>> washington journal continues. >> baseball returns to washington and across the nation this coming week. for the next hour, we are looking at the relationship between american residents and

based all over the years had joining us for this discussion is bill hopper. a sports attorney and a former announcer both washington senators and the baltimore orioles. good morning. >> we also had red foamer who is ace words and politics historian. good morning. >> i am so excited about our discussion today. let's get right into it. phil, you have been following the game of baseball in this town for many years. what is the start of new season. what does it mean to you, and what does it mean for the people of washington? >> we hope that the nationals will have a decent season. not necessarily a good season, but they are in the midst of rebuilding. we are delighted in the world series victory of 2019.

i myself have followed washington baseball since 1949. i remember the washington senators of 49. they won nine games in a row. in the early part of the season, they came back to washington to a parade. from union station to griffith stadium, they finished last that year. a terrible season. but we've grown used to those years. >> then, fred, baseball is a game of moments. we will show one of them on the screen, which is a picture of president franklin roosevelt tossing out the first test -- pih to open the 19 34 season. the senatoe pling the boston red sox. what is a photo like that during the great depression. what kind of meaning can it have for the country? >> it's about unification.

they've done nothing to do more than that. as part of the presidential opener, both parties would be there. the local parties took a little break, and there were others from both sides who were facing very excited about the nationals. >> the difference is that it used to be the opening game in washington. it is in the american league, and in cincinnati for the national league. the entire focus of the baseball world was on these two games.

ever since washington lost its franchise in 1971, we have had over mean games in baltimore and we have had opening games with specialness of the presidential appearance at the very first game. >> will be talking all hour about the president and baseball. we want to get out the phone line so the viewers can call in with their memories or their questions or their comments. if you are in the eastern or central time zone, the numbers are on your screen. you can also send us a text message.

include your name and where you live. we will get here calls in just a moment. fred, we've been talking about president roosevelt. the story of presidents in baseball, and you can jump in, it goes much further back than that it can you get us started, and we will let phil bring us in on the long history of u.s. history. >> we have a town ball in illinois. by the time of the election, baseball is such an important subject that it was the subject of political cartoons. all four candidates in the cartoon have a baseball bat, and it shows their political affiliation, and lin when -- link it is very quickly disappointed. -- lincoln is vanquishing his opponent.

>> isn't there a precursor to a small that even george washington played? >> they talk about throwing the coin across the potomac. he never really did that. i have not heard of any presidential involvement in -- before the election of lincoln that you showed on screen. >> he brought a book that is called baseball -- the president's. you say to the author's apron to viewers. >> paul nixon. >> it is by paul nixon. it is about the presidents game. it actually says here, george washington of washington, on

chapter one, page seven of washington, an american soldier says he throws or catches the ball for hours with his aid and probably working with rounders. the bridge game with eight precursor. >> there are a lot of books or stories about baseball is involved, and it evolved in part out of the british rounders. there have even been stories about how baseball goes back many centuries or something similar to baseball goes back many centuries, but i don't ink we have any indication that there is not any real involvement of that in the lincoln cartoons.

>> fred, over the years, why have there been such a close relationship between presidents and the sport? >> a lot of things state back to the first pitch position, and a started in 1910. but it is really two years later when a new manager came in name clark griffith. he was an owner of a team, and he saw a lucky opportunity. he said let's make this an annual tradition. that's what went baseballs and presidents. he became the owner of the team and became friends with every president through his lifetime. with chief justices, members of congress. he saw something tightknit between politics and baseball, especially the washington senators, d a lot of us clerked for h handbills, closely with him. >> prior to 19 37, when the washington redskins moved here

from boston, baseball was the only successful sport. >> and even after that, baseball was the only major team sport that mattered until the mid-50's and early 60's. there were three dominant sports in the 20th century, and they didn't have much competition. that was through the first half. >> we mentioned abraham lincoln. there is a myth that exists, and i give credit to this myth or bill stern, a former sports broadcaster. he created a lot of myths, but one of them was abraham lincoln, on his deathbed called abner doubleday, and one of the last words that lincoln said was, make sure baseball survives.

it's not true. but it's a great story. >> we talked about fdr, but the first pitch -- when and how did that pitch begin with the u.s. president. >> it began in 1890 seven. william mckinley was president. he was invited to the opening day and had about a hundred members of congress. william mckinley miss the opportunity to throw out the first pitch of the season. they went from mckinley to teddy roosevelt. he was never a baseball fan. from there, we went to william howa taft.

