of them deserve a quality of health care. why is this such a burning issue for the republican party? >> i also have folks that have lost their health care. i have folks that are having their hours cut back because of the flawed 30-hour mandate. i have folks that are worried about their rates. >> why not work with those of us who want to make the bill better? >> the president has promised that when the government's open he's now going to negotiate. he's going to have several months here to prove he's willing to work to improve obama care. >> okay. well, both of you stay here. next we're going to ceasefire and see if there's anything you guys can agree on. we also want you to weigh in on today's fire back question at home. do you think president obama will be able to accomplish his agenda going forward? tweet us yes or no using

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we're back with our two freshmen congressmen. it's time to call a ceasefire. is there anything you two can agree on? congressman horseford start with you. >> i think luke and i both agree this shutdown was unnecessary and we need to avoid it happening again. both sides need to work together between now and january to avoid another shutdown from happening

ever again. because it caused way too much havoc. it was unnecessary. both of us came here to govern. we're former state legislators, and we're used to compromising. we understand that neither side is always going to get our way. but we've got to work together, open the lines of communications, and help. >> i do. one thing i agree on is we both overachieved in marriage. we both did. i know that. i met his wife. he's met mine. so beyond that, there's certainly policy challenges we face as a country. we need an economy that continues to improve. we've got to deal with spending. we've got big challenges in our immigration system that's broken. i think the biggest thing we agree on, though, in many ways washington is broken. this is a town that doesn't work. i mean, it's never been perfect here. the jokes about washington have gone on for hundreds of years. but we've got to be a place where people can at least talk to each other to find solutions. >> i just can't imagine myself in their position, though, coming in at a time like this. >> yes.

>> i mean, was this what you guys signed up for? was this what you thought it would be? public service in d.c.? >> i say we didn't get drafted, we put out yard signs for this job. >> we asked for it. >> i'll tell you what. one of the things that i've been surprised about, you and i may agree on this, i expected boehner to get obliterated throughout this whole thing. i think he's actually somehow managed to come out stronger than ever. do you agree with that? >> but he's smart. he really did. >> i hate it. >> he's got some tea party conservatives who wanted to oust him last year saying thanks for helping us out, speaker boehner. >> i think the speaker did a good job in tough circumstances. >> yep. >> he ultimately got to the right place. he could have got there a lot sooner. >> i want to thank both of you for being here. we've got to have you back. these young congress folks new ones are amazing to have. if you want to be a part of this conversation going forward go to facebook or twitter. you can weigh in on our fireback question. do you think president obama will be able to accomplish his agenda going forward? right now 44% of you say s,