is about 50 minutes. >> good morning. welcome to the atlantic council's front-page event -- will the united states again be the arsenal of democracy -- a conversation on lend lease for ukraine. i am pollock, on the board of directors for the atlantic council and also on the council of the brent scowcroft center on international security. the atlantic council's front-page series is our premier live ideas platform for global leaders, the perfect setting for today's event. we are so that all of you could join us. today, the atlantic council has the distinct honor of hosting u.s. senator ben cardin of maryland and senator john cornyn

of texas, leading voices in congress on lend-lease legislation for ukraine. both senators are two of the original cosponsors of the ukrainian democracy defense lend-lease act of 2022. that was the recently passed, -- that was recently passed unanimously by the senate. the bill harkens back to president franklin delano roosevelt's world war ii area -- world war ii area lend-lease policy that help the allies defeat nazi germany. if signed into law by president biden, the bill will allow the united states to send more quickly weapons and supplies to ukraine so it can better defend itself against russia. helping you create defeat putin is a smart way to defend our baltic nato allies from his revisionist objectives and blatant, brutal aggression, as we have witnessed.

gentlemen, thank you for your work on this crucial legislation and also, thank you for taking time to join us this morning. like many of you, i have been closely following russia's war in ukraine. when we talk about support for ukraine, i have to say it is becoming more and more obvious that speed matters. time is of the essence. after failing to take kyiv, russia is opening two fronts in eastern and southern ukraine. most analysts except -- expect these two battles to be brutal campaigns. moscow does maintain advantages in aircraft, tanks, artillery and rockets. to counter this, the u.s. must quickly get ukraine tanks, fighter jets and bombers come along-distance drones and ammunition. we have seen what they can do on the ground. getting ukraine weapons it needs

to defeat moscow's offense of is paramount to ukraine's efforts to defend its territory and safeguard european security. congress has correctly recognized that a successful defense of ukraine is in u.s. interest and has appropriated more than $14 billion for ukraine. support for ukraine has become a bipartisan issue on capitol hill, but the aid needs to be sent quickly underwrite efficiently if it is going to provide maximum benefits to the ukrainian cause. that is why the lent-lease act of 2022 that senators cardin and gordon champion -- cornyn champion is so important. this event is hosted by the eurasia center end the scope cropped center -- and the scow

croft center. i want to thank john and barry, the senior director of the center. thank you for your leadership and for your supporting ukraine in their fight. it is time for me to turn the floor over to our moderator, tom ward, a nonresident senior fellow at the center for strategy and security and also the director of forward defense practice, a dhs project which addresses threats to homeland security. tom has been the council's intellectual lead on lend-lease and is the perfect person to moderate. let me remind everyone that this event is public and is on the record. we encourage our audience on zoom to direct any questions to the senators using the q and a tab at the bottom of your

screen. we will be collecting questions throughout the event and tom will post them to the senators towards the end of the conversation. we encourage our online audience to join the conversation on twitter by following @ acscocroft and @aceurasia. tom, over to you and thank you, again, senators, for joining us. we are very privileged to have you both. tom: thank you, ambassador and welcome everyone to today's discussion -- will the united states again be the arsenal of democracy, a conversation on lend-lease for ukraine. it is my privilege to introduce senators john cornyn and ben cardin. senator cornyn has served in the

senate since 2002 and is in his fourth term. he is a member of the committees on finance, judiciary and intelligence, a native of san antonio and has served the people of texas for more than four decades. senator ben cardin is the senior senator from maryland. he has served in the senate since 2006. he is a member of committees on small business, environment and public works, finance and foreign relations. he is chair of the commission on security and cooperation in europe, known as the helsinki commission. a third-generation verlander, he has served the people of maryland in the house and senate for 35 years. as the ambassador just said, today's discussion is on the record. it is being recorded. and we will be taking questions from the audience using the q&a cab at the bottom of your screen.