>> he was a senator manager who was lost h. he suggested that taft do this, but there was no sense then that there would be a situation. it was a one-off. it wasn't until years later that they made an annual tradition. had a fitting start to the morning. >> syrup been a number of myths mentioned about bill stern and abraham lincoln. william howard taft is the subject of another myth he invented the seventh-inning stretch. there is no truth to that. >> i was going to ask you that we at >> taft got up at the seventh inning, but there were instances, prior to that, in college baseball and even in some professional baseball.

harry wright of cincinnati led this in 1869. he wrote a letter, and i think that was held in the dixson book, and wrote a letter talking about the seventh-inning stretch. 1869. that was 41 years before william howard taft. >> let's get to some calls. i have some calls coming into remind you it if you're on the eastern or central time zone, the numbers on your screen. as we enter the week of opening day, our first caller is rick it he's in manchester missouri. what is your question or comment? >> there are two points, and

sorry if i got a little feedback there. x is coming from our studio. don't worry about that. >> first off, i was born and raised in new york, and i grew up in a boston spot. >> it references one famous thing. that is abner doubleday. >> i have family in cooperstown in the baseball hall of fame from the 1970's. just a glorious place. maybe one of your commentators could talk about any connection between any resident and the hall of fame, which is a place every hall of fame fan needs to visit at some point next i don't know. i've never heard of the president visiting cooperstown.

>> i haven't either. >> i haven't heard of that. >> i'm sure there is a section of verse down which is in fact devoted to the president and baseball. but, i have no recollection of any president having visited there. >> let's take another call. derek is calling from lakeland minnesota. >> good morning. good morning america. maybe you can talk about this. the player for the minnesota twins, he had a great story talking about how the senators from minnesota had the mets stadium, and when it was going to be ripped down and go to the metrodome, he called me and told me that it was going to be

charging money to store all of these documents, everything they got from the original purchase. a lot of those were presidential letters, and memorabilia from years ago read they're just going to throw everything away. the guy who was the curator, all the time in the world to take all of the memorabilia, and it was 15,000 different items. i just want to get your comment on that. >> i've never heard that story. i do know that in washington, when they tore down the stadium, it was the home of the senators for 60 some years. they could buy seeds for $10 a seat. along the rate course, there were three seats because in my

memories, i haven't heard any stories of the memorabilia being thrown away. i'm sure if they still have it, there's a helluva market or. x were getting some interesting calls. patrick from new york. you are a former senator. a former member of the team? >> hello? hello? >> we can hear you. ok. i'm not a former senator. i don't understand it >> i think i misread something. go ahead. >> my comment is on tv, can you hear me? >> they can. go ahead. >> when i was a kid, we went on

vacation to washington dc. pretty soon, it was 1965. it might've been 66. i was young. there were two home runs in one inning. >> ok. you are at the game. a senators game. >> i was at adc stadium with the washington senators in the minnesota twins. in the first inning, two home runs were thrown in the inning >> we appreciate you sharing your recollections. let me take another caller. jeffrey in marietta georgia, do you want to talk about president carter and baseball? >> yes. thank you for having me on. i lived in atlanta since i was seven years old. i want to ask about the relationship between jimmy carter and the atlanta braves.

i've seen many games, and i think he was a good friend. i was curious if you had any insights into that. >> i do not. carter was -- there was no baseball team in washington. the last team left town and 71, and that is a segway of richard nixon. it is a huge baseball fan, and he immediately had a meeting with the mayor, walter washington. i found this on a recorded tape, and he thought he could lure the white sox here. he predicted t by 1976, the other carter one, there would be a bicentennial. he was off by 28 years. >> we were also told that the senators would leave, and there was a -- when they were leaving,

