educated, what is to be, to be, to know, to know history. our history is we just have to allow ourselves the the comfort of knowing there is more of us than them. and as much as i sometimes get get, you know, tired of having word associated with me is great word. we have to have hope, because if we don't, then they win. so that's where we're going. we're going to fight back. i'm going to win. well, we're at time. i'm you like me. the more you hear kerry from cary clack, the more you want to hear you can do in part through buying the book. and kerry will be in just a few minutes over at the signing tent, and you can get the book at the nowhere bookshop tent. and thank you, so much for coming. thank you to c-span you to the

book festival. have a greatladies and gentlemeo our program. ten years to save the west. former prime minister liz truss on fighting the global left, please welcome heritage president dr. kevin roberts. thank you and thanks for joining us. person those of you who are joining online, welcome as well, it is such an honor. host any, head of state, former

head of state. it's a particular honor as you might imagine. if you remember the heritage foundation owns fondness and great friendship with lady thatcher to the woman we think walks in lady thatcher's and that is former prime minister liz truss has become one of my great friends. perhaps of my closest friends across the atlantic. and you're in for a real treat, having read ten years to save the west, this wonderful book that is being released in united states now, i can tell you that for those of us who, of course, remain about the american and british, but also understand in the short term, perhaps even the medium, that both our countries have real challenges this is a must read book and tell you a couple of reasons why of ms. truss and my great friend and colleague dr. gardiner will have a wonderful conversation about this. but from this adopted texans point of view, my greatest

frustration with washington and london is not, of course, the american or the british people, but the fact that where there is concern tration of power, it is always used as a cudgel. that power is always used as a cudgel against americans and individual brits. and this book is a diagnosis of how that came to be. what we need do to fix it, and really a call to arms, a call to political arms of what we need to do. and in short, just to give you little summary and obviously the former prime minister will be much more eloquent than i. it's all about sovereignty. it's all about returning that power from whatever institutions accrued that and have over centralized that authority back to the people. and i think those of you who maybe occasionally wake up a little about the present, we at heritage did so this morning,

but we're still undeterred. we will fight for another day five years from now, ten years from now, 50 years from now. we do so of the principles that not only liz writes in this book, but dare i say that has personified in her long service, not just to the british people, but very importantly to free people around the world. and so i'm going to welcome her here to the stage momentarily. but let me just say once again, ms. truss, not just on behalf of all of us at heritage, but on behalf of the entire states of america, thank you for service to freedom and sovereignty and to this very special friendship that our two countries hold. please join me in welcoming her. well, i'm delighted to be here. the heritage foundation for the

official united states launch of ten years to save the west and the heritage foundation now under the leadership of kevin roberts and my great to be here also with no gardiner features significantly in the book for the first time in 2015. when i seek to go to the heritage foundation, i'm warned against it by the british ambassador, kim darroch. he says to me, you've got to be wary of this organization. they've spoken out against obama. they've even been critical of prime minister cameron. are you really sure that you want to go and see them? and i said, yes, i am sure, because i'm a conservative and there are conservative think tank in the united states of america, our closest ally. so so eventually, eventually, i

prevail because i am a determined person. the call from the embassy dropped me off two blocks away from the heritage so that the british would be sitting outside the building. now, i was back in heritage in 2019 when, as the newly appointed trade secretary, i was determined that united kingdom was going to strike a trade, deal with the then president, donald trump and. i gave a speech at heritage and i said, the time is now quoting the old reagan campaign about the fact that needed to get on with this trade deal now that, of course, created massive consternation back home in the united kingdom because the apparatchik in number ten downing street did not want to do a trade deal with the united states, with president trump. and i outlined in my book the

fact that that deal would have happened. that deal would have happened if it wasn't for that resistance in. now why am i launching ten years to save the west in united states as well as in the united kingdom? well, i like to think of the united states of america as britain's greatest invention, albeit albeit slightly, an advantage invention. and you know, if you look at our history for macnicol carter to the bill of rights, to the american constitution that we have developed and perfected democracy. and if you look at what is going on in our societies. first of all, the brexit vote back in 2016 and then the election, president donald trump later year, you can see the same

