thank you. >> good to be with you, ari. >> i am ari melber in for lawrence o'donnell. chris hayes is up next. >> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. the collapse of large parts of the ice sheet in west antarctica appears to have begun and almost certainly unstoppable. that a quote according to a report from the "new york times" which credits global warming as the cause. meanwhile, marco rubio is probably running for president. >> obvious you're getting closer to running for president. >> i've openly said it's something i'll consider at the end of the year. i'll look at a number of factors, permanent factors, and also whether i could best promote this message and actually put in place these ideas i want to see put in place. >> senator marco rubio says he is ready to be president. if if the platform will allow him to promote his message and

his ideas. one of those ideas being, climate change denialism. >> you do not think the human activity, the production of co2, has caused warming. >> i do not believe human activity is causing dramatic change0s our climate the way the scientists are 0 portraying it and do not believe the laws will do anything about it except destroy our economy. >> it's now officially the price of entrance into the 2016 republican field. you need too either literally know nothing or pretend you know knowing in 2007, rubio treated global warming as an accepted truth. >> on the issue of energy, global warming, dependence on foreign sources of fuel, and capitalism, have come together to create opportunities for us that were unimaginable a few short years ago. >> he advocated florida take the lead on energy. >> that's nation is headed

toward the mission test and energy diversification, and creating an industry to pete -- meet it. florida should become the silicone valley of that try. >> last year rubio was far more cautious in his denials, saying there was debate on the issue. >> the climate is always changing. that's not the question. the fundamental question is whether manmade activity is what is contributing most to it. i understand people say there's a significant scientific consensus on the issue but i've actually seen reasonable debate on the principle. >> but marco rubio's devolution on the climate change is in line with the republican party. and the g.o.p.'s embrace of climate denialism i one of the most disspiritting trends, 352% of runs thought it was largely due to human activity, a decade later the number has dropped to 41%, and it's no better with republican politicians.

as recently as 2008 the republican party called on their members to address the risk of climate change based on sound science. today, just six years later, g.o.p. 2016 hopefuls are running away from sound science towards denialism and obfuscation. apparently it's somewhat of a prerequisite. in 2008 chris christie said climate change was real and impacting new jersey. >> when you have over 90% of the world's scientists who have studied this stating that climbed change is occur and that humans play contributing role, it's time to did he ever to the experts. >> just two years later he dismissed climb change as a theory, not worth his time. >> several experts i've heard say the destruction, though, from sandy was probably more severe because of elements of climate change, including rising sea levels. are you not willing to say that's -- >> no, i'm not. this is their business. they study it and say, probably.

maybe. i'm i've got a place to rebuilt and people want to talk about theories. >> and chris christie's take is right in line with the 02016 contenders. >> you also have to be worried about something that is considered a so-called scientific theory. that fits every scenario. >> on the left i get tired of the idea that somehow science that decided all of this and therefore you can't have a view. >> anybody who ever studied any geology knows that over periods of time, long periods of time, the crime of climate -- the climate changes. i'm not sure anybody exactly knows why. >> this is political coward -- counter-disat its worth and most dangerous, but it's become can increasingly cringe inducing. the republican party is losing the debate on climate change and increasingly they seem to know it. >> joining me now, "washington

post" national political reporter robert costa. am i right there's this discomfort you see in republican candidates when they have to address this issue? they're neither forthrightly in the denialist camp or in the camp of science. they're trying to thread a very small needle seems to me. >> i think so. i think ahead of 2016 you'll see a lot of republican candidates echo rubio. they now there's just not room within the party at a national level, there's in the space to take a stance that is different than marco rubio. especially rubio and others who have taken some distance on other issues like immigration, they're really in lock step on this conservative position on climate change. >> yet i can sense in the rubio statement -- you can sense it when we were combing through the tape of the different statements you have gotten -- they also are aware they do look increasingly ridiculous, even john karl in the interview saying, wait a second. your saying putting carbon in

