♪ yamiche: the war entering a new phase and why a top republican planned to tell then president trump to resign. >> we are probably facing our last days, if not hours. yamiche: the remaining you cranians in mariupol refuse to surrender as president putin claims victory in the southern city and test as new, long-range nuclear-capable missile. meanwhile, president biden ramps up weapons a to ukraine. plus -- >> it would be my recommendation you should resign. yamiche: shocking new audio reveals what house majority leader mccarthy planned to tell then president tru after the planned attack. >> it is essential that the c.d.c. protect the traveling

public. yamiche: and the justice department apiles to have the federal mask mandate reinstated. next. announcer: this is "washington week." corporate rad funding is provided by -- consumer cellular. additional funding is provided by ku and patricia yuen through the yuen foundation. sandra and carl delay-magnuson, rose hirschel and andy shreeves, robert and susan rosenbaum, the corporation for publi broadcast, and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. announcer: once again away, moderator yamiche alcindor. yamiche: good evening and welcome to "washington week." the russian invasion of ukraine is entering its thi month and on thursday, russian president

putin claimed victory over the southern city of mariupol but ukraine officials are pushing back, saying their forces in the city are refusing to back down and this week, president zelenskyy said this -- >> the russian army in this war is where i can itself into world history forever as the most barbaric and inhuman army in the world. yamiche: images of mass graves surfacing out of mariupol echoing the atrocities. meanwhile, fighting in the eastern donbas region is intensifying. president biden also announced an additional $800 million to help ukraine's military. >> we're? a critical window now of time where they're going to set the stage for the next phase of this war and the united states and our allies and partners are moving as fast as possible to continue to provide ukraine the forces they need -- the weapons

they need, excuse me, the equipment they need. yamiche: he announced a new program that will allow americans to contribute to resettle ukrainians in the u.s. with me is dan balz. laura barron-lopez, white house correspondent for politico and david sanger white house and national security correspondent for "the new york times." thank you all for being here, dan, how significant is the news out of mariupol this week given the overall direction of the war? dan: well, i think it's very significant. for a variety of reasons but primarily because it does indicate in a sense the desperation -- of the ukrainian military, which has fought from the beginning of this war and the crushing reality of a russian army which has not performed wellut nonetheless

continues to put the squeeze on the you koranians and what they have done in mariupol and the destruction of that city is symbolic of what this war has looked like and where it may be heading. it's moving into a phase that could be more favorable to the russian army simply because of the terrain and the resources they have and the fact that the ukrainian military will be farther from its supply lines. it comes at a very difficult time and the atrocities we've seen that you noted in theop of this program continue to be wrenching for the world and the question is how much help can the united states and other allies provide and how quickly can they get it there? yamiche: i'm going to get to that last question about aid but first, david, what do we know about who's really in control of mar a familiar and why does president putin think he's

winning this war? david: for mariupol, it's clear the russians have most of the stiff. there's a group held out in a steel plant but they're not in a position to push the russians out. if mariupol hasn't fallen now, it seems likely that it will. the really fascinating thing is, of course, putin has retreated from his larger objective of taking the entire country and taking it, he'd homed, within 30 days. of course, he's well past that. he's now retreated back to the original on thive of the east and the south and i think that's why you heard president biden make the case that these next few weeks are critical for the nature of the war. this part of the war is going to look nothing like what you saw in and around kyiv. this is broad, open spaces. as one of my colleagues put it, it's more like fighting in kansas than in new york and that

means that it does play, as dan suggested, to the russian advantage, but it also means that the if the has to get big artillery out that has a chance to really punch the russians back in place and if he can do that -- if they can make that work, then the russians would have been through two big setbacks and, of course, as you said, american intelligence thinks that fruiten believes he's winning this war and they have to convince him otherwise. yamiche: and laura, dan teed up this question i want to ask you about, how much the white house thinks they can continue to give support and aid to ukraine given that they added an additional $800 million but david is talking about the big artillery. connt those two ideas. laura: basically the white house has tried to, over this period of time, give what it is hearing, that nateo allies as well as zelenskyy is saying that