desires of our for change and the same desires for those conservative values and sovereignty. and if you look at the battle for conservatism now and the frequency with which we get new prime ministers in, the united kingdom, and the frequency with which you get new speakers of the house here in the united states. we could see again that there is battle for the heart and soul conservatism on both sides of the atlantic. and i think battle is very important because let's be honest, we have not been winning against the global left. if you look at the history, the turn of the millennium, the left have had the upper hand. and it's not the old fashioned who used to argue about the means of production and economic. it's the new left who have insidious ideas that challenge

very way of life, whether it's about climate extremism that doesn't in economic growth, whether it's challenging the very idea of a man and a woman, a biological sex, whether it's about the human rights culture, that's embedded into so much of us, that makes also unable to deal with illegal immigration. those new ideas have been promulgated by the global left and they have been successful in infiltrating quite a large proportion of society and a large part of our institutions. let's just look at the state of economics. you you know, i'm a supply sider. i know that it works. we it work under reagan and thatcher. and yet we've seen the domination and of change in economics in recent years bloated size of government, huge

in both of our countries on the immigration and rights culture. look at what is going on now on american university campuses is what is not safe anymore to be jewish or the streets of london where a jewish man could not cross the road during yet appalling protest or the fact that we can't seem to deport illegal immigrants either your southern border or the small boats that are crossing the channel or take wukari another bad neo-marxist idea developed from -- and all those crazy postmodernists in the 1960s. the idea biological sex is not a reality. we now have president biden

introducing regulation plans around title nine, which mean that girls could see biological in their changing rooms, in their locker rooms, in their school restrooms, and not be able to do anything about it. and if they complain about it, they could be the ones guilty harassment. how on earth can that be happening in our or the climate extremists who aren't with just stopping coal fired power stations here in america. lng terminals are being built. fracking in the united kingdom but want to go further whether it's imposing electric or castles, heat pumps or extra taxes on the public meanwhile, our adversaries in china are building coal fired power stations. every week i see that is

economic disarm. ament in the middle of what is a various serious threat to the west, how is it ended up that after the turn of the millennium, despite the fact that we have many conservative intellectuals and politician, why have our institutions has so much of our public discourse shifted to the left? well, first of all, to conservatives have not been making argument. now i call them conservative in name only chinos. i know in america you call them, you call them rhinos. but these in name only, rather than taking these ludicrous ideas instead of tried to appease and meet them halfway halfway. why have they done this? well, first of all, they don't

want to look mean they don't want to look like they're against human rights. they don't want to look like they're against the they don't want to be mean to transgender people. so they've allowed those argument rights to affect the views of what is right and wrong. but it's also cynical than that. you know, if you want to get a good job after politics, you want to get into the corporate boardroom. there are a group acceptable views and opinions that you should hold and most of them are on that list. if you want to be popular and get invited to a lot of dinner parties in washington d.c. or london, the reviews on that list that you should hold and people have chosen dinner parties over principle. but the other i think we've missed on the conservative side

of the argument, and i put my hands up to this is the rising power of the administrative state, the fact that power which previously lay in the hands of democratically elected politicians like the more they can be voted out of office, is now in the hands of so-called independent bodies whether it's central whether it's government agents or whether it's the civil service themselves. and what we're seeing in bureaucracy in the united kingdom, i think here in the united states as well is a growing activist class of civil servants who have views on transgender ideology or climate or human rights, which they are keen to promote in their roles. i saw this hand and one of the key points book is about is my

battles i had with that institution or mindset and there's a phrase that we use in britain called consent and evade. quite often the officials will be very polite on the request, but it will take a very long time to do. if it's something like helping deport illegal immigrants or sort out the rwanda scheme, what if something that they like, like dealing with climate change that will be expedited and i think it's very difficult. people who haven't worked in government to understand just how cumbersome and how tricky like it has become. and i don't know if, that's a product of the modern era. if it's product of the online society, it is very, very now to deliver conservative policies. now, i did many jobs in, many different government departments. i was in the justice, the environment department, the education, the treasury.