and for the 71 season, there was an attempt by a number of locals to get nixon involved in trying to get a team to replace the senators. but apparently, the white house, according to some information we had, the white house refused to get involved. publicly, th said it is a shame in a tragedy that they wereng involved, but behind the scenes, he was trying to doomething. i don't think it was much beyond that meeting with the mayor of washington. >> do you consider nixon the greatest baseball fan among u.s. presidents? >> definitely. >> he probably has some competition from woodrow wilson. wilson went out to games after his stroke. the -- wilson would arrange for

the former presio go to griffith stadium. it would be limousines, they would be invited and through the stadium. entrance to the the limousine would be parked there during the entire game. the story goes that they washington coach, a famous baseball entertainer was delegated to protect the wilson limo against eddie fallible, so he was in the right field, and he said, he would sometimes embellish stories. he had long conversations with woodrow wilson. this is after he had suffered a

stroke. >> the best seat in the house. >> going back to president nixon, we have videos. this is from 1987, but at the time, the former president stopped by a new york mets post game program to talk about his love of baseball. the host was a former player. let's watch. >> when you are in the white house, did you get excited about this. >> yes. i did throughout the first ball. this is nixon life again, and our daughters did, and many times, we went to griffith stadium, and you have to be a baseball fan in washington. we used to go throughout the ball. eisenhower went on occasion, and i thought it was a great privilege to thrown out.

what i prefer to do is not go as a celebrity, but to get the cheers or boos or whatever. but i like to be in the stands. to be with people, like for example, like our friend here. i'm always invited stay here, but in the stands, you get to be in the game. you don't appreciate the fans sitting in the box. you have to sit in there with the fans. >> i think that it's interesting. just the history lesson because we always hear about president nixon resigning, and it's like, yes. he resigned, but he was attending baseball games. i think it is interesting to see that. you had a story wanted to tell. >> when i was a teenager, i worked for bob wolf who was a senator and play-by-play announcer, and he would do interviews before the game, and the interviews were typical of the washington fans, and you come out here often.

what do you do? i'm a government employee? plays in german, the vice president of united states, richard nixon, he interviewed them on the air it >> he attended a lot of games as well. >> high point out something? >> baseball celebrate the centennial of baseball. it was here in washington. they hosted a bunch of hall of famer's and all-stars at the white house, and it made a shocking admission, which is that i like the job i have now, but if i could do it again, i would be a sportswriter. >> a journalist. >> the all-star teams with the son-in-law got a which. in 1971, they said did you predict your all-time all-star team, and he said yes.

>> he went to camp david with his son-in-law. they spent several hours working for about a week. he spent all afternoon having one of the most enjoyable times he had, and he put together for all-star teams. >> the new york times columnist handed and said as it pains me to say this, i think richard nixon should stick to be president. the screen.n the shot we have on nixon was talking to a young fan, ands commissioner o baseball, but it

they moved to texas, leaving the city of washington without baseball for some 30 years. they ran for senator in minnesota. the number of washington baseball fans took out an ad in the minnesota -- many annapolis -- minneapolis star tribune, opposing him. he was not a favorite in washington. >> brian in michigan, what your comment? >> yes. i had my volume down rid >>

you're going to get some feedback. no problem. go ahead. >> ok. first pitches. we had some presidents with some great first pictures. they opened the season, and some were lousy. how many of them practice before they went out to make the first pitch? furthermore, have you ever heard of the late great bernie harwell, from the detroit tigers? he was the only announcer that was ever traded for as a ballplayer. that's how we got him. we trade a ballplayer for announcer, that's a great story. he was revered in the state of michigan. people respected him all over, especially al kaline. i was at the 1968 world series in baseball is the finest forever. >> you have any recollections

like that? >> i could jump ahead. with these world series pitches in 2001. >> set that up for us. in 2001, the world series game wasn't long after those 2001 seasons, but it wasn't long after 9/11. what else was the context of george bushes pitch, and you know about his preparation? >> that year, he told him, don't bounce it because you could get booed. he did practice, but he saw this as a way to unite the country. this is about one month after a 9/11 attack. it was at yankee stadium. he thought it was a way to be a unifier, and he reported, saying he had never had as much of an adrenaline rush as he did that evening. he took cheaters advice, and he

threw a strike. he had fans chanting usa. it was an emotional moment. >> let's look at that. >> please welcome the president of the united states.

