meaning, always carefully follow our updated forecasts on the espresso channel, information about the weather, i will say goodbye to you until tomorrow at 18:15, then the verdict by serhii rudenko, stay with us, it will be interesting, good evening, we are from ukraine. glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program, my name is serhiy rudenko, i congratulate everyone and wish everyone good health. for the next two hours , we will talk about ukraine, the world, the war and our victory, today in the program. bill of the year. the verkhovna rada is considering the text of the law on mobilization in the second reading why was demobilization and

rotation excluded from... win-win cooperation. in beijing, lavrov discusses the dual opposition to western countries. how can the us respond to china for supporting russia in the war with ukraine? the number one target for putin. the kremlin hopes to hang the terrorist attack in krokus on the head of the sbu maluk. why is biden and the burisman company here? about this and about other things in the following. hours we talk with our guests, people's deputy of ukraine mykola knyazhytskyi, executive director of the institute of world politics yevhen magda and diplomat oleksandr khara. the second part of our program, which will start in an hour, will feature political scientists olekse akyan and viktor boberenko. however, before we start our big conversation, let's watch a video of how fighters of the 79th separate airborne assault brigade repelled another russian assault nearby. mykhailivka - 18

units of military equipment in three days. ukrainian soldiers managed to destroy three tanks and hit one more. eight armored combat vehicles were burned, seven more were disabled. let's see how it all happened. glory to the armed forces of ukraine, glory to the heroes.

friends, during our broadcast we are conducting a survey, we are asking you today whether you support mass mobilization in ukraine. yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube, if you have your own opinion, please leave it in the comments below this video. if you 're watching us on tv, or in or on air on other platforms, pick up your phone or smartphone and vote if you support the masses. mobilization in ukraine 0800-211-381, no 0800-211-382. all calls to these numbers are free, call, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote. today, the verkhovna rada of ukraine began consideration of the draft law on mobilization in the second reading, more than 400 amendments, rather meticulous and extensive work should take place in it. in the hall, it is expected that

this work will be completed by tomorrow and tomorrow the verkhovna rada of ukraine can adopt, it is predicted, it can adopt the law on mobilization already in its final version, there are a lot of questions regarding individual norms that do not remain in the law, and a lot of questions regarding those amendments that were introduced by people's deputies of ukraine between the first. and the second reading, and accordingly, uh, the majority of people's deputies of ukraine ask the question that all the amendments that were introduced, that were proposed by them, were voted on, however, judging by the number of people who are now in the session hall the verkhovna rada of ukraine, er, does not have enough votes to pass any amendments, political circles say that... the main amendments that were passed

by the national security committee defense and intelligence, will be voted on as early as tomorrow, and most of the amendments, simply because they did not gain the support of the floor, will simply be ignored. today, the people's deputies of ukraine invited the top military leadership of ukraine to speak in the session hall of the verkhovna rada regarding the draft law, and the relevant decision was supported by 315 people's deputies during the session of the parliament, and from the podium of the council, the commander-in-chief of the armed forces oleksandr was called to express his opinion on this law. rasyrskyi, chief of the general staff anatoliy bargilevich and the head of the united forces yuriy sodal. at the same time , the parliamentarians failed to vote on the invitation of prime minister denys shmyhal and defense minister rustam umerov, as there were not enough votes. obviously, we will hear the comments and opinion of our leaders

of the ukrainian army, already during the final adoption of the decision, that is, tomorrow, and... tomorrow there will be some specific comments regarding the very content of the draft law or the already adopted law. people's deputy of ukraine solomiya bobrovska noted in veter espresso that responsibility for the mobilization process lies with the government and the prime minister, and yesterday she explained how the cabinet ignores its direct responsibilities and does not participate in the discussion of these. about the amendments and the content of those amendments that were proposed to the law on mobilization, let's listen to what solemiya bobrovska said, and i would like to remind you that in fact, in addition to the supreme commander-in-chief,

the government itself is responsible for mobilization in our country, and primarily prime minister, and i would very much like to the prime minister would come, in particular, to the committee or to the heads of the factions and explain how the whole body, the collective... of ministers should decide the issue regarding the entire mobilization, because mobilization is not only about entering the army, enlistment, training , form, mobilization of people and pcc, this is in particular the ministry of health, which takes care of this issue of health care, this is the ministry of vet, this is the ministry of security, this is the economy, this is finance, this is simply this is a mass of all directions, which today even were not grouped among themselves, a people's deputy should be in touch with us mykola knyazhytskyi of ukraine, member of the committee of the supreme... council on humanitarian and information policy. mr. mykola, good evening, thank you for joining our broadcast. good evening, thank you for your request. first of all, please tell me what is happening in the parliament with the law on mobilization, because there is information that the amendments