i was in trade, i was in the foreign and i faced battles against activist lawyers, against environmental police, against left educationalists. but what i saw when i ran be prime minister in 2022 is i saw i had opportunity to change things because that was surely the apex of power. okay? i hadn't been able to change as environment secretary or trade secretary, but as prime minister, surely that was the opportunity me to be able to really change things. now there's a bit of a spoiler alert about book. it didn't quite work out. i ended up being the shortest serving british prime minister as a result of trying to take on these forces and the particular thing that i tried to take them on was the whole issue of our

economy. now, britain's economy has relatively for a long period of time. our taxes are a 70 year high. we are spending 45% of our gdp on the government. and what i wanted to do is i wanted to get our growth rates and start dealing with massive national debt by cutting taxes, by restraining public spending, and by getting on with supply side reforms like fracking. and we put this in a mini budget. little did i know that the night before that mini budget was announced, the house by the chancellor that the governor of the bank of england would announce that he was selling 40 pounds billion of government bonds. and not in raising interest rates by as much as the market expected. the second thing i didn't know

was that we had a tinderbox in the financial markets, liability driven investments, that the uk was uniquely exposed to and that were very to changes gilt rates and interest rates. and i go through the whole story in my book, but to cut a long story short, the governor of the bank of england and, the economic establishment in britain, successfully shifted the blame onto our economic policies, even though to this day i still believe they were the right policies and they would have resulted in higher growth in the united kingdom. they were able to shift the and furthermore the office of budget responsibility is a bit like a supercharged version of the congressional budget office leaked to the press that there was a 70 pounds billion hole in our plans. therefore putting fuel on the fire of what was already quite a

jittery market and at my heart, i'm a patriot. i couldn't sit there in number ten allowing things to melt down. i had to reverse the policies in order to create that stability and ultimately i had to stand down from my job and i a lot of questions from the press about. what was what was going on? what did i do wrong? i have not seen the governor of the bank of england or the officials in the economic establishment held to account. and i think we've got a big problem when a leader with a democratic mandate is not able to deliver a set of policies that would improve the country's and yet the unelected officials who effectively undermined that policy go unquestioned. it wasn't just british institutions that had a go my

policy it was the imf who didn't criticize it on financial reasons. they criticized on the grounds it was unfair. now, why is relevant to you? what elected politicians decide in britain a joe biden criticize my policy from an ice cream parlor oregon and. he you know, he said that is cutting the top of tax was wrong even though the top rate of tax in britain after my proposals was still higher than the top rate of tax in the states and i think the fact that these international bodies got involved in the pile on is very significant because i think this shows a resistance not just in the british economic

establishment but in the international economic establishment to these kind supply side policies that would actually make our economies dynamic and help in our fight against authoritarian regimes. so i come today with a warning to the united states of america. i fear the same forces will be coming for. president donald trump if wins the election this november, there is a huge resistance to pro-growth supply side policies that will deliver economic dynamism and help reduce debt. what the international institute ions and the economic establishment want to is they want to see higher taxes, higher spending, a more big government, a more they do not want to see that challenged. and we've already heard noises

from the congressional budget office and elements of the united market about. what the financial stability situation. say. what have i learned from my experience? what have i learned my time in? i have learned that we are facing a really quite challenging forces of the global, not just in terms of the virulent activists making extremist arguments, but also the power they hold in our institutions. and that leads me to believe that. what conservatives need is what i describe as a bigger bazooka. now, what do i mean by a bigger bazooka. well, first of all, i mean that we need really strong conservative infrastructure to be able to take on the left. you they are well-funded.

