dollar. i will see you back here tomorrow at 1:00 p.m. and then 3:00 eastern. thank you for watching. watch or listen to the show on sirius xm, tune in, msnbc now and apple tv, facebook, twitter, instagram, linkedin. "deadline: white house" with nicolle wallace starts now. hi, everyone, it's 4:00 in new york. how bad was it? apparently the president's stops in el paso and dayton, who communities he vowed to help heal, were so offkey, the attacks so jarring the barrage of angry tweets at local media so startling, even trump's own white house acknowledged the trip was a debacle. white house times reporter maggie earlier today -- >> do they think it went well? >> most people, i suspect, would not say that publicly but will privately admit yesterday was

something of a debacle. that these are not the headlines they wanted to see. they wanted him to go in and behave differently, go in and get out without little waves as possible. did he that in pittsburgh, even though there was controversy after the synagogue shooting. he was able to stay calm. yesterday he couldn't stop watching television news, where the candidates were attacking him. this was the process. >> these are the headlines underscoring maggie's reporting, from "the new york times," trump divisions, "the washington post" trump attacks two mayors as the cities grieve from mass shootings. and "l.a. times," trump visits shooting victims in dayton and el paso and lashes out at its critics. none of the victims of the el paso mass shooting agreed to meet with president trump when he visited wednesday. the president's attempt at consoling communities in pain

paling in comparison to some of the men and women who seek to replace him. in an emotional encounter, el paso native beto o'rouke yesterday comforted an anguished member of his community. here's that moment. i don't understand why they're doing this to us. >> it's okay. it will be all right. >> the display of raw humanity, beto o'rouke then offering the grieving man his contact information and telling him to reach out if he needs help. o'rourke wasn't the only person who seemed to have an easier time touching the nation's raw nerve and speaking to the

bravery of the victims with more eloquence than the president. >> we're here this morning in the wake of yet another act of hatred in america, but i come here today because of love. >> right now we have to decide what kind of nation we're going to become. >> we can't go on like this. i was part of what i feel like was a first generation where school shootings were routine. now there's a second. are we going to allow there to be a third? >> those bullets do not distinguish between a republican and democrat. and those children who are going to school every day in fear of some gunmen roaming the halls of their school could care less if you are a democrat or a republican. >> ladies and gentlemen, the american people may be running out of tears, but i pray they're not running out of will. a will to do something about

where we are. we don't need thoughts and prayers out of washington. what we need, we need is strength and some resolve that we haven't seen it. >> the president's shortcomings, the president's abnormalities frankly speaking made all starker by the very public displays of leadership and humanity from the men and women seeking to replace him. that's where we start today with some of our favorite reporters and friends, from "the new york times" white house correspondent annie karni. charlie sykes, editor and chief of the conservative news and opinion website the bulwark. with us at the table rick stengel, former managing editor for "time" magazine, karine jean-pierre from moveon.org, plus political reporter for "the new york times" nick confessore is back. luckily for us. i stopped in my tracks when i saw maggie haberman report on

another network that even sources inside the white house say yesterday was a debacle. >> yes, i think president trump was not particularly happy with how it went and the intention at the outset was to get him in and out of both of these cities quickly and privately. that's why the aides limited the press pool's access to the hospitals he visited and hoped to make this at best not something that generated negative headlines. but the president was upset with the coverage, upset about how it unfolded in realtime, that these heartwarming scenes he described behind the scenes weren't seen by reporters. i don't think anybody was happy on either end of it. another concern i'm hearing is this election, we are in an election season. if you're looking at this politically, this election is going to be decided by a lot of voters who don't like him personally. a lot of suburban women voters who will have to choose the economy and the gains he's giving over their personal

distaste for the president and moments like this concern aides who think this will push them over the edge and say, i just don't like this person. >> charlie, on the need for speed, here's what the white house is afraid of. here's donald trump inside the hospital yesterday. >> i was here three months ago we made a speech, what was the name of the place? >> hawthorne road. >> what was the name? >> oh, good. i was so proud. and then you had this crazy beto. he had like 400 people in the parking lot. >> because, charlie, if you're in a hospital at someone's bedside, it's all about the size of your overflow crowd. to borrow an expression from beto, wtf. >> yeah, there are events that will raise the stature of a

president. there have been presidents who have risen to the occasion. and then there are presidents who were exposed by the occasion. this was an exposed moment. again, this is donald trump. we've gotten to know him and even though it seemed familiar, he wants to be the bride at every wedding, wants to be the corpse at every funeral, wants to be the baby at every christening and apparently wants to be the rock star at every trauma center as well. the fact they would put out this promotional video, the fact they would tweet out how he was this rock star, how totally vulgar and inappropriate the entire thing was, but once again, it was donald trump, the essence of this man, that was really on display and exposed by this national tragedy. >> karine, i want to dig in to the political vulnerabilities exposed. i agree with everything an nie and charlie said.