are being voted on, there are not enough deputies in the session hall, and the main amendments will be voted on only tomorrow, april 11. this is not entirely true, because it is obvious if the majority does not want to to vote for the amendments, it does not come to the hall and therefore there are not enough votes, because we have a monomajority, all of this text, it was actually approved somewhere either in the cabinet of ministers or in the office of the president, because there was a whole series of points that were initially approved by the committee, for example, the fact that those servicemen who served 36 months are dismissed from military service, i will discuss... but the 48-month option, as a compromise, there were some other norms, such as an increase in the salary of servicemen, and those who the first line is located, and for those who are in the rear, but one for 10 thousand, one for 70,000. this norm was also in the draft law, then it disappeared from

it, but it is already alleged, as i understand it, that the state leadership approved everything that there there are, and the servants do not want to participate in the voting of the amendments, that is why they do not go to the hall and that is why... when the opposition announces them, and some representatives of the servants who came directly from the hall, there are simply not enough votes for it, its procedure is as follows , which will be amended, they are allegedly not approved, but it is clear that they are cannot be approved because the majority did not come to the hall, and then it will be necessary to vote on the bill as a whole, and it must become a law. yesterday it became known that the provisions on demobilization and rotation of servicemen were excluded from the draft law, and today the spokesman of... the ministry of defense dmytro lazudkiv explained that they decided to transfer the provisions on demobilization to a separate draft law at the request of the general staff in order not to adopt, as he says, populist decisions against the background of existing threats and risks at the front. she appeared later information that the bill on

demobilization will be developed within eight months. is this fair for those currently in the armed forces. well, see what the problem is here. we really don't have enough people, and the military is afraid that if there is demobilization, after 36 months, and we remember that in the first days, the most people left. volunteers and those who were conscripted, in principle, no one will fight, but people want to know some limits, whether it is for life, or for some time, and when they started discussing these 36 months, the authorities themselves proposed and introduced this item, and then they changed their mind, and then they took this item away, and already the military, who are in the army, they hoped that it would happen, and then the authorities themselves canceled it, said, we did not think, we are taking a risk , we may not have enough people, and of course... in relation to military personnel, this is a bit rude and disrespectful, by the way, in relation to those

new persons who will be mobilized, because we should somehow encourage people, so that they want to mobilize, and when you are taken away by force and there are many repressive ones methods in the law and it is not known how many, many people naturally have a question and do not have a great desire to serve, which is very bad, because for us it is vitally important, your colleague in the parliament, andriy osachuk, people's deputy of ukraine from the voice, says about the fact that it looks like about 80 percent of the proposed amendments to the mobilization legislation could have been approved a long time ago without the involvement of the verkhovna rada, do you agree with this opinion? well, look, first of all, the mobilization in our country is going on now, the law is being introduced changes to the current legislation in order for its mechanism to work. obviously, well... you see, when the government wants to ban travel there , or women, for example,

who are deputies of local councils, they do it without any laws, they simply follow the government's order. obviously, everything in this law could be solved by government order, no questions asked. and if it is to be done by law, then the president, as the supreme commander, should come to the hall and say about it, but they understand that it will not be popular among part of the population. and that is why they distance themselves from it, turn to the verkhovna rada, so that those who are dissatisfied with this situation criticize the verkhovna rada, and not the president and the government, that is, they, although the verkhovna rada is also them, because the majority is theirs, it is the majority in the verkhovna rada, which will vote for it, these are, in principle, people who were brought there by president volodymyr zelensky, as well as the government that they all elected, it is all the same government, but people's minds, it is formed somewhat differently, and all this it's a shame, because mobilization is really necessary, firstly , it is... ongoing, secondly, it is necessary, well , but we see that no one is going

to mobilize these military pensioners there, the sdf has full armor, as well as the police there, as well as many others organs, well , at least some of them could leave, and there are as many of them as the army in our country, instead we want to call up graduate students there, people want justice, and there is a very difficult balance here, on the one hand, we need to protect the country and there are not enough people, from the second, this law is simply unfair, and it's... such a very difficult choice, a very difficult situation. mr. mykola, you mentioned the reservation and the fact that some of the conscript men are now under the reservation, the day before yesterday , everyone was quite actively discussing the decision that the employees of the tv channels, which include the single telethon, representatives of circus organizations, there are some cultural organizations, do you understand... by what criteria does this generally happen, determining who is significant for the economy, for

the critical infrastructure of ukraine, and who is not, does it still require additional clarification and explanation in order for the justice you are talking about to still exist in ukrainian society during mobilization? well, first of all, it's just that everyone started talking about it yesterday, but nothing new has happened, minister. and departments and enterprises reserve up to 50% of military servicemen, and the mass media have had the right to do so for a long time, they just reserve 5% for some, and 50 for others, and some do not look at the percentages at all, and here, of course, there is a problem. i am today announced an amendment to defer military service to the artistic staff of national groups, there are 1,500 of these people across the country, and when petlyura once was, the košice choir was generously directed. on tour in europe and the united states of america, in order for them to promote ukraine, collect funds for