the atmosphere is not heating the planet? increasingly there's a difference stance between the orthodoxy of the republican party and main stream consensus accepted opinion. >> that's right. the most thing being that climate change within the republican party it is similar in some ways to gay marriage or abortion. one issue the republican position has not changed and will not likely evolve in the near future. republicans especially conservative are not interested in doing that. at the same time, at the national level, looking to run for president, are you going to lead with talking about climate change denial? are you going to lead with talk about marriage? lead with talk about abortion? probably not. i don't think marco rubio is going to run on his climate change position but will make sure he stays with so it the tea party doesn't dessert him. >> there are two categories for any politician. the category of issues they want to talk about and the category of issues they don't want to talk about and those two are as important as the substance of what they believe or their miaging. i thought this one from michigan

is interesting. you see there in a very contested race, gary peters, a democrat running for the senate seat, going after his republican opponents and saying we want to hear where you stand with climate change. she said there should be a healthier debate. she does not agree with radical liberals like tom stier. she basically doesn't want to take a position. she wants to -- >> you have cease then from terri lynn land on the minimum wage. she is supportive of a small increase in the minimum wage. makes her a little different than some other republicans and on climate change her equivocation puts her with a little bit of distance from the national party and the conservative position. this is because in a lot of these purple states republicans like terri lynn-land are nervous or not nervous enough to break

from in the g.o.p. line butner obvious enough to have these almost vague position where they try to thread the needle. >> you're into right what it signifies to voters. people who don't care a ton about the issue, it becomes a kind of signaling point, a sort of symbolic, is this person like me? die want this person in a white house? when they're the kind of person that has no 90% of scientist engaged in the most massive mystery in history. >> democratic sources say this is smart politics. put republicans on the defensive. and disengages geo, a lot of democrats are worried about turnout. when they talk about climate change and remind them over rum runstance, they get energized and reminded why they're on the ground fighting. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> joining me now is joe rome,

founding editor of -- joe, one of the ironies here is that if you look at the modeling, of what parts of the country are going to be hit the worst? and are're feeling the effects worst from the climb? florida and miami specially where mark -- marco rubio heals from i right at the top of the list. >> in the real world his remarks should disqualify him from being president of the united states, but it really disqualifies him from being a senator from florida. you mentioned the study about antarctica. i talked to some leading experts. what it basically says is we are faced with the worst-case scenarios for sea level rise, and we're talking maybe five or six feet of sea level rise by the end of the century. that is going to depopulate southeastern florida, but the other point is, you cross a point of no return, sea levels

keep rising and rising to the point where most of florida ultimately would be underwater, and -- >> i want to stop you there. that's obviously superdensing. let's try to address that. -- one of the things that is so nefarious about the rubio answer is this republican denialist front, climate change is not happening, and then they're starting to move immediately from that to, well, we can't do anything about it, because we have stalled long enough, it's got son bad we're screwed so we shouldn't pass your measly cap and trade and you saw rubio pull off the one-two dance move in the interview. >> that's a sweet one, going from denying there's a problem to saying, oops, it's too late to do anything about it. but the scientists i've talk to say it's not too late. certainly not too late to make a big difference in, let's say, the rate of sea level rise and ultimate mat of sea level rise, whether it's ten feet or 200 feet. it's going to take centuries to

do this but i think if we listen to the marco rubios of the world, then all we'll ever remember him by is maybe somebody will put buoy in the ocean, this is where miami was. >> marco rubio legacy buoy where miami used to be. maybe an animated hallmark greeting card that plays the quote out to the boats passing by. that's bleak. great to have you on, man. >> yes. be sure to have people watch years of living dangerously on showtime. >> what's in a name? everything. when that name is obamacare. the new hard data that backs up what a whole lot of anecdotal evidence suggests about the affordable care act,. next. you are feeling powerful with a 4-cylinder engine. [ male announcer ] open your eyes...

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new insight just who is benefiting from new jersey's pension funds and what the christie administration might have to do with it.