they activist. they have many friends in high and we need strength in depth in our political operation. that's why i'm working on a new political movement in the uk called popular conservatism, which is about bringing in more activists, more candidates, more potential legislators, more who can actually in the trenches against, the left in the ideological warfare that we now face. the second thing we need to do is we need to dismantle the administrative state and are lots of people i speak to who say it's just because know you ministers aren't tough enough. you know, if only you were a bit bold in taking on things, you know, if only you had a bit more political, you would be able to deliver. those people are not right until we actually change the system. we are not to be able to deliver

conservative such as the depths of resistance in our institutions and all bureaucracy that. we do have to change things first. and what does that mean? well, you're ahead of us in the united states in that the president gets to appoint 3000 people into the the the positions in britain. it's only 100 people. and those 100 people are junior. they're not in charge of department. so i believe we need to change that britain. we need to properly appoint senior in our bureaucracy. we also need to deal with the peripheral vision of bureaucratic bodies. they have to go. that has to be a real bonfire of the quangos. but even here in the united. policies like schedule f are going to be very, very important

in order to be able to deliver a conservative agenda. and the project that is sponsoring project 2025 is another vital. part of building that institutional infrastructure that can actually deliver conservative policies, having what i've seen on both of the atlantic, i think both of those things vital in order for conservative policy to deliver but we can't just deal with the administrative state at a national level. what we've also got is the global administrative state. we have the united nations, the world health organization, we have the cop process. and one of the things i tried to do was stop britain hosting cop in glasgow. i but i want to see us in future abandon that process. the best people to make decisions are people that a democrat typically elected in

sovereign nations. it is not people sitting on international bodies who would divorce from the concerns of the public. the final thing conservative need to do is appeasement and by ending appeasement. i'm talking about the appeasement of woke or ism at home as well as the appeasement of totalitarianism abroad. we have to do both of those things because both of those things are threatening our way of life. totalitarian regimes like china, russia and have to be stood to the only thing they understand is strength. and now the military aid budget has been passed through congress. the needs to be more clarity about russia can be defeated and how china and iran will also be

taken on and in order achieve that we are to need a change in personnel at the white house. now i worked in cabinet whilst donald trump was president and by while president biden was president and i assure you the world felt safer when donald was in office. 2024 is going to be a vital. and it's the reason that i wanted to bring my book now because getting a conservative back in the white house is critical to taking on the global. and i hate to think what life would be like with another four years of a placement of the woke left in the united states, as well as continued weakness on the international stage. but my final message is that

winning in 2025, winning in 2024, and into government in 2025 is not enough. it's not enough just to it's not enough just to have those conservative that there will huge resistance from administrative state and a left in politics is never been more extremist or more virulent. and that is why it will need all the resources of the american conservative movement think tanks like heritage and hopefully your allies in the united kingdom to succeed but you succeed because the free world needs you. thank you. why do you think. got to be that next year wasn't

a good morning everybody thank you very for joining us here at the heritage foundation. i'm nile gardiner, the director of the margaret thatcher center for freedom and, actually delighted to to host this here at heritage. i have to say, you'll book is is an absolute tremendous read. it's a very robust just a conservative book that really does stand up, i think, very forcefully to the left's nefarious agenda. it's also, i think, a very, very gutsy book. and a it's a book that is very courageous in so many respects, taking on the the ruling left wing establishment here in the united as well. and that's that's a very important thing. so i very much enjoyed reading the book. and yes i do plead guilty. i have to say, to be a critic of of the obama administration and also quite critical at the time of of prime minister david

cameron, a of fronts also. so thank you for the much of the book and i'd like to ask a few questions liz on especially on the current political debate here in the united states the outlook for the world superpower and also like to address some big picture foreign policy and national issues and like delve into the the current political situation in the uk as well. and things are looking somewhat challenging. it has to be said for the conservatives. and so i'd like to get your thoughts on on the latest developments, but we're kicking off with a discussion of the track of of joe biden. joe biden, as you noted, sharply criticized your tax policies while eating an ice cream and it

has to be said that his his i think was was unhelpful. it was an attack upon the policies of america's closest friend and ally but not unusual, of course, for a for joe for joe biden. he has a very controversial record when it comes to to dealing with the united kingdom. and your view is what does. the future hold if have four more years of the biden presidency in what does that mean for the world's superpower? what does it mean for american leadership on the world? what does it mean as well for the for the us-uk? a special relationship? well i believe that four more years of joe biden would have, first of all, a negative impact on the us internally. now we can what is happening in the streets of major cities in