let's start. senators, you were the lead sponsor and cosponsor of the ukraine democracy lend-lease act of 2022. yesterday's historic boat in the house sends the bill to the president's desk and re-creates one of the most important military assistance programs in history that helped lead directly to the defeat of the nazi regime in europe in the 1940's. let me address the first question to senator cornyn. what led you to introduce this bill for lend-lease for ukraine? sen. cornyn: in the senate and congress, it helps to have historical president -- precedent. looking toward lend-lease in world war ii and its decisive impact on the outcome of that work, it was important to send a message to the world that

americans -- democrats, republicans -- are united together in our support for the ukrainians' defense of it sovereignty and territory. it was important to send a message to vladimir putin and our allies in nato and europe that we are committed to working together hand in glove with them to support ukraine's defense. but the way to get things done in washington is to have a good dance partner. and i am honored to have been cardin, mike -- then -- ben cardin, my friend, help me lead the way. when it passed the senate, i asked the center, how do we get this through the house? and he said i will call my friend, house leader steny

hoyer. and that is that we get things done and i can't think senator cardin enough. tom: senator cardin, what will lend-lease do? sen. cardin: john, thank you, thank you to the atlantic council. the work you do is critically important. we need to have more discussions about what mr. putin is doing in russia, the impact not just on ukraine, but on the security of europe and the u.s. joe, we very much appreciate this opportunity. the topic today is about will the u.s. again be the arsenal for democracy? -- today is about, will the u.s. again be the arsenal for democracy? the lend-lease legislation that is not going on to the president will help us answer that

question by saying yes. thanks to the work of senator john cornyn, we have that legislation no available for the president sign it for us to be able to use it. it is a major step forward for the u.s. to be that arsenal of democracy. why? because it allows us to use our military equipment inventory to help ukraine. we can now make that available. the president can use the authority that he has under existing law and now under this act once he signs the bill, to streamline the process to make our military inventory availability ukraine. that is critically important. this legislation will allow us to timely provide necessary defense equipment for ukraine to defend itself against putin's aggression. and it shows u.s. leadership.

so, it is a clear message to our nato allies that they need to step up more as we look to how we can make sure ukraine is successful in this military operation mr. putin initiated. it is going to be a long campaign. this legislation gives us the capacity to provide long-term support to ukraine. but this is an easy decision. it is good versus evil. i congratulate senator cornyn for not only initiating the legislation, but also funding the strategy to get it passed. when you need to get legislation done, you need to work in a bipartisan way. support for ukraine is bipartisan in the u.s. congress. senator cornyn used the bipartisan support to get this cast in record time and now we can get critical equipment to ukraine in record time.

tom: what would you like to see president biden do with the authority your bail will give him? sen. cornyn: what has been so challenging about all this is that nobody knows how long it is going to last, least of all vladimir putin. he thought, i think, that he would walk into kyiv like the taliban walked into afghanistan. at that would accomplish his goals. boy, was he surprised. he was surprised by the grit of the ukrainian people and he was surprised by the charismatic leadership of president zelenskyy, who i think of as a modern-day reincarnation of winston churchill when it comes to rallying the people not only of his country, but around the world, for the cause of the ukrainians. senator cardin is right, the

president has existing authorities. but one of the problems is getting this equipment to the ukrainians fast enough. that is the message we have heard. and now that they have begun to flow, and i think the biden administration has done a good job, although we all wish it could have been done faster, getting these weapons to the iranians. -- to the ukrainians. it is not just cutting the red tape that is so important here, it is the message that it sends, one of bipartisan unity in support of our allies in ukraine , as well as our nato allies obviously, we all know know americans will fight in this war on ukrainian soil, but it is

really important to send vladimir putin the message that his tactics have backfired on him and rather than divide nato and europe, he has unified nato and europe as well as the rest of the freedom-loving world tom: the historic residents you mentioned that the out set -- the outset struck many of us as we were listening to that debate in the house. not many of us remember, many learned in history, the vote on lend-lease in the 1940's was 60-30 and the senate yet now, in 2022 on ukraine, thanks to your efforts in senator cardin's and others to vote for lend-lease for ukraine was unanimous in the house, and 470 -- unanimous in

the senate and 417-10 in the house. why do you think there is greater unity and support for ukraine? sen. cornyn: i am a big fan of andrew roberts' book on winston churchill. i think it is "walking with destiny." i happened to be listening to an audio version of that and the lend-lease, which are remembered but did not recall top of mind, was discussed, and its importance in throwing a lifeline to britain when they were hanging on a different. and without lend-lease, they would have fallen to the nazis. if it has happened once, it can happen again, and maybe we can adapt this historic program that saved britain and our allies in world war ii, to current circumstances with ukraine.