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there's a story that came out of kentucky where some folks were signing people up at a county fair somewhere and some guy goes up and he starts looking at the rates and decided he was going to sign up, and he turns to his friend and said, this is a great deal. a lot better than obamacare. which is fine. because we -- i don't have pride of authorship. i just want the thing to work. >> president obama took that anecdote about an obamacare opponent in kentucky who got healthcare under the affordable

care act without realizing it from the huffington post story. the president lost kentucky by a whopping 23-points and kentucky officials branded the state change not as obamacare but a completely unrelated name. kynect. it is a success as noted by the kentucky governor. more than 413,000 kentuckians purchased insurance or qualified for medicaid through kynect before the march deadline and 75% of them were people who lacked health insurance before obamacare. the story the president told last september was anecdotal, but today we got striking numbers to back it up. a new nbc news poll found that while obamacare remains enormously unpopular in kentucky, with a 357% unfavorable rating, kynect which is just obamacare under a different anyway is more loved than loathed, with a 29% favorable rating with a 22%

unfavorable rating good news and bad news for barack obama and the democrats. the bad news is the g.o.p. message that obamacare is a disaster still resonates in the minds of many americans particularly in red states like kentucky. the good news is that when the healthcare law is depoliticized the reviews get a whole lot better. and since as we have been discussing oon the show republicans are now effectively waving the right flag when it comes to attacking obamacare and house republicans planning no votes or hearings on the health care law, the polling on kynect may serve as a preview how americans may soon view obamacare nationwide. joining me now is a congressional candidate for the sixth district. you have run an ad about your support for the affordable care act. i want to give folks a small listen to your radio ad. >> thanks to governor bashir, kentucky connect provides health care to to kentuckians who had

ha nod insurance about barr voted to end kynect and let insurance companies drop coverage, deny care and charge women more. >> that's an attack ad. >> yes. >> and so clearly -- >> was that a question? >> clearly you're making a judgment there that this is a very popular program. you have the political wind at your back on this issue. >> absolutely. i've spent more than eight months talking to folks in every county. there's 19 counties in the district and i've listen to people in every county, telling me at it working for them. i have stories from small business owners who are saving 10 to $12,000 a month by allowing employees to get their insurance through the state exchange, through kentucky kynect. i talked to a mother in lexington who is saving $2,000 a 'er on her children's premiums. just met a woman last weekend

who, for the first time, she is 57 years old -- for the first time she had health insurance and immediately went to the doctor and they found a heart condition me and had to have surgery. she might not have finance to the doctor if she decide notice have the coverage. so there are real stories out there every day, real asks stories. 413,000 people enrolled, and andy barr' mitchell mccome have to fining against that if they want to repeal the act. andy bar r has voted 19 times. >> do people know that? do the think andy barr is against obamacare which i don't like. do you've have a voter outside indication role to play to let people know that's the same thing he voted against, not this abstract obamacare monstrosity but the kinect your cousin is on? >> that's what we're going to keep reminding everywhere, that kentucky kynect is working and

andy barr and mitch mccome have been voting against its for two years. >> do you think you'll see any turn-around in the politics of this from your opponent or mitch mcconnell statewide? do you think they'll stop talking about obamacare as we head down the stretch and get out of primary season into general election season? do you anticipate them making a decision it's no longer politically ex-speedent to beat up on obamacare in the state of kentucky? >> they have been talking about this and trying to repeal it for years and it's going to be really hard for them to back pedal. hey should be ashamed. our state, we're at the top of the list of obesity, at the top ofte the list for heart disease and lung carn sir -- cancer. this is getting people coverage and health care and it's wrong for them to fight against this are so so long and they have to take the blame for that. >> you think they'll take the plame for it? are voters going to make that connection? witness up aing there to have it

fade into the background. it's another to keep it alive as a live election issue. if republicans have done a great job demonizing it, often it seems democrats have not figure out the way to good own offensive about this politically. >> i'm on the offense for if every day and make sure the voters in the district are aware of it. i thick all of the democrats in our state should stand up. our governor has done a great thing to get this off the ground and get 413,000 people in our state discovered it should be a model for the country. >> elizabeth jensen arounding for congress in kentucky, thank you for joining us. up next, agree with senator rand paul and senator paul agrees with the aclu. how that comes about, next. life with crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis

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ever since senate majority leader harry reed pull the trigger on the nuclear option, remove the obstacle of the filibuster filling judicial vacancies has turned around. six months prior the senate confirmed 24 of the president's nominations. six months later 39 more have already been confirmed. now the administration has run into an obstacle with two proposed nominees set to be considered tomorrow, one of whom is georgia state judge michael boggs who is o'owe posed by pretty much every single liberal interest group. he voted to choose life license plates and tighten restrictions

on minors seeking abortions, and to keep the confederate insignature nia on the state flag. the other judicial knock any is david baron, opposed by a coalition that includes code pink, the aclu, and senator rand paul. they're making a fairly simple request. when baron worked in thity department's office of legal council he coauthored a memo that provided a legal basebays for the u.s. government to target and kill anwar a.l. -- aulaqi. the bipartisan coalition of senators wants the memo and the other ones released. whether or not you agree with the memo on constitutional grounds i can think of no conceivable reason the logic contained thin should be kept secret from americans and yet that's exactly what this administration has done. summaries of the memo have leak and the obama administration to

make only that one memo available to the senators that want to read it. but that's not enough. senator ran paul in today's "new york times" writes, quote: the obama administration has established a legal justification that applies to every american citizen. they may be true or not. the fact is we don't know without seeing the memo. the request for transparency is right and warranted. independent of david baron's own merit as a nominee. but if this is the lever that is going to pry open this obviously important public information, then so be it. release the memos. governments are entitled to keep secrets, not entitle to keep secret law. at the next job, next adventure or at the next exit helping you explore super destinations and do everything under the sun. 12 brands. more hotels than anyone else in the world. so wherever you want to be, whatever you want to do,

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that's where the bucks of unguarded money is. the investment banks and hedge funds want to get their hands on the real money, which is pension funds to manage them and charge fees for doing so and make a killing and and it's precisely because of these huge pools of money that are such inviting targets the state of new jersey has extremely strong rules to make sure that the politicians charged with overseeing the money don't give out contracts to manage the money as a kind of quid pro quo for campaign donations. called pay to play laws. governor chris christie rose to power criticizing then-governor jon jon corzine's close connections to wall street. he equated him to gordon gecko. >> 20 years later, ladies and gentlemen, that greed, for lack of a better word, is good. >> since then things have changed. new jersey, among all 50 states,

is number two in the amount of pension fundses it has invested in wall street hedge funds. texas is number one. the christie administration and one of chris christie's fellow republican politics are feigning off a fleury of inquiries about number's pay to play laws and new jersey truery rules and whether they have been violated. the kicker is the fellow republican politician, charles, charlie baker, happens to be running for governor of massachusetts for their second time. here's the timeline that no one is disputing. republican gubernatorial candidate charlie baker donated $10,000 in may 2011 to the state party committee of governor chris christie of new jersey. now, only seven months latary christie administration controlled pension fund committed $25 million to an investment firm that lists baker as a partner. baker has av offered many arguments, disclaiming wrongdoing, he was not a registered investment professional and never discussed

the investment at the firm and he did not contribute at the behest of others and even that he was not an annual employee in the strict legal sense of the firm general catalyst partners. that, even though he -- 33 documents have been discovered which suggest otherwise. baker would probably have to explain a great deal more to make it clear. the same may be true for the christie administration. when asked for comment but has yet to receive a reply. joining me now is the author of the piece, david. baker's folks are saying you're totally out of line, this was completely innocuous, and he is not really part of this firm. convince me they're wrong. >> well, i think he has already tried to convince you you're wrong when he filed, as his employer, on 33 separate campaign documents, when he listed as his employer, the same firm in question.