the white house has to worry when as he said donald trump is exposed just being himself. that's who he is. goes to a hospital ostensibly to comfort people and talks about the size of his overflow crowds. i have aired president obama's moment singing "amazing grace." i think we have that footage again. my old boss george w. bush after 9/11 took it upon himself to represent all americans at a moment of shock and horror. donald trump doesn't fail trying, he just fails. >> it's almost as if that very important shift that's needed for the characterization of a president, right, the care, the heart, that we've seen from every president as you just mentioned, whether it's republican or democrat, he's missing it. he doesn't have it. and he doesn't even try. the shallowness, the tone deafness, he will never be able to rise to the occasion because he cannot.

and he only cares about donald trump. the thing about this week that i found interesting was you actually saw him flailing. you saw him out there just flailing about. the reason why is because all of the democratic candidates were on one accord, right? >> right. that's the variable. right. i want to ask you, because maggie haberman in that interview points to pittsburgh as being an example. the bar is incredibly low, but i suppose her point was he met the incredibly low bar we have for him. oops the variable as you say the democrats running to replace him, they have a stage now and they're all singing from one song sheet. you have beto o'rouke and elizabeth warren both saying yesterday they believe donald trump is a white supremacist. >> and they're showing something that we haven't seen in three years, which is leadership. we have not seen that. so you saw that from cory booker, you saw that from joe biden. you've certainly seen that time and time again from beto o'ro e

o'rouke. the clip you showed of him holding that man who's crying because we have to understand there's a community out there, the latin community, that is not being represented by this president. they're being attacked by this president. it's very, very real. there's another thing too, i think the media has been on one accord as well, which is calling out this cruelty, which is making sure we have space, people can go on television and talk about what is happening. so when you have that, when you have the media doing its job, when you have democrats on one accord, then you see the realness of this president. the lack, we have a small man in the white house and we see it over and over again. we know this. we know this. it's just this week something about this week has helped us really magnify that. >> nick, i've had to sort of thought process this week because i think you see suffering and you see pain and you see -- you try to walk in their shoes, right? we have kids. we have to go back-to-school

shopping for the things moms and dads at walmart were looking for on that day. they went in for pencils and backpacks and refrigerated lunch boxes. and some of them lost their lives. so it's this incredibly relatable thing. and a former counterterror official said to me it's the textbook definition of terrorism. it if as many people died in a roadside bomb in iraq, we switched policies in iraq. went to the surge based on a military vatstrategy that was costing us around the same number of lives. >> it's true. gun violence is the one that is exempt from the usual forces of public opinion, policymaking that are simply frozen, for reasons we're all familiar with. i agree can karine, yes, it's true, he's missing some piece of machinery, in fact using almost the exact same language in the wake of the florida hurricane at

this table. but on top of that he's deliberately shown a strategy for his election campaign. his strategy is brown people are coming to steal your country and stuff. i'm not exaggerating. these running 2, 000 ads on facebook about the invasion of the southern border. he's banking on getting people afraid. how can a person decide that's their best bet to re-election truly in a way console the way a politician would. this is not a campaign about tax cuts and growing economy, it's a campaign about fair. >> i want to pick up on karine's thread. she made a point about the media that's important, beto o'rouke made this point at the beginning of the week when he had that colorful quote and said he's so sick of the media asking questions nobody knew the answer to. nick and annie's colleague wrote a piece on the sunday paper i think three weeks ago now when donald trump declared war on the squad and what pierre, better

language than i can recall, but basically he woke up in the morning and threw a match and a bunch of gasoline on the nation's racial tensions. people in el paso, a lot of people who have come on this program this week, and certainly if you're an algorithm looking for a killer's manifesto and donald trump's twitter feed, a whole lot of connection between donald trump's language of invasion of immigrants and killer's screed. >> that was your ding, ding, ding. >> if i wrote an algorithm, and someone suggested i go as an algorithm for halloween. >> you can do better than that. i was very struck by the beto o'rouke line and i have been frustrated myself as a longtime journalist that journalists are asking questions they know the answers to because they don't know anything other questions to ask. it's like what -- if donald trump had said x, would that have changed things? you know he's never going to say