i wish i could claim the brilliance of an original idea, all i could do is come up with something that had been done before and could be adapted to current use. and i couldn't be happier about the way this has been dealt with in congress, and the message it sends, and the strong bipartisan support for the alliance, for ukraine and in opposing russian aggression. tom: senator cardin, what is your viewpoint on the importance of bipartisanship and the message it sends to ukrainians and vladimir putin? sen. cardin: well, we have to acknowledge that mr. putin has unified not just the u.s. congress and the u.s. public, but the global community. he pointed out by his unprovoked

attack, the manner in which he pursued the military campaign, violating every international commitment including all commitments under the helsinki act, committing war crimes. as for us to be able to see that in live coverage unified americans in the global community. that is one of the reasons why you saw the vote at 417-10 in the house and unanimous vote in the senate -- there is strong commitment to recognize that what is happening in ukraine will clearly spread to moldova and georgia, europe and the u.s. so, this is now the front line of defense for democratic states and i think bipartisan support in the u.s. senate recognizes that, on foreign policy issues, we are always stronger when we are united and we are united against mr. putin. and we recognize that what the

ukrainians are doing is our front-line defense to save democratic states in europe and around the world. speaker pelosi: senator -- tom: senator cornyn, how would you assess the military aid sent by the u.s. so far, and i would be -- i would it be expanded to some of the items the ukrainians have asked for so far, fighter-bombers? what direction would you like to see the kinds of assistance that is offered go under this bill? sen. cornyn: if i could summarize, i would say we need to do more, faster. and that is what this legislation authorizes the president to do. president biden should get a lot of kudos for where we are today, along with secretary austen and secretary blinken, the message

they sent the russia. but we did not know how long this was go to last. it could have been over in days or hours. but now that the ukrainians have shown determination to defend the country and demonstrated the failures of the russian strategy , and the weakness of not only their technology and weapons, but also there resolve -- also their resolve, using conscripts to go to ukraine and take over the country, i think we are in a much better place than we have been. and by demonstrating our willingness to provide whatever the ukrainians are trained to use and if they are not trained, we will provide that training along with the most advanced weapons we can, it would be foolish not to think about what president putin might do. you remember the issue of the

migs in poland and whether they would be transferred early on in the confusion around that, i'm glad to see the confusion lifted ended clear message sent by this legislation, and by what the administration is doing. the worst thing we could do is cause confusion or, by our own dear craddick incompetence, limit what the ukrainians can use. -- by our own in competence, limit what the ukrainians can do. putin can claim authority, but we have called his bluff and are in the process of providing everything the ukrainians can use, now that they have shown willingness to fight. tom: thank you. i remind everyone in our audience we will be taking questions from the q&a cab.

we have several that have come in and i will turn to those. senator cardin, the president proposed a supplemental of 33 billion dollars for ukraine including $20 billion of additional defense eight to run through the end of the current fiscal year, september 30, 2022. what do you think congress' reaction is going to be to the supplemental request for additional late for ukraine? speaker pelosi: i am in agreement with senator cornyn. democrats and republicans will do everything we can to make sure the ukrainians have what they need to defend themselves. it is a comprehensive strategy. it started with sanctions against mr. putin and his oligarchs as well as russia's economy for his unprovoked attack.

it is not just u.s. sanctions, but u.s. leadership with our traditional partners in the global community. we have provided humanitarian assistance for those impacted by this tragedy, including displaced individuals and refugees. we have provided that humanitarian aid and will continue to provide that humanitarian assistance. it is helping to accumulate evidence to pursue war crimes against perpetrators of these atrocities, and we are involved in that come as we should become a with the international community. and we will continue to do exactly that. and we will provide the necessary equipment for ukrainians to defend themselves. the priority now is for the air defense systems, because we know russia is using the air to attack the ukrainian people. it will also be antitank, because they are still using tanks in ukraine itself.