the ukrainian army, support the ukrainian army, but there are not many of them, in our country now, unfortunately, the government refuses to somehow protect, well, in fact, ukrainian geniuses, but they could bring a lot of benefit to ukraine, and they will not affect, because 1,500 people are not something that will change the situation at the front. instead, they did not listen to this amendment of mine, and the representatives of some mass media, which, to put it mildly, are not engaged in art, but in propaganda, but they have such an opportunity, it is of course, of course unfair, by the way, about propaganda and about the role of the media, including in the coverage of the verkhovna rada of ukraine, surprisingly, but two smartphones and honcharenko's streams during the consideration of the law on mobilization do much more than an entire tv channel rada, which is included in the pool of the united telethon, that is, does it make sense to spend budget funds on something where a people's deputy can simply show ukrainians much

more than the large staff of the rada tv channel. well, it’s just that the deputy wants to show, and the tv channel rada wants to show the opinion of the representatives of the authorities, not what happens in the parliament, they have different wishes, and everyone implements them, and goncharenko implements them , receiving only his salary, and the tv channel rada, receiving these millions and the billions that go to a single telethon for propaganda, obviously, from this point of view, goncharenko is more productive for society than the tv channel rada, i will not argue with that, and these species. money, it would really be better to spend it on drones, and our faction constantly talks about it, because it is also just a direct violation of justice and common sense logic, people should see this discussion, because now people will again start to wonder why one person voted like that , one yes, despite this law, they do not understand and do not understand, you understand, if we sent this law for a repeated second reading and

they called up half of the law enforcement officers who wipe their pants in kyiv, and we see that they follow journalists, start raiding mass media, but they should be called into the army, not graduate students or young people there, although, of course, the army does not have to be a punishment, the army is supposed to be a voluntary thing like that, and the fact that the president does not introduce this bill, does not take responsibility, does not explain to the people, the fact that the bill does not actually encourage recruiting in any way, this is all very bad, because we cannot drive people to the front with arson, because the efficiency of such... people will not be high, the efficiency is much higher if they are people who consciously go to defend the homeland, understand that it is honorable, understand that the state will be about them take care, and the state cannot do without them, but for this we need to talk to these people as partners, and not as slaves, as our ukrainian authorities are used to. well, a very short question at the very end about the tv channel dom-2, which is going

to be created in ukraine, what kind of tv channel it is and whether is there money for it and does it make any sense. oh, well, this is another nonsense, as i understand it, or tools to steal money from the authorities, at first they created one house supposedly for the occupied territories, but then it became not for the occupied territories, but for the whole country, budgets are allocated there, representatives of pro-government structures , former showmen from the well-known comedy quarter, let's say, work there, and it has nothing to do with the occupied territories... just like with the de-occupied ones, while the russians , unfortunately, publish mass newspapers there, work through this telegram of theirs en masse, they created a television platform that broadcasts both russian central channels, and newly created regional television channels, and films, and all this for free, they install tuners for free, that is, this is such a propagandist work, very harmful for ukraine, ukraine,

which should be effective, fulfills the whims of petty officials who think how to make money from it, and not how it really is. to bring the ukrainian word to the occupied territories. house two is from the same series, we created house one, then changed our minds, let's create it dom2, let's change our minds and build a holding for ourselves at state expense. well, it looks ugly. thank you, mr. mykola, it was mykola knyazhytskyi, people's deputy of ukraine. friends, we work live on the tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms. today, during our broadcast, we ask you about the following: do you support mass mobilization in ukraine? yes, no, on youtube. everything is quite simple, either yes or no, if you have any opinion of your own, please write in the comments below this video, it is important for us to know your opinion, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote if you support mass mobilization in ukraine (0800-211-381), no 0800-211 382, ​​all calls

to these numbers are free, we are in touch yevhen magda, executive director of the institute of world politics, mr. yevhen, i congratulate you, thank you for being with us today, good evening, mr. serhiy, glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, today is quite a busy day in the verkhovna rada, the consideration of the great mobilization law begins , which has to put an end to the process, the main process that is now in ukraine, the process of mobilization, obviously this adoption of this law and these... norms of this law will affect not only society, every family in the present time, but also in the future , because from the mobilization, from the one who will gradually fall under the mobilization. who will get into the war, and under what conditions and to what extent the future of ukraine will depend. zelenskyi spoke about the fact that this mobilization,