yes. it's something frustrating we all experienced sitting around this table for months and years now, how do you process trump from a journalistic perspective? you can't ask the conventional questions because people already know the answers to them. and i think it's been frustrating. i don't think we've come up with a way to cover him. to your point there has been kind of journalistic con senses that alienates him because he hates this idea there's a consensus against him but having a journalistic consensus is not necessarily a good thing for journalists either. >> annie karni, let me jump into this because you have the business of covering this white house and do it just about better than anybody on that beat. your thoughts. >> i think what we saw unfold here to some extent is shocking and to some extent is exactly how a lot of people predicted this would play out. the events of the past 24 hours just made it more clear the teleprompter speech he gave on monday where he condemned white nationals was a line he read and not where his heart is.

we didn't hear any of that language echoed anywhere in his comments yesterday, especially in el paso where that was where the shooter did seem to be channeling some of trump's language as his motivation. no reference to that again. and it was just more stark displays that every time tragedy like this happens, we can have one moment of where he says the right thing and his real self appears and we see where his head is really at. i think that is the challenge of covering trump when he does say the right thing, when he does say the words of saying -- condemning white nationalism, we cover those words and do we think that it matters that he said them at all? in some sense it still does matter that he said them. in some sense does he undercut it the next day? it's a question we deal with all the time here. >> charlie sykes, he undercut it so quickly and completing you have two democrats that i have

counted running for president calling him a white supremacist. here's elizabeth warren. >> so i was asked a question and i gave an honest answer. he's a man who cozies up to the white supremacists. he calls them fine fellows. he's talked about trying to get brown people and black people out of this country. he's talked about shithole countries. this is what he's done, the wink and the nod. and he can't have it both ways. he can't keep trying to stir this up, give aid and comfort, be embraced by white supremacists and then say oh, but not me. no. he's responsible. he's the president of the united states. >> charlie, that was elizabeth warren explaining her response to "the new york times" in which she calls trump a white supremacist. >> yes, i mean anybody who was surprised by the fact the president was going to undermine his own message just hasn't been

paying any attention. he can read the right words but teleprompter trump is not the same as rally and twitter trump. go back to nick's point here, look, this is a president who is incapable of rallying the nation around the opposition to white nationalist terrorism because he just doesn't feel it. he has made a calculated decision that he's going to run on fear of the other. fear of the caravan, fear of the hispanic invasion, of the infestation of our cities. this is what he's doing. this is his message. and as a result you try to compare these presidential moments, ronald reagan after the challenger disaster, george w. bush after 9/11, barack obama after the shootings in charlotte. then you compare that to donald trump yesterday, what's missing? what's missing is passion, which is a commitment and a sense that he actually sees this as a real

problem. and, again, whatever he says that is written for him, you know, probably has an expiration date of less than 24 hours. again, we saw that on display this week. >> karine, where are we if we've now got two democrat in elizabeth warren's case, one of the front runners in this democratic field, describing her opponent, the head of the republican party, leader of this country, as a white supremacist. beto o'rouke made that accusation of donald trump during her hour in an interview with jacob soboroff. i'm positive it might change the contours of this election. do you think it's that dramatic? i haven't heard a contrast like that in a presidential contest ever. >> here's the thing, nicolle, in a few days we're about to hit the second anniversary of charlottesville where a young woman heather heyer died fighting racism, anti-racist

protester. and during that time we saw the neo-nazis, we saw david duke. they were praising donald trump's name. and when white supremacists think that you are a white supremacist, that's a problem. and this is the president that they believe is a white supremacist. they believe he is their savior. they believe that he got elected for them, and emboldens them. this is something many of us if you're a person of color living in this country and you saw what was going on in 2016, you knew what was happening. you knew exactly who donald trump was. and you knew even years before 2011 with birtherism. this is not something that's new for many of us. it's just now finally being told and finally being said out loud where no one feels kind of ooh i'm going to get taken out for saying that word. that is just the reality. we haven't been in this reality for a long time.