it will be conventional weapons and ammunition. all of that costs money and all of that needs to be funded so, the president made his request thursday, yesterday, with the amount you referred to, $20 billion for the military, over $30 billion totally. i know our committees will consider that and i am confident there will be strong, bipartisan support to provide necessary u.s. funds to meet these commitments. we want to make sure it is enough, we want to make sure it is in the right areas and want to make sure we send a clear message to our allies that they also need to step forward and help the ukrainian people. because literally, their democracy and sovereignty is at stake by what is happening. tom: senator cornyn, what is your sense about how the supplemental request will be received on capitol hill? sen. cornyn: i agree with

everything senator cardin just said. tom: couldn't be more clear. let me focus on what direction we think the conflict and u.s. support for ukraine's defense is going to go in the future. where do you think, senator cornyn, the u.s. should go next? where does this go from here? sen. cornyn: as the war has extended far beyond the time anybody thought it would, and let's emphasize mr. putin has to be the most surprised and disappointed of all given the current status of the conflict, unfortunately, time is probably on putin's side given the terrible attrition tactics russians are known for, the brutality, the war crimes

committed against innocent civilians, i am sure he will continue to do everything he can to destroy the cities in ukraine, particularly eastern ukraine, the don't boss -- don nbos area, and kill innocent civilians. he is a dangerous man. and they continue to raise the specter of nuclear weapons use, which would be a tragedy. but i think as the ukrainians continue to fight and as i have shown -- as they have shown the will to fight, this boils down to, will putin break there will? i don't think he will. as long as the ukrainians have the will to fight, we will continue to increase the flow of weapons needed. but i am concerned when i hear

about weapons that have been transferred not only from the u.s., but also our allies in nato, and stockpiles being depleted. mr. putin's stockpiles have to be depleted as well, and with some of the sanctions that are eliminating or making much harder the technology transfers russia needs in order to build its weapons, we have our own challenges with supply chains and stockpiles. but congress is going to do what it can, which is provide the funds both for humanitarian relief and military equipment. we will continue to do everything we can to urge the industrial base in the u.s. to ramp up efforts to make sure that not only we have what we need to defend against future threats, but that we continue to supply ukraine with what they

need and have been trained to use. tom: senator cardin, same question. where do you see the conflict going and where should the u.s. go next in our efforts to support the ukrainians in their defense against russian aggression? sen. cardin: tom, it is important question and i think we have to take direction from president zelenskyy. he is the person who is providing the extraordinary leadership in this fight against russia. as mr. zelenskyy said, is looking -- he is looking for a diplomatic end to this atrocity. but you can't believe one word putin said. he uses misinformation as allies as well as his arsenal to try and bring down, craddick states. so yes, we are hopeful there will be a way to end the military atrocity mr. putin is

causing. we want to make the cost as high as possible for mr. putin so that he needs to recognize it is in his interests to remove his troops from ukraine. that is why sections are so important. we have to double down and make those sanctions hurt even more. we cannot lose our resolve and mr. zelenskyy made that clear to us, and continue to go after those responsible. we have to make sure ukraine has all it needs to defend itself, so that russia knows that they are going to lose this campaign. we have to provide humanitarian aid to those directly impacted by these atrocities and yes, we have to provide defense capacity to other countries in the region that are at risk. i met yesterday with the president of georgia. believe me, georgia recognizes that if -- recognizes that ukraine is not the only

objective of mr. putin. he would like to take back the republics of the former soviet union as well as beyond that. we have to be concerned about georgia, moldova and the eastern front of nato. our nato allies feel very much threatened and saw the use of energy as a weapon against poland this week by mr. putin. we have to be prepared to help defending our allies and non-nato allies to make it clear we are in it for the long-term so that we can defend the micros in your -- defend democracy in your. tom: let me turn to a couple questions, i will ask senator cornyn. do use epi martina, a correspondent for a leading italian newspaper, asks what is the u.s. strategic goal? what should we be trying to