the united states we can see what is happening with the promotion of left wing ideology. i talked about title nine and the appalling situation where girls use the locker room or the bathroom at school in privacy, there is the immigration and, the southern border. now we see still no solution to that no policies being pursued to with that. and i understand because we have the same on our border. you know with the english channel and the fact that we're getting these small boats in our problem in britain is to do with the legal system and the fact that supreme court judges have us being able to implement the rwanda policy in the united states. this is a political pursuit that could be sorted by the president

if he wish. so i think four more years of this would be a disaster for the us internally. i think biden biden omics has been a failure all. it's done is increase the debt and put you know, not made the american economy more competitive, which is what we all need to be. i mean, the british economy also needs to be more competitive as well. so i don't want to see that continue we should have those domestic policies, but also, i don't believe, says joe biden, and instead we've seen it cozying up. we've seen american corporations encouraged to seek more investment from china. i think that the wrong approach, i can't imagine during cold war when reagan out the ussr as the evil empire that type of approach being taken. so i think new a new approach is needed. and as for the special i mean,

the there will not be a us-uk trade deal. joe biden, that is absolutely clear and i know president trump wanted to do a trade deal. the problem lay in britain so we need to fix that side as well. to follow up on your your remarks there with regard to the the huge crisis on america's southern border it's become number one political issue. i think in the forthcoming presidential election and roughly think 10 million illegal migrants have crossed the united states at a staggering figures and. if you have the situation in europe would probably bring down the government such as the that the of outrage over the massive of legal migration. do you believe that under strong conservative leadership that this can be effectively

addressed here in the united states and in your view, why is joe biden so, so weak kneed in the face of this, in the face of this crisis? so, yes, yes, it can be addressed. and yes, it was addressed under donald trump. so absolutely it can be addressed. likewise, our problem in britain can be fixed if we deal with issues like. the european court of convention of human rights, if we deal with the human rights act in, britain. but why have these problems emerged in both of our countries? the answer is that the human rights lobby has not been taken on, and if you look at what's happened in the legal profession, you look at what's happened in in sort of i've talked about the dinner party circles earlier, but if you look at dinner parties, circles, people don't want to seem they would be accused of being racist they would be seen as being cruel to migrants.

and that has that emotive attitude has informed the policy rather than the morality and is the the are hugely out of touch with what the average voter thinks on these issues that that is what is on you've got an elite who are affected by it don't care don't have their being suppressed by high levels of migration and have a population that are very, very concerned about the issue. and in my constituency of norfolk is the one issue that comes up on the doorstep is immigration. and from what you've seen of donald trump and his record in the first term of it's administration, do you think that a second trump presidency effectively deal with the migration crisis here in the united states? do you see the potential a very

strong leadership in dealing with what is an immense challenge for for the us if us is not willing to deal with the massive levels of illegal migration, this will fundamentally undermine the united states for decades to come. so do you think that donald trump really has the leadership drive, determination to be able to effectively deal with the immigration crisis here? i do. i do think so. it is clearly a very difficult issue. and we now have our enemies actively using migration as a way of pursuing their threat. and so russia has used this with salaries into poland. yet we're seeing things like social media. i mean, it's easier to communicate. it's easier to run a people trafficking operation. but all of these things i mean, these things have to be solvable. they otherwise, if you cannot

control your borders how will you a sovereign nation. exactly. exactly. what would a a. second trump presidency mean for for the united kingdom and what are the implications for the special relationship, especially bearing in mind that joe biden been viewed by many in the uk as quite possibly the most anti british president of the all the modern era. what's your assessment of each of the impact of a second trump presidency on relations with, the united kingdom? i mean, the most important thing for me about the second trump presidency is getting conservative leadership. back in the world. the subtitle of my british edition is called the anti conservative if in the room because it's 80. britain that has a conservative government. we've got biden in, the us, we have trudeau in we have macron in france have schultz in

germany. and it's not working. the west is not winning. and so for me the the fact it's conservative leadership is absolutely important i think we are more likely to see a trade deal taking place. i think there will be more working with one of the things i advocate the book is an economic nato where together we take on china, we take russia by having common on what technology they should be able to invest or export or all of that in the same way as we did during during the cold war. so i would like, you know, i would like to see closer working with allies and of course, has been very critical of of the nato alliance and an unwillingness among some nato