the fact remain that charlie baker made a $10,000 contribution to the new jersey republican state committee a few months before the new jersey pension fund controlled by chris christie gave that same firm a large pension contract. and charlie baker never disputed that he was an investment person, never disputed he was an employee of the firm. all of the news coverage of previous to this, only now when pay to play laws and pay to pay rules have been brought hurricane charley baker suddenly saying all those 33 campaign document is said general catalyst was my employer, all the times i said i was an investor or executive or partner the conjunction with that firm, all that stuff was just an error. i made a mistake. >> okay. so, but explain to me, let's say -- this was your investigative report. you found this. you published this. published the followups. it's been front page of the gone globe. so, look. money changes hand.

baker happened to give chris christie money. his fun happened to get my money. what is the problem from any kind of legal or rule-breaking sense, even if it turns out he is associated with the fund. >> because chris christie first and foremost has a responsibility under new jersey division of treasury rules to not give out pension contracts to friends whose employees are associates. that is in the rules. associates have given money to chris christie or really any state politician in new jersey. so first and foremost is the question of whether is the due diligence from new jersey in the middle of the culture of corruption. there is anybody even looking at the rules in the christie administration? secondly the larger problem is, this comes out of a problem where people, as you suggested before, have been spending money on campaign contributions for pension contracts. the problem if is that pension money is supposed to be invested soley with the fiduciary regard for the money of retirees and

not supposed to be spent with regard to whether the pension fund person or the politician controlling the pension fund is connected to a political donor. >> we heard a lot of reaction from baker's people. baker has been pushing back against this, saying i'm not an employee. we basically heard nothing as far as the christie administration, although it seems to me that the implications are more severe for them. i mean, i'm kind of curious. what have you heard? have you gotten any response from the christie folks? >> the only response we have gotten from the christie folks is that general catalyst, charlie baker's firm he listed 33 separate times, been in the press bragging about how he works there, the only response is they filled out his disclosure form and they didn't list charlie baker's political contributions on it. which then raises the question, is that the only due diligence that the christie administration is doing? aren't the asking deeper questions or even searching new jersey's own government searchable contributions? this is on the new jersey government web site.

the fact that the christie administration apparently didn't seem to know about this is astonishing. >> and you got to also think about the fact new jersey happens to have very strong rules. so the possibility of a rule violation here where a contribution happened and a few months latary contract guess out, that's only a possible vie la layings of -- violation of rules of the law because of the high were in new jersey. there's 49 other states where the bar is much lower, and what the heck is going on in other states where there's essentially very little in the law to stop this kind of thing from happening? >> that's a terrific question. and new jersey -- if it's happening in new jersey, you can bet it's happening all over the country. we have a situation now where there are $3 trillion worth of money in public pension funds and there is -- it's the wild west in many cases. we reported earlier about the company blackstone and how it employs basically an army of lobbyists in the state of kentucky and has gotten

largecontracts there. it's example after example where wall street and financial firms are futbolling money interest the campaigns of the -- funneling money into the campaigns of legislators and state officials who are overseeing the pension funds and the question for taxpayers and retirees what is being begin out. management fees, and they're a ripoff for retirees. >> most of the hedge funds missed the performance in this year and are charging fees from two to ten times what a standard index fund with. so if you have a pension investing in a hedge fun they better get good terms. great work on this. thank you. >> thank you. >> michael sam becomes a ram and the first openly gay football player to get drafted in the nfl. now what? his agent will join me next. any other way. but your erectile dysfunction - it could be a question of blood flow.

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>> it's pretty ware to have business meetings that are tv ratings gold. the nfl draft that pulled it off it's a breakout success for the sports network carrying it. the viewership was up to a whopping 6.8 rating, the highest for the draft, compared that to what else is on tv on thursday and more people watched the nfl draft than watched either nba playoff game combined, meaning more people were watching men in suits decide who will play in sporting events months from now than were watching actual playoff sporting events happening live. as to what happened the draft it was a big night. michael sam's agent will join me next. uhhh. no, that can't happen. that's the thing, you don't know how long it has to last.