>> no president has ever visited yankee stadium during the world series. this was the year. >> quite the reception for the president. what are your thoughts? >> wonderful. wonderful. when we heard all of those fans cheering, i did a little research about fans booing for the president. herbert hoover as the 30 --.

>> 31. >> at the 1931 world series. he throughout the first pitch. as he left the field, the fans booed him. they started to cheer the said we want to be here. >> i was going to say, wasn't about for more politics, but it is about neither. >> they were angry about not having beer. >> so it was about politics, little bit. >> it was. >> there was another booing in the early 50's. harry truman was at a ballgame and not in the first game, but he had just fired douglas macarthur. as he left the field, the fans -- macarthur was a great hero, locally. he had just made the old soldiersever die speech to

congress. truman appeared at the next ballgame and he was roundly booed by the fans. a much bigger boog, if you will was at the 19 -- 2019 world series when president trump appeared on the big screen. he didn't throughout the first ball, and he didn't sit in the stands, either, the fans recognized trump and booed him vigorously. >> i was thinking, the national opening day, they have a home game in washington on thursday. is there any chance the president biden might show up or do you think that she would likely be booed. things are so polarizing now. there will be universal reception for an american president and just about any city. >> he would get more cheers than

booze because he is in a liberal city. i don't know if he will do it. a couple of years ago there was talk that he was interested in doing and he might do in the future. we don't know. interestingly with trump, he talked about the opportunity to throw the first best -- pitch at the world series, but he didn't want to wear a vest that make them look heavy and he didn't like that. that was his answer. >> so, we will do a quick pivot and bring in another guest. our guest is going to keep us on the same topic with presidents and baseball. this is the white house historical association senior historian, matthew costello. he will continue this discussion. good morning. thank you for joining us. ask thank you. >> the white house historical association -- your website says it is one of the first baseball yields that was practically in the president's backyard.

you tell us more? >> yes. it becomes more popularized in the second half of the 19th century, and you can see the city lots popping up in washington where people are taking out and playing games. some of these are pickups or organize, but just south of the white house, there is the ellipse, and fire to the full creation of the national mall, this is where they had the white slot, where a serious baseball field was set up, and this is where local citizens would come play or employees. they offered an opportunity to get outside and exercise and escaped the drudgery of everyday office work in washington. it was a place where they would grab a seat in the 19th century. >> also on your website, you reveal to you think was really the biggest fan ever at 1600

pennsylvania avenue, and you say it wasn't a president. tell us who you think was the biggest baseball fan to occupy the white house. >> i don't know if she was the biggest fan, but she was the certain -- certainly theigst in the white house of calvin olge. grace coolidge was a diar washington baseball fan. obviously, her husband enjoyed baseball as well. there was a funny reported story of them are -- attending a game, and the president wanting to leave because of going into extra innings, and she was instructed to sit down they ended up losing an extra inning but graceould follow the games on the radio, and she would take notes and follow ong with a scorecard. she was a pretty enthusiastic baseball fan.

probably more than her husband. >> can you tell us more about the white house historic asked association, and what is on your side when it comes to presidents in baseball? >> we have a research collection of different types of research articles and the podcast about coolidge and baseball. they are the first to host the world series, winning baseball at the white house. that was at the 1924 washington senators, but they didn't post them until the following year. they're aiming to repeat, and it was a notable occasion.

it's not really aid fairly consistently practice tradition, and i would say it's not until 19 70, 1980, with ronald reagan, there is an invitation to all sorts of championship winning teams across different sports, and even college and professional, so it is a growing tradition in the second half of the 20th century. we know that coolidge is a baseball fan, especially misses coolidge. so it makes sense that it has its origins there. >> what is the overall white house historical association. >> it was founded in 1961. as a cooperating association park service. we are the nonprofit and nonpartisan partners to the white house.