allies invest what they need to do on defense and do you think that trump will shake up europe again potentially with with a second, second term and will will europe be be listening to to his message after all? these are incredibly dangerous times, with russia potentially threatening nato territory in the us too in the years to come? will will the european be waking up to to the reality and what would be impact of a of another trump to the europe needs to spend more on defense. there are still far too many european countries are even spending the 80% and the 80% is not enough. we should be raising it to at least 3%, in my view as a minimum. and there are too many countries free riding at the moment who are in serious threat. if putin succeeds in ukraine, he

won't stop there. he will move. he will move further and this is the ultimate short termism of europe has spent more and more money on our welfare states and less and less money relatively speaking, on things like defense and policing, which are very important for the security of our countries. and, you know, i think trump is right to. say to europe, you need to pay up. in a recent interview, he said, i 100% committed to nato but european countries need to pay up. that is right. i make the further point. of course that. if putin were to succeed in ukraine, that would send the most terrible message to china and president xi. so if we if these totalitarian regimes are successful, it will have huge, huge for the united

as well as for europe. yes, absolutely. and talking of totality, korean regimes, the enemies of the free world, the iranian regime, of course, poses a. deadly threat in the east, but also to europe as well and potentially the entire free world, it becomes a nuclear weapons power. israel responded recently to the iranian attack on israel. which 40 did not. the iranians not succeed in in any advance, any of strategic advantage there. the message coming from both london, washington and also many european capitals, one of restraint towards israel. the term use is the israeli response be should be limited. joe biden has been in many ways more critical of the netanyahu

government in israel than it has been of the iranian regime and which we view here at heritage is absolutely a disgraceful and at the same time the the british government has echoed a lot of the language that the biden administration has been using towards towards israel. what was your view of this what what does israel need to do in order to defend itself and to stand up to to the iranian regime and what does the west need to do in order to to to stand up to to iran and send a clear message that the free world will not accept the kind of barbarism that we're seeing right now from the world's biggest states of terror. one of this. one of the things i talk about in the book is i would often find foreign office trying to change the text, my speeches and i suspected it was confirmed

that it was after calls from the state department. so there's a certain amount of coordination between official in both the united kingdom, the united states. so it's no surprise the same message is emerging. the state taking the sanctions, iran, and hoping that iran would sign a nuclear deal was a mistake. and it's been left for too long without action against iran. and this is this is essentially appeasement. and what it's resulted in is further bloodshed in the middle east, most in israel. and i, i don't see how when israeli are still being held that people can expect israel to behave in any way apart from defending their national interest and i, i think it is a it's important that israeli

given the freedom that they need to they need to do what they need to do to protect nation and they are on the axis and dual threat. we know that iran would love to see the end of. yes. without any without any doubt. and we're dealing with a genocidal regime that is explicitly said that the goal is to wipe israel the map and we have to take those threats extremely seriously. but i think all of these cases and the same is true of putin in russia, we are not dealing with some rational actors that can be comparable, mobilized with or you can achieve a deal with these people want to it and our way of life in the west that's what we have to understand. and the only thing that will stop them, that is by us strength in the face of the absolutely. and it's your message today to. both the biden administration

and also to the british government that the western powers should completely consign the the iran nuclear deal the joint comprehensive of action jcpoa to history. yes. yes. i mean, i don't i don't think we should have tried to do it in the first place. i was very much under instructions. foreign secretary from boris johnson to to proceed it. but clearly the iranians had no intention signing it. yes. and also the other signatories were china and russia. right. which does not fill me with hope. yes. yeah, probably one of the one of the worst agreements put together in modern history, i would have thought and we were certainly supportive of president trump's decision to withdraw from the jcpoa, which viewed as a fundamentally dangerous act of appeasement towards towards iran and on the