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the nfl draft has become this big television event, bigger every year. i have a feeling there's going to be even more people tuning in. >> there was a time when sports were ahead of the curve, when jackie robinson broke the color barrier we were ahead of the changes and if people pass over mike because of his sexuality it will be sad for us because it will signify the fact that sports has fallen behind the rest of society in terms of our seasonnance and tolerance. >> there were 256 players selected in the 2014 nfl draft, a even ven that is a three-day multimedia extravaganza in which fans flock to mid town manhattan and millions watch on tv, all this to have the pleasure of watching other people read a list of names. and yet somehow at it all imbued with tremendous drama. this year there was extra drama because by saturday evening, on

the third and final day of the draft, 248 people had been drafted, only eight more selections remanied and the parlance of the draft, that's guy, the sec defensive player of the year and openly gay athlete, michael sam, was still on the board. with everyone watching and time running out on the draft, the question lingered of whether the nfl was going to, well, frankly, pass the social test set before it. and bring an openly gay football player into the league. then the call finally came. >> the 249th pick in the 2014 nfl draft, the st. louis rams select, michael sam, defensive end, missouri. >> and then the reaction from michael sam himself.

>> the reaction to that instantly iconic moment when michael sam celebrated by kissing my his boyfriend went two ways. some were heard chanting michael sam. president obama said from the playing field to the corporate board you should be judged by whatot do, not who you are. the other side was predictable. i'm not going to watch two dudes kiss on a sports show. joining me is michael sam's agent, cameron weiss. take me through what your were thinking saturday morning, friday, when it was getting

very, very, very close to the end of the draft and looking like your client might not make it. >> you know, tensions were high. often gets that way on draft day. the stakes were higher here. so joe and i were just continuing to put feelers out there, talk to people we knew on the inside, and trying to get an accurate gauge of where michael was going to go. >> what was the atmosphere in the room like a the possibility of not getting drafted must have entered the picture? frustration? get any beefs between people, shouldn't have come out, shouldn't have done this? i'm mad? i can imagine tensions get so high in the circumstances because you have no control over the future of your life and career. >> the room was tense but never any finger pointing. we have an unbelievable relationship with mike, and the bottom line is, people already knew he was gay. scouts already knew he was gay. if he was going to fall in the draft because of his sexuality,

whether he came out would till affect him. >> there are arguments, monday mortgage quarterbacking, about where he lanked the the draft compared to where he was possibly projected. early projections had him in the fourth round-around there he said himself he should have been taken in the first three rounds. do you think that his sexuality and him coming out accounts for slipping to the final round of the draft? >> there's a lot of different things that go into grading a player, and ultimately where he is taken. sometimes doesn't have to do with what he did on the field the year before. mike has some results at the combine which we weren't to happy with. he obviously improved on them to speculate as to what role his sexuality subconsciously played in me minds of 32 general managers, that would just be conjecture. >> so he has to make the team now. it just occurred to me, this is a high pressure situation, professional athletes are under tremendous amount of pressure.

alet of money on the line, a lot of scrutiny. these are young adults, 21, 22 years old, and now on top of that, he has the whole world looking at whether this seventh round player is going to make a team that has already got a pretty good defensive line. is he ready for this? the amount of intestinal fortitude to put him through this situation is remarkable. >> yeah. we know what he has to do, too. he is all about work. he said after he celebrated saturday night, it's all work from here out. he is in a great organization and has to compete hit butt off to make the roster. >> do you worry about what happens if he doesn't make the team? both from a kind of personal standpoint of your client and also that this dream dies, that there is all this coverage, there is all this second-guessing. you guys have set yourself up for yet another climatic moment in the near future.