achieve strategically? what would you recommend to the president ought to be our strategic aim in this conflict? sen. cornyn: i remember president reagan being asked what the goal would be in the event of a contest between other nations of the u.s., and he said our strategy is, we win, they lose. in this case, the goal is for the ukrainians to be able to restore sovereignty to their country and to defend themselves against russian aggression. anything less is going to just encourage mr. putin. maybe he will take a bite, as he did in eastern ukraine in crimea in 2014. but because he did not see a stiff resistance either from ukraine or the rest of the free world, including other nations in europe, he thought he could

get away with it again. i mentioned the bad signal sent by our departure from afghanistan and the taliban walking in. i honestly believe mr. putin thought that might possible. we have to remember that he does not judge the risk and benefits of this as a normal person would. he called the fall of the soviet union one of the greatest geopolitical consequences in history, so he wants to restore the russian empire. and he will do it bit by bit, right by bite -- bite by bite, as long he is allowed to. the story is ukrainian sovereignty and i agree with senator cardin that this is not so much our call as it is

senator -- as it is president zelenskyy's call and the people of ukraine. we are there to support them, but it is ultimately their call. tom: that is the question from another audience member -- if this is going to be a negotiated peace, how do we stop it from being appeasement? and i think you said that this is president zelenskyy's call. at what stage do you at what stage do you think there will be serious diplomatic negotiations from the russian side that might lead to a negotiated peace? >> is that for me? as i said, vladimir putin is driven by ideology and he has to be embarrassed by the poor performance of the russian military and the fact that many of their weapons have not

operated as they thought they would and it has been largely ineffective. one of the most dangerous people in the world is somebody who is in a corner and doesn't have any way out. i am sure president zelenskyy is trying to think of how can we achieve our goals which is to restore ukrainian sovereignty while giving president putin perhaps some way out of this where he can save face. this is the reason why putin is so dangerous right now. although it is not part of their doctrine to use tactical nuclear weapons in a situation like this he does have them and they keep mentioning them. that would be a tragedy for everybody involved. it is a delicate matter, but it is going to have to be dealt with and i agree with what ben said that this looks like it

will continue for some time. >> senator cardin, one of our questions asked about the role of civil society and nongovernmental organizations in terms of providing aid to ukrainian refugees and other humanitarian assistance. as chairman of the helsinki commission i wonder if you could speak to what you have seen of the contributions of civil society to aiding the ukrainian people during this terrible tragedy of the war. >> one of the most frequent questions i get from organizations in our communities and from individuals is how can they help? we have such an interest among the american people in the global community to do things that they can do to be positive in regards to helping in the ukraine struggle. i agree with cornyn as to the outcome which is for ukraine to

maintain its sovereignty until russia has removed its troops. they need to rebuild, one part of president biden's message yesterday is to go after the oligarchs, those we individual will be sanctioned and use those resources to rebuild ukraine. it is also accountability. those responsible for war crimes need to be held accountable. our in geos and the private sector maintain the focus that at the end of the day it is about protecting ukraine's sovereignty, rebuilding ukraine and holding those responsible for the atrocities accountable. war crimes and financially. that is where we need the private-sector community to help us maintain that focus. it is not acceptable for russian troops to be removed, there must be accountability for what has happened and we

need your help in regards to humanitarian needs, the refugees, displaced individuals will need your help. there will be an geos in the private sector as we try to bring a successful end to this atrocity. >> let me take this to senator cornyn. senator cardin mentioned the private-sector. one of our questions gets into the technical issues of what arsenal of democracy is going to mean. it will mean ramping up production lines of javelin missiles. i saw a note where president biden headed to one of the factories in the south that makes those missiles in coming days. we are tracking the atlantic council, the problems the stinker little lines were shut down and may have to be started up again. for the private sector to respond, we will take investment, support financially

from the federal government, and congress, but this is what made the 1940s so successful. to the point where bombers were rolling off production lines 1 every hour. this is the measure of what the arsenal of democracy is. how do you think, senator cornyn, the u.s. congress will encourage private companies to ramp up these production lines that will be necessary to meet ukraine at defensive needs? >> first thing we need to do is pass the supplemental appropriation. i am glad to hear president biden is going to be making a trip to private-sector companies that are responsible for making these weapons and the ammunition and other things