he needs. they try to very much listen to ukraine about when do you need supplies and when do you not? of course, this is going the -- to be a conversation with congress but the white house says that time and time again they're trying to supply, whether it's the artillery or whether it's other supplies at the ready as soon as they can. yamiche: yeah, and david, i want to come back to you. you were talking about the ft that the next four weeks is going to be critical and that in some ways the white house feels like neck make inroads here. talk about that. david: it's all a question of how quickly they can get this equipment to the ukrainians and whether they're trained in using it. we've seen ukrainians taken out of the ukraine to some degree, to poland, to britain, to be trained on how to use some nato weaponry that they haven't seen before.

if the rush, can't make good progress here, they are a partly broken force at this point. they are putting back together these combat battalion groups and in doing so, they're putting together shoalings who haven't fought with each other. they're still getting a lot of questions at home about what happened to the him that the ukrainians managed to bring d down, and that ship, the ssians made the argument today they lost only one sailor and there were a number missing. we think it was probably significantly worse that be that so president putin knows that the word is going to get around in russia that these casualties that the russians have taken are much worse than he's let on. yamiche: so interesting given the fact that we saw russia test a nuclear-capable missile this week. there was also a veiled threat,

of course, from president putin and the pentagon, the united states is saying that they knew about this test. they were notified in time but still, what do you make of the timing of 24 test given all that's going on? dan: i think the timing is an effort on the part of president putin to remind people that however badly his army has performed in ukraine that they were still a nuclear powered nation. one of the handful around the world and he has rattled sabers on this from the beginning. and we know that people are worried about whether the russians might use tactical nuclear weapons on the battlefield and i think this missile test was simply a way of saying do not forget about how mighty we are event at a time when you think we're not as strong as he had intended to be. i think it was mostly symbolic. i think in any other moment they

would not have had or needed to do this. maybe it had been a long-planetted test but in the middle of the war this was nothing more than saying don't forget about how strong we actually can be. yamiche: it's afternoon interesting point to think about, the reminder that all of this is involving nuclear powers. i want to turn to a somewhat different subject to you, laura. about this new program that president biden announced, saying that people in the united states can responsible ukrainians now to help them resettle here in the united states. how does that program relate to the other asylum programs that we see for otherrism grant and what are you hearing? laura: it was a really big deal when the president decided about a month ago that they would be taking in 100,000 ukraineians and this program that was announced this week was how they were going to ex pi diet that process, which is the humanitarian parole program.

something they? used for afghannies that were also coming in. it makes it so that a u.s. american has tsponsor people that are coming in and they have to go through background checks but a lot of refugee resettlement organizations have told me they home this happens very quickly, that it gets off the ground faster. part of this is the biden administration's effort to rebuild the ref jive program, which was gutted by the prior administration. some frustration from the same organizations is they feel as what about other populations that have been trying to get into the united states? whether it's cameroonians but people from the central triangle. they feel there's not equity there and there is frustration that ukraineians are being

favored machine than others fleeing very dangerous homes. yamiche: -- yamiche: i've heard that are from haiti activists. david, i want to come to you for another topic, may 9. russia and victory day. what's the significance of that date but also what do u.s. intelligence sources expect in the coming weeks? david: may 9th is the anniversary of when the soviet union prevailed over nazi germany. and so there's a lot of pressure on the russian troops before this big celebration, which always comes with a show of military might and parades and, you know, putin will be out speaking and so forth. there's a really big effort underway to show that tre was some form of victory in ukraine, to have something to claim. now, whether that is the east,

the south, seems unlikely right now that they're going to be able to grab the port city of odessa. we did hear a mid-level russian defense official today say that the new objectives included trying to grab part of moldova, another non-nato state that's got territory that the russians have long coveted. it's not clear that putin will actually make much progress between now and they 9. it is certainly clear inside the pentagon that they want to make sure he doesn't. yamiche: certainly a date we'll be watching and continue to rely on you to explain to our viewers. we now have to turn to the surprising developments surrounding the capitol attack. so many are talking about this story. new audio octobered by the authors of a soon to be released book, in the days before the