>> that seeps to be the michael sam story, doesn't it, chris? we're very confident he will make the roster. if it's not with st. louis he will be contributing on someone's roster this season because he has al the tools to do that. >> i thought the kiss, the image of the kiss, was so incredible and moving, you guys have had to manage these intimate parts of his life in way thought is not normally expected of an agent with a heterosexual player. was there discussion about that? was there discussion about the optics? discussion about, oh, we should do this or north do this or these people should be in the room? >> i didn't know it was going to happen. neither did joe. and frankly, it didn't matter to either of us. we have obviously seen mike and veto kiss many times and the joy in the room, the sense of relief in the room, thought it was completely appropriate and a beautiful moment, and people were allowed to share with mike and with us cushion i.

>> cameron weiss, congratulations on the draft. thanks a lot. >> thank you very much, chris. pleasure having me on again. >> michael sam won't be the first gay player in the cars are driven by people. they're why we innovate. they're who we protect. they're why we make life less complicated. it's about people.

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right now, i'd have three sacks. >> former defensive lineman for the nfl and author of "alone in the trenches, my life as a gay man in the nfl." mike, michael sam's agent did not want to speculate on this question everyone is asking whether he slipped in the draft because of the publicity around him being gay. what do you think? >> projected to be a fifth round before the public knew he was gay. he did not do well in the combine. put up as few weights as a he did slipped to seven. so we don't know why, but it's totally plausible, given his overall resume that he would slip. the reason he went, the coach of the rams said he didn't work out well, but he was so good on the field. at least one team wanted him. >> there was some ugliness after the moment he was announced. but to put it in perspective, miami dolphins player don jones

tweeted omg, horrible, after seeing the kiss. he then put out an apology statement. i felt like we were running to twitter to search for horrible things people were saying but it was not that much. that seems to be the story so far, not that big deal. in the way that people have dealt with it. >> i know, the big kiss, right? when the rams announced that they picked michael sam, i tell you what, it was such an amazing feeling. it was such a different response from when i got drafted back in '91. you know, i had a panic attack when my name got called. but to see michael sam embrace his partner and show affection was the most amazing, amazing feeling for me. that this young gentleman is going to be able to go into the nfl and be himself and not have to worry about looking over his shoulder, not having to worry about not introducing his partner to the team or anything like that.

for me, it was very emotional and i was very excited. but i also was a little ticked off. a lot of other people, he went in the seventh round. >> you said you had a panic attack in 1991. it was probably not broadcast live by 8 million people. why did you have that panic attack? >> you know, i had a panic attack. it was because i was in the closet, because i was gay, and i was living with this crippling secret all my life. for me, i was thinking that someone would see my name on the board, my name on the board and contact the green bay packers that they just drafted a gay guy. and that's -- i wasn't able to enjoy it that way. but man, just from when i came out, when i got drafted to now, absolutely amazing. it was such an historical moment. >> that's the answer to when anyone says why do we care about

his sexual orientation, why can't he keep it to himself, that's called being in the closet. >> that's exactly right. >> i have to tell you guys, when i went to the super bowl with atlanta, i'm watching all the wives and the families come in, they're getting introduced to all the coaches and everything. so my partner at the time, mitchell, had to hide in the shadows. that's the kind of stuff that really took a toll on me. and put me into that depression, because i wasn't able to do that. what michael sam, not only that, he can play to the best of his potential. without having to deal with any of that. let me tell you, it's going to be amazing. >> i keep thinking about the amount of -- i'm really blown away by this guy, michael sam. just as an individual, but part of the -- this is someone who's chosen to do something that puts

such unbelievable stress and pressure on himself as a 21, 22-year-old. even the kiss itself, it was just so awesome and courageous and proud and really makes me admire this guy. i think he's an incredible story. >> i was just going to say, it just seemed so honest and noncontrived and in the moment. >> exactly. >> i'm going to kiss vito because i want to kiss vito. >> when something good happens, you embrace the person that you love. so that's -- it was just natural. but i've got to tell you this, i'm excited he's going to the rams. not only because they picked him, but i'm excited that

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