we have research education and printing and publishing. it is more readily available for americans. we would teach about the history of the house. >> finally, your co-editor of a new book titled morning the president -- lost legacy in american culture. >> the book was an idea after the funeral of george h w bush. what we were witnessing in real time, a colleague of mine, with that, we wanted to take a historical look at the morning processes, and case a former president passed away at what is the immediate reaction, and over time, how does that change or how does the legacy change based

off of those morning periods. we put together 12 in the volume, spanning from the first president, george washington, up to george h w bush. we go through and we talk about the importance of family, political parties, race, culture, all these different things that impact how we remember residents and how presidents want to be remembered ask thank you so very much for joining us this morning. again, matthew costello, the white house historical association senior historian. he joined our conversation about presidents and baseball. thank you, again. >> go nationals. >> will come back with our guests. again, we have fred who is a sports and politics historian, and phil hopper who is a sports attorney and former announcer to

the washington senators, and the baltimore orioles >> let me jump in. i don't want to claim credit where it is not do, but i was the stadium announcer and not the point by way announcer. >> ok. >> what is the difference. what was your role as a stadium announcer? >> generally, i introduced the lineup, introduced pinch-hitter's in a special note that the fans were supposed to get. and also, for a number of years, i was the press box announcer. i announced just to the members of the press box. as we were listening to matthew, there is an interesting story about presidential autographed baseballs. walter johnson was a great

washington pitcher for over 20 years. he would get an autographed baseball from each of the presidents who attended the opening day. his son, after walter passed away, his son to all -- donated the balls to cooperstown. the grandson going to cooperstown, subsequently, asked to see the ball. but he saw was pictures because cooperstown admitted the balls had been stolen 10 years before that. autographed baseballs from taft, harding, and roosevelt. given to the hall of fame, no longer there. >> and is still an unsolved mystery. >> apparently at >> we've got some more calls coming in. steve from maryland. go ahead. >> thank you for taking my

calls. my senators adventure began in 1958. i went to my first game, and it was at griffith stadium. just let you know, my parents owned a grocery store in washington called the fairfield market. it was not far away from washington d.c. stadium. my father would take my friends and i to the game, drop us off, and pick us up after the game, and take us back to the store. they put us to work. we got a game and we got work. but, i can remember the 1958 game. that was when i was five years old. but i was at the all-star game where john kennedy throughout the first pitch, so i got to see that it and, i was at the last game against a new york yankee.

instead of staying home, i was in college. i was going for a test, but i went to the game with a couple of friends, and there were a lot of not nice posters about bob shorts at the game. but the game never ended. i think the top of the ninth inning, two outs left, and we stormed the field, and it never ended. one of my favorite moments was frank howard hitting a home run, he took his home and through it into the stands. i guess he was expressing his displeasure. >> those were some of my washington senator experiences. >> thank you. we appreciate your call. >> cannot talk about autographed baseballs? one thing i want to mention from my book is that the tradition

evolved over time where the resident, we saw the pictures bound, and the president back then, you see the pictures in the stand, but the photographers would have plans for both teams battling for the ball did they would get the ball and bring it over to get an autographed one time, president kenny from 1961, he would get the ball back. they signed it quickly, and it is a garbage autographed. i can't read this. keep going to south chicago and anyone believes they will sign this? do it again. he actually did. >> jungle jim rivera. expect to the phone lines in month emory alabama. mike. what are your thoughts or questions you want to share? >> great guests. growing up in the early 60's in

connecticut, my dad took me to yankee stadium a number of times. we went to a stadium, and it's in a second year or so, and at that time, the old-timers day, the baseball greats would play two innings. after the old-timer play. one of your guests will recognize the voice of god, bob sheppard, introduced joe dimaggio because he suited up that day, and he wore the famous number five, and he got up and drove one down. he hit hr. basically, the crowd went nuts. i heard about that, but i never saw him play.