riot, house speaker mccarthy sucked asking president trump to resign. >> i think this will pass and it would be my recommendation you should resign. this woulded be my take but i don't think would take it but i don't know. >> and i've been very clear to the president, he bears responsibilities for his words and actions, no if's, and's or but's. i asked him personally today, does he feel responsibility for what happened? does he feel bad for what happened? he told me he does have some responsibility for what happened and he needed to acknowledge that. yamiche: very striking. before the release of that audio you heard, mccarthy called reporting by "the new york times" journalists totally false. dan, you're the politics, you're a veteran political reporter. i wonder what you make of what's

going on here, especially when your paper, the "washington post" is reporting that trump and mccarthy talked and that trump isn't mad for now. i have to say for now because that's what that president's emotions seem to often be like so how much trouble is mccarthy really in right now? dan: i think that remains to be seen but i think this was a terrible moment for him, to come out as he did on thursday and deny in the way he did, what "the new york times" was reporting and this is from the book that jonathan martin and alex burns will publish in early may, that denial was so strong that when the audio was played last night on msnbc, it completely undid him and i think it revealed him for what many people have criticize across -- criticized him for many, many months. one, that 's been politically

weak, hypocritical and a third, that his desire to be the next speaker if the republicans win the midterm elections in november, have prompted him to do almost everything imaginable to be subservient to former president trump and i think it was doubly revealing that after having denied and then been revealed to have been lying about the denile that he then reached out to president trump as opposed to acknowledging, ok, yes, i did say this but i never actually made the call or some way to kind of worm his way out of it. but clearly his concern is that trump will turn on him and if trump turns on him, then the house conference might turn on him and his dream of being speaker if they win in november would go up in smoke. yamiche: dan, that's why we have you on this show.

it's summaries like that that makes me want to talk to you every friday night. laura, the words dan just used, undid. revealed. i wonder what you think about the other part of this audio is former president trump acknowledging he has some responsibility for the capitol attack. how much weight does that have given that trump is in charge of the.com essentially and he's continuing to lie about the 2020 election. he hasn't changed his tone at all. laura: what's so striking about this rue and everything we're hearing from the january 6 committee. jonathan martin from the "new york times" said that's -- there's going to be more times. but there appears to be no red line, whether it's a moral or a constitutional red line for republicans when it comes to trump, which is that trump is saying he bore some responsibility for january 6 to mccarthy. we also -- those same reporters from the "new york times" said

that mcconnell agreed that trump should be impeached and potentially considered voting to convict him in the senate. mccarthy thought that he should maybe resign and yesterday, despite all of that and despite the fact he they found his conduct unbecoming to be president. they still say they woul support him in he runs in 2024 and that they would -- he would have their support in running the country. yamiche: david, potentially weigh in here. this is the story we were all talking about last night. david: what a washington moment. first of all, if you have more than two people in a rom in washington, assume that there's a tame and microphone some place. second thing is, i know it sounds like a really easy thing to do, particularly for many of

pro-trump republicans to say, oh, that was in the "new york times" or the "washington post" or you name it. it's got to be wrong. let's set aside for a moment that jonathan and alex, both colleagues of mine, are two of the finest political reporters in washington and if they report it you can pretty well take it to the ban but then to have in this case, the revelation of the tape moments after the denial, i mean, really tells you how the city works it and makes you wonder what mccarthy thought he was doing. why he thought he could get away with this. make in the long run he will. maybe no one will remember this come november and december when we're talking about who's going to be running the house. yamiche: dan, will there be a political price to pay for mccarthy here? when you think about the g.o.p.