the home front in the uk, you've seen large scale by pro-palestine indian groups. i frankly, many of these protesters have been even supportive of hamas. and you've seen numerous individuals supporting not only hamas but also an array of islamist terrorist organizations central. london has become become in the eyes of many as as de fact a no go zone actually for many jewish persons who feel afraid to go into london because of these these menacing, frequently violent protests. a great deal of criticism course of the metropolitan police handling of the protest. also a criticism of the way in which the government has has responded is not being tough

enough. after all, is a conservative government. it is it is seen by many in the as far too weak in terms of dealing with the protests. in fact, the french german governments have been significantly tougher in how they've addressed these these in some cases banning outright marches by pro-palestinian, pro-hamas groups. but the british government's approach been has been very, very light in encounter. what's your view on what needs to be done with with the situation on the ground there? after all, you do have an environment where many jewish britains feel afraid to walk the streets lot of the weekend during these these protests. and it's been appalling every saturday, these protests are dominating central london. and jewish people cannot work freely around central london. and that is that should not be

allowed. that should not be allowed. and we also had the scene where. there were messages being projected onto the house of commons. and i think the is not right the approach is not right to policing these protests and and you said that we are not as tough as the french or the germans the same is true on environmental protesters. well. and dealing just stop oil. i mean you're the easier to count the number days there isn't a protest going on in parliament square in london than the number of days and just want to sort of say people in this audience this in no way a reflection of the british public if i speak to constituents, they are 100% supportive of israel. they are not. it's a small minority of extreme left wing activists who are promoting this. it is not a reflection of the

general public of britain, but the tail is wagging the dog and it's back. the point i was making about institutions, i think what is the difference in britain and france and germany i think are institutions are less accountable than institutions are in. the countries i think i've talked about the very limited number of political appointments we get. i've talked about the number of there's 500 of these unelected bodies and so it is actually very difficult in the current circumstances the government to effectively change the policy and politicians never to admit they're impotent, to do something. but i think we have to look at the overall system and structure and say, how are we going to restore proper democratic accountability? these types of things keep happening. yes, yes and on the on uk front, we're likely to see a general

election later this year. it has to be held by january 25. but most likely election, say in november. the polls are pointing to the possibility of a of a labor victory, put very politely. yes, yes. these are, of course, immensely challenging times. and perhaps we could see, you know, rishi sunak writing memoirs at some stage in the near future. but whether you have a far more far, far more conservative and interesting say and, but on the election front in the uk, labor's been out of power for 14 years, they haven't outline much of an agenda as as i can like i can tell and it's hard to say keir starmer actually really stands for anything. and although he's very quick to

to take take the knee and to you know bow down and surrender to the to the work the work left and. this from your perspective, just how dangerous. potentially is a is a labor government actually for for britain and for british leadership in in the world. but you say we don't know what keir starmer stands for. i think we do know what he's done. but when i'm talking about the human rights culture, the developed in britain, things like the development of the human rights act, which blair put in the constitution, reformed i believe keir starmer was one of the people who was backing those changes. he he is a classic left wing liberal lawyer and a lot of the you said late labor have not been in power. well, might not have been in power in the government. yeah but they've been in power

in a lot of british institutions for the last, the last number of years. blair made these huge constitutional changes which outsourced decision making from democratically elected, actually gave more power to to a lot lawyers and bureaucrat, etc., etc. so i think we have more of that now, whether it's the extreme gender or gender ideology, whether it's the immigration and rights policies, extreme green policies know i can't see things like fracking happening under keir starmer or energy bills getting cheaper and the economy is in a serious situation we have got a debt problem in britain and although the labor party talks about economic

growth. they've got absolutely no analysis why we haven't had significant economic growth for the past few decades and. the answer is we're overtaxed, we're overregulated. the government's too big and we're still aligned with even though we've left it. these are the answers. but i can't see labor anything about any of those things. if they if they get into office. say we will just see the increase in an increase in the the sort of decline ism narrative in britain. yeah, it sounds actually ghastly actually. and it is. i mean, yeah, i want conservatives win in britain. i think the way we we can win is by laying out a conservative agenda and being honest about why we haven't delivered enough it in the last 14 years. that's what we have to do, we