the regular game started and my idol came up. he melted one in the right-center field area my dad said to me, mike, this is the time you are going to remember. you saw it to yankee greats. home runs in the same day. >> wow. >> i've got a joe dimaggio story. >> migrated through in the 40 some years that i did stadium announcing was during the old-timers game. it was in 1981. i literally had chills down my spine. literally. i introduced number five, joe dimaggio. it was a great thrill. the following day, i saw dimaggio at the ballpark i said to him, i've got to tell you

something. i have chills down my spine. he could have cared less. it was a disappointment. >> all right. let's take another call. buffalo new york. you are on. >> hello? great program. i've got a question. i recently saw a picture from a baseball game. i was wondering, do you see this program returning to inner cities. it's a great program. >> are you familiar with this program? >> i think ace paul is trying to expand. that is back into the inner cities. >> i think it is wonderful. >> little league world series

bringing new generations baseball fans. let's go to fred in vermont. >> hello. great program. i don't know but it's off-topic, but i want to give a quick story. i went to my first baseball game and it was unique read it was in the early 1970's. i family was visiting montreal. we happen to be staying at the same hotel that the expos stayed at. my mother was a good looking redhead. we got on the elevator, and like i said, we said the same hotel, we got on the elevator. downstairs, we were coming back upstairs, and we saw a rusty stop. and to other teammates. i was a big baseball fan and i knew who he was. i was a big mets fan and tigers

fan. i was a red sox fan. he started coming onto my mother. he was making passes at her, trying to pick her up, basically. he was telling her that she was a redhead, and he could show her a good time, and he pulled out two tickets and said you and your boy come watch me play. i'll hit one for you. >> my mom gave me the ticket, we went to the park to watch the first baseball game. >> my mother was good-looking and he wanted to go out with her. >> let's go to richard. he is in verona missouri. the morning. off the topic, i want to talk about pete rose. i'd like to see a full pardon for what was done, so you can get back into the hall of fame. he is one of the greatest

baseball players this country ever had. it is a shame that he can't have his seat where it belongs, and another thing, they went to kansas city. i was an apprentice carpenter. all the floors were in the dugout, and they have the same ball. that was the only relation. but thank you for taking the time. >> i don't think the president has anything to do with that. i tickets up to the baseball commissioner. or maybe the hall of fame. but the president has no role. >> he wants a pardon or that to get them into the hall of fame. maybe interpretation is a pardon of his crimes that are keeping him out of the hall of fame or wipe the slate clean. we are getting to the end of the show. there is so much we haven't been able to go over, but i want to ask you, franklin delano

roosevelt had an important contribution to the game in 1942. something called the greenlight letter to baseball. can you tell us what that is? >> after they entered world war ii, the baseball commissioner wrote a letter to fdr, and they said in 1942, should we continue to play? will do whatever you think is right. fdr wrote back the next day in a letter addressed. my dear judge, because given a former judge, baseball must continue. the people will be working long hours. they would need a little time for rest and relaxation. they pointed out and he emphasized that you agree with me that players who are of eligible age should be fighting. inserting the country, so what you had it was a very unusual. in world war ii baseball were a lot of layers were either too young, or in high school, and

the teammates before he came in or before, you had guys who were too old, guys who were half down, or maybe some people were missing limbs. one leg it. but sheppard, he was one like it, see of all these interesting layers. in two teams were always very bad. they had good teams because they were turned upside down, and felix brown is one of the pendant makers and the washington senators were already back by then. 1945. they were in the last pennant race. that was last in the season, so a very interesting time. by the way, fdr really hated him, so when he saw those letters, it was something they couldn't agree with each other, they shut it off. action world war i, baseball season, they were thinking baseball would have to be shut down. and johnson, the president of the american league had said, we are going to cancel the game after a certain ointment in

1918, and the games continue to be played. it was van johnson who didn't have quite the authority to do that read and, the season ended early. in part, the celebrate the end of world war one. >> we are getting to the end of the show. i know you are -- ready both nationals fans or are there other for the season? ask -- >> i am a cardinals fan. by right about the nationals much more. i love the nationals, and i love history their close to it, for the cardinals are my favorite team. xes and >> i'm a nationals fan. win or lose. >> you think -- i mean, i feel like i've been trying to pay attention, but i'm not the biggest fan. you think the nationals will have a good season this year? mark i hope so. back snow.

>> again, i want to thank both of you for joining us on this really on conversation. again, red rumor and the author of a book titled you've got to have a heart. it is a sports story, and phil hopper and he is the sports attorney. for the baltimore orioles read thank you for joining us. that will do it for us for washington journal. we

now. i am so pleased to introduce tonight's speakers. dr. clarence lusane is an author, activist, scholar and journalist. he is a professor there and former chairof