and especially in that party, not a lot of people have paid prices when it comes to false information and, of course, president trump, who's playing party boss and handing out endorsements, he has not obviously been truthful so is there a price to pay for mccarthy here? dan: i think there's a price to pay and he's been paying it in the greater world, in the eyes of history, if you will. kevin mccarthy's reputation has sunk over the last 18 months or more because of the way he has behaved vis-a-vis former president trump. whether there will be a price to be paid on what he really cares about rice -- remains to be seen. i think to some or a large extent, that's in the hands of president trump and programs some others in the republican conference but those who'll have gone against president trump have paid a price within the

party and exhibit a of that is congresswoman liz chaney, who was on that same call that was -- where mccar think made these statements and who is the vials chair of the january 6 house committee and who's been driven out of the leadership of the republicans in the house and might well be defeated in november in her bid for re-election. that's the sort of internal politics of house republicans and in that sense kevin makar they -- mccarthy may not pay any price. yamiche: striking when you think about where liz chainy landed and where kevin mccarthy landed in listening to that audio. one more story, this was a busy, busy fulleek. on monday, a federal judge overturned the freshman mask mandate for air travel and other transportation and on wednesday, i should say, the justice

department announced it is appealing the ruling at the urging of the c.d.c. laura, the white house were concerned about being the mask police and seen as the person who is telling the mergessers sorry, you cannot be relieved right now but how concerned are they with a possible precedents weighing in with a federal judge weighing on -- in on the c.d.c.'s ability to set public guidance? laura: that's the biggest thing they're worried about this most which is that, what does this do to c.d.c.'s authority in the future in order to combat pandemic, infectious diseases. the c.d.c. was first created as a malaria control agency so this is really at the core of its mission and the current pandemic we're in isn't over. there is definitely going to be another pandemic. that is a given. it may not be right away but that is so much a part of what

the c.d.c. has to do and right now in judge, you know, taking a piece out of their not is why they're saying we need to go back in and try to make sure that it isn't in the long term damaged. yamiche: what they're weighing this is what david, you experienced. you were on a plane from boston to d.c. when the policies were changing. tell us what you saw. david: it's kind of amusing. we're taking off from massachusetts, the bluest of blue states, going to d.c., the bluest of blue cities, and the pilot came on. everybody knew about the court ruling, and said no matter what the confusion is about the court ruling and its meaning, it's american airlines' policy now that everybody has to keep a mask on so everything kept a mask on. about 20 minutes into the flight they announced torsions that the mask mandate has been lifted and you saw people throwing their

masks up in the air like you were at a college graduation a they were tossing the caps. it tells you how quickly the airlines really wanted to get rid of this. and what the court case tells you in an odd way is little sign that is the biden administration really would like to get in off their hands too because, as laura said, they want to keep the authority of the c.d.c. but that doesn't mean they want to keep the masks so the one thing they didn't do this week was ask for a stay to keep the court ruling from taking effect. >> yeah, definitely. david: so that tells you they may not really want to win. yamiche: dan, how concerned is the white house and democrats about possible backlash and confusion? dan: well, i think they're very worried about it. this has created a real dilemma for them, as david indicated. on the one hand, they want this

authority for whatever and as laura indicated also, this not is important in a public health situation and in a public health perspective. but from a political perspective, they don't want to be the people who reinstall or reinstate a mask mandate particularly on airplanes and public transportation. this had been extended until may. we don't know whether it would have come offt that point or not but politically they have a difficult oblem on their hands. yamiche: well, that's going to be something they're going to have to continue to navigate because people are so relieved. thank you so much to dan, laura, david, for sharing your reporting and joining us. and tomorrow on pbs news weekend, anchor jeff ben net talks to a doctor about the lifting of mask man daylights and what that could mean for the next covid-19 surge. thank you so much for unioning

us. i'm yamiche alcindor. good night from washington. announcer: corporate funding for "washington week" is provided by -- >> for 25 years, consumer shell already has been offering no-contract wireless planned. our u.s. based customer service team can help find the plan that fits you. announcer: additional funded is provided by koo and patricia yuen through the yuen foundation. sandra and carl del rose hirschel and andy shreeves robert and susan rosenbaum, the corporation for publi broadcasting, and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you.

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