have to say, yes, we should have dealt with the climate change act from tony blair, we should have dealt with the equality act which embedded all these woke policies, dual corporations, institution we put our hand up, but please don't vote for keir starmer. things will get a lot worse. that that's we've got to say and what would your message the prime minister today be that the uk should immediately withdraw from european convention on human. yes, yes, yes but. but that's not enough. yeah, it's not enough. and we should learn the lesson. what happened when we left the european, but kept all the european laws on our statute books? yeah. the problem is, we got rid of the bureaucracy in brussels. we didn't get rid the bureaucracy in britain. so yeah, it had a lot of our problems lie at home. yeah. and they lie with fact that we've outsourced to unelected

too much decision making and that is what we have to address. if you were still prime minister liz would there be any eu laws still the books in the uk the the the present administration has declined to remove vast numbers of them under your leadership. would you have completely put them the bonfire. well, yes. and i promise do that in a leadership election that i'm somebody who makes promises and seeks to fulfill them. i don't believe you can make promises in a leadership election, not deliver. that's why even, though i knew there were negative forces towards what i was seeking to do in in the mini-budget on corporation tax and fracking. i promise to do that and we should do that and it does require taking on quite a major bureaucratic forces to get rid of those eu laws.

institutions like the treasury they didn't like brexit in the first place, they wanted to keep as much of the eu regulations as possible and they have be challenged. is hope for the future of the conservative party. do you believe the party will return to thatcherite roots? are you optimistic about the long future of the conservative party, even though the the immediate term looks very looks very grim and sad? i think there are quite a lot of what we would call in the uk wets running around in key in positions. are you hopeful about the thatcherite who really are returning to take back control of? what has been the most successful political party in history? i think is possible, but i think we will have to fight for it.

it's not going to be easy and, you know, americans are very experience with brutal battle that go on within the republican party for the heart and soul of the party and that is we what what what is happening britain and the difference i would describe between people in the conservative party is that some people who explicitly say yes it's true these institutions in britain have moved to the left. yes it's true that they've adopted these extreme change policies locally. a human rights isms, etc. but we have accept that because as conservatives believe in institutions. i don't agree with that. i think we have to reshape our institutions to reflect values that the public want vote for. and i think that is that is a bold a bolder agenda that conservatives need to back. and i do believe that britain

will return to economic dynamism return to success until we do that i think it's just a question of how long we have to wait it very well and we just just a couple of minutes we're nearly out of time but liz, perhaps a final message for us. audience about about why why you believe that there is hope for for and and why you believe that the united really is the is the hope for the for the free world. so you the hope for the free world this this election place in 2024 is, i think, one of the most consequential election as we already have seen what is happening when is an absence of united leadership. and by that, i don't just mean

security in the world. i also. cultural and social leadership in the conservative world. and that is what we need to see. and my message is that you are going to have to fight for this. i think this is presidential campaign is a is a done deal at all. and they will the energy the commitment and the determination of to win. and it's not just about winning the election in 2024. it's actually about winning the administré mission in 2025. great. well, been a tremendous discussion. thank you. thank you very much. and and your book is a it's a wonderful read. and i think it has a very powerful message for for the united states and a very powerful message for also for

the uk as well both sides of the of the atlantic and most grateful to les for joining us and we have come to the end of our program unfortunately were unable to do the books on due to supply chain issues. your books been incredibly popular actually it's already sold in the uk and it's being re published i think second, third, third time and we you did not get the the the copies in time due to the intense competition for them and but it is a it's a it's a thrilling read it's a tremendous a tremendous book. and i hope that all of you will be able to read this this this wonderful message to to the american and the british people. and this were most grateful to you for for joining us today. we look forward to hopefully see you again soon here in. the united states, we wish you all the best as well with your very important work on the

ground in the united kingdom at this time. your efforts to save the conservative movement in uk. it's a very, very worthy cause and a big thank you to everybody for joining us here in person and and online. i would like to ask the the audience they could remain in the seats while, well, the former prime minister. exits the stage. but but very big warm thank you to everybody for joining us today. thank