ukrainians need to defend themselves but this raises another issue that has to do with supply chains. one of the things we are dealing with now, next week, we will be voting on a number of aspects of the so-called china bill where america competes but to me the most important part of that is to restore america's capacity to manufacture the most advanced semiconductors in the world. i am not a specialist in this area. i asked my staff can you give me a book called semiconductors for dummies or something that i can educate myself? i learned a lot about this. we make 0% of the advanced semiconductors in the world in the united states. this is a real threat to our

economy and security so one of the things we have done in the senate and working with the house, to provide additional incentives to help those most advanced semiconductors which run everything from our cell phone to the f 35 joint strike fighter have that capacity in those supply chains here. covid 19 exposed a lot of vulnerabilities whether it is with personal protective equipment or advanced semiconductors. we've got some work to do ourselves to play catch up, to meet those sort of counter production you talked about in world war ii. world war ii was a worldwide war. this at least so far we are hoping will be contained to just ukraine but it could easily spread and that depends on mr.

putin's decision but it also raises one other question i will mention briefly. we all recognize we are going to have to ramp up our national security capability to deal with challenges not only in russia and europe but also in asia. president xi is looking at all this and wondering what it means for his announced intentions to unify taiwan and the people's republic of china. we need not only the funding from congress to deal with it but a global strategy to deal with these challenges. it's not an isolated event. think about what is happening now in ukraine but important and dangerous things happening in iran and north korea and the threat of invasion of taiwan that would be enormously

disruptive economically and a threat from a security standpoint. this is a taste of what the future looks like. everybody from our industrial base to congress, to deter people like mr. putin or president xi, the ayatollahs in iran and kim jong un in north korea, this is one of the consequences president putin has wrought. we need to respond accordingly. >> thank you very much for your leadership on this issue, important and stirring words today. let me turn it to my colleague to deliver closing remarks but

i want to thank distinguish senators over to you. >> thank you for your strong remarks and important insights, to support democratic ukraine against russian aggression. this is our fight in this effort in national interests. it is not helping some other countries somewhere else to do their thing. it is about us too. i am the atlantic council senior vice president, i formerly served in the defense department as senior director for defense policy and strategy on the national security council staff for president bush and president obama. russia's war in ukraine is in an usher crucial phase, ukraine's victory in the battle of kyiv caused russia to refocus on feeding ukraine's

army in the east and military victory there, on the southern coast with further russian attacks. including kyiv about mulled over and our ally next door. this is really again a critical issue, and allies. it will play such a central role in this effort at such a critical time it will show congress, to put munitions and advanced weapons into ukraine faster and send a message to ukrainians that they can count on us for the long-term. it will strengthen in the negotiations for support, encourage other nato allies to do the same and send a message

to russia and china, in support of democratic nations on the globe. to president biden's desk, with $33 billion, on the military assistance through the end of this fiscal year. we have stocks of javelins getting low, stinkers which are critical for shooting down russian helicopters and aircraft that are out of production. we see if the us is ready to take the next step. into the arsenal of democracy. in the 1940s the united states out produced everyone in the world including world war ii adversaries, so this is a fantastic effort, we are lucky

to have the senators leading the way. to develop specific policy recommendations. with our allies always to contribute further to ukrainian self defense. this is a great discussion. have a great rest of your day. >> c-span has unfiltered coverage of the us response to russia's invasion of ukraine. the pentagon, the state department and congress. we also have international perspectives from the united nations and statements from foreign leaders all on the c-span networks, the c-span now free mobile apps and c-span.org/ukraine. our web resource page where you can watch the latest on demand. go to c-span.org/ukraine.

>> here's a look at live programming later today on c-span we start with the senate judiciary committee who looks at excessive fees for credit and debit card transactions. later homeland security secretary alejandra mayorkas testifies on the 2023 budget request for his department. on c-span2 the senate continues work on a bill to improve us competitiveness with china in producing semiconductor chips. during live coverage, with the free mobile video apps. >> funded by television companies and more including comcast. >> parting with a thousand community centers to create stud