and about this mobilization , western partners constantly tell him about the need to adopt such a law, when you will deal with this mobilization there. or, in your opinion, could our western partners nominate? does ukraine have any conditions regarding the fact that ukraine should mobilize people more, that this law should be passed as mandatory, that zelensky should also be responsible for the fact that mobilization and the mobilization law should work in ukraine? i don't think that such demands sounded directly, but i am aware of how the political system works in general, that is, in order to... we can talk about something, demand something from our partners, we need to demonstrate that we have something to brag about, we have something to show

our partners. for more than 770 days of the large-scale russian invasion, the verkhovna rada has not turned into, you know, the kind of assembly line that... issues the laws ukraine needs in wartime, sometimes ahead of schedule, and the fate of the mobilization law in this case is very telling. i wouldn't want to comment on his rules before they've been finalized, but i think the disappointment with him will be significant enough in society, but the problem is that under it... you will have to live and work and carry out mobilization, so to a certain extent it can be said that a bad

mobilization law is better than its complete absence, that is, the absence of its updates. and , to be honest, i don't quite understand the logic of why they actually broke up the issue of mobilization and demobilization at the last moment? i understand that the experienced military journalist dmytro lazutkin, who speaks as the press secretary of the ministry of defense about the need for another 8 months for the development of the bill on demobilization, he already voices his own position, just a matter of communication of the conduct of the war from the moment. all the commotion surrounding the resignation of the veteran, well, i'm afraid i'm wrong, but a good four, maybe five months, and this is in the conditions

of war, it's a huge period, it's just put somewhere on the margins, that is, there is an opinion that it's not worth talking about, there is an opinion that these are not topics that... can be touched, for which the quality of the president can be tied to, and accordingly this creates a problem, after all, the president is the commander-in-chief, i have not heard words from the biggest critics of zelenskyi that let him grab the machine guns in his hands, run somewhere to the front, although there was no such thing anywhere, but neither did the president, the minister of defense. and the commander-in-chief of the armed forces, they must constantly communicate with citizens, hyphen

voters, hyphen potential, mobilized, that is, we either say that we need to create a wartime economy, create enough militaries. state, you just immediately say that you are showing the footage the first days of a large-scale invasion, yes, yes, the situation is somewhat different now, and accordingly, we have to create a system that works in the interests of the state, we all have one ukrainian state, and it should not be in it. there must be some political priorities, some political games, in question. in my opinion, it is very

important to show transparency and uniformity, because if there is mobilization, conditionally for the poor and avoidance for the wealthy, we will create a serious social problem within the state, absolutely exactly and... many did not want it, and there are many questions regarding the process itself , the last time, the process of law-making and decision-making, it is not only about this law on mobilization, because there were decisions that those with limited suitability will be taken away , will be suitable, unsuitable, in what way it will all be happen when people, well, according to the decision of the military medical commissions, were

recognized as such that... they cannot be moved to the category of fit, because they were only fit for that, then the question of reservation criteria, who falls under these e the criteria for who does not get in, that is , there are a lot of questions, and you rightly said that there was not enough communication and there is no such communication, but in this situation i understand that i am the leader of this. the supreme commander-in-chief of the armed forces, the president of ukraine, volodymyr zelenskyy, should be in charge of the process, do i understand you correctly? well, of course, it's logical, the mobilization is announced by the president, it's a rule of law, it's not a fiction, and when we see the process, er, well, how could i say it more correctly, moving

the arrows along when they try to understand and to show that anyone is involved in this process , deputies, the minister of defense, the commander-in-chief of the armed forces, but not the supreme commander-in-chief, it looks ridiculous, because in the conditions of war there is an objective strengthening of authoritarian tendencies, this is what i can say as a political scientist, that's why. .. that the need to make decisions, it becomes more intense, and many things that seemed normal yesterday, they are a little strange today, for me it is strange that there are more than 400 rules of the mobilization bill for the second reading, so this means ... that

the body of deputies, in which the coalition created by the servant of the people faction still exists, or the monomajority created by the servant of the people faction, is playing hot potato, shifting responsibility, shifting this bill from one hand to the other, let's go, let's go, let's go, and maybe we can decide something, the military will correct me. experts, but judging by the timing, we currently have problems with replenishing the ranks of the armed forces and receiving new servicemen, the long-term decision to reduce the mobilization age from 27 up to 25 years. and now the lengthy consideration

of the bill on mobilization, they will, unfortunately, objectively not contribute to the strengthening of ukraine's defense capability. well, we are waiting for the actual decision to be made tomorrow, as they say, it will obviously be april 11. let's see if the parliament will still vote, because there are committee and committee amendments. amendments, i understand, will be supported, all the other 400 amendments are now being voted on, but they are not getting the required number of votes, let's talk about the signal that has been sent, which is important enough, eloquent, in my opinion, from the united states of america, from the secretary of defense of the united states of america, lloyd austin, who warned kyiv against attacks on the oil refining industry of russia, he says that

the attacks of... ukraine on oil refineries.