>> i think nick's point is an important one. this is now deliberate. this is a campaign strategy. >> there's money behind it. >> we have known for a long time, i get it, he has 2,000 ads on facebook. but this has been deliberate since 2011 when he decided he was going to jump into the political arena. this is not new. >> karine is right. when doctors and nurses were heading to africa to fight ebola, he was for shutting down the borders to keep aide workers out. the xenophobia, the isolationism is the constant thread. i guess my challenge, my question to all of you, my colleague joe scarborough has been taking a hard line on trump's donors. is that the next front of this? where do democrats take this message, karine? >> we have come -- we're in such a crazy time right now. it's hard to get through to people. i get what folks are trying to do. they're trying to send a message like it is not okay to support this guy. it is not okay. look what he is doing.

look at the awful cruel policies, and i think it's a way to call people out and wake them up. if you support him, this is what you are supporting. now, you know, i understand the issues and the problems of doing that but i get the sentiment behind it. >> the urgency. >> the urgency of now, absolutely. >> and part of the privilege of being a wealthy person could be insulated from pressure, from public opinion, you can do what you want and money buys power. what we are seeing now is there are people who will go out there on the left and beyond and say, look, you can't have it both ways. you can't just say you support this president because you like some of his policies. >> you like the tax cuts. >> you support him, you're getting the whole bundle. >> i think that's fair game. >> and remember people boycotted apartheid products. remember years ago you wouldn't by stock or product from any company that supported apartheid south africa. why is there not that same thing with people who support donald trump and their product and

their companies? and there has been with eck wa kn eck wa knox this past week. >> annie karni, let me give you the last word. >> there's nothing wrong, boycotting sole cycle and equinox is a totally legitimate way to express yourself. they're protected by the first amendment. the decision to publicize people who maxed out to trump in san antonio has been controversial but it's public disclosure. those names are public. the question for democrats though is, you know, elizabeth warren, beto o'rouke call trump a white supremacist but if you think back to 2016, hillary clinton did get in trouble when she referred to his supporters as deplorables. i think calling people who support donald trump white supremacist by association would actually be a very problematic place for democrats to find themselves.

>> it's an interesting. annie karni, thank you for spending time with us. we're grateful. when we come back, breaking news. andrew mccabe is suing the justice department saying he was punished for refusing to pledge allegiance to donald trump. and democrats need to break the law on common sense gun control. leading a caravan through iowa. will he succeed? and in mississippi hundreds of workers rounded up in a raid on food processing plants targeting immigrants. we will bring you the latest reporting on the children, many stranded, while their parents are detained. but only a select few of the very safest vehicles are awarded a top safety pick plus. the highest level of safety possible. how many 2019 top safety pick plus-winning vehicles does your brand have? one. two. how about eight?

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breaking news just a few moments ago, ousted fbi director andy mccabe who authorized an investigation into the president over his ties to russia is suing the justice department, suggesting he was fired, quote, for his refusal to pledge partisan allegiance to trump. among the blistering criticisms of trump and his allies in the suit, vav id description of the cast of cronies running the justice department. from the file, stheved as the president's personal enforcers rather than the nation's highest law firms, catering to trump's whims instead of honoring their oath to uphold the constitution. joining this conversation just when we need him, former fbi official and msnbc contributor chuck rosenberg. i have so many questions for you

but first off, a lawsuit like this, why is it filed and what are the possible outcomes? >> andy through his lawyers filed a civil suit seeking essentially, nicolle, to be reinstated so that he can get his full retirement benefits. it's a civil case in the federal district court, district of columbia, and i'm working my way through all 48 pages. >> let's talk about some of andy mccabe's treatment by the department he is now suing. he was deputy director of the fbi after jim comey, your friend and former boss as well. was fired. there's an open question not just about whether or not donald trump was obstructing the russian investigation but whether by obstructsing it, by firing jim comey he was carrying out either wittingly or unwittingly the wishes of moscow. talk about just how threatened donald trump was by andy mccabe

and his leadership in the fbi. >> sure, andy told the world he was opening an investigation on the president's role with respect to the mueller investigation and russian interference and told us that the president was a subject of that investigation. so the president must have felt very threatened by what andy mccabe did. by the way, nicolle, what andy mccabe stood for. probably a good point to insert by bias, andy is a friend of mine. i think he's a man of integrity. but the attacks of the president on andy were merciless, absolutely extraordinary. once andy was fired, the president publicly celebrated that firing. so what andy is essentially alleging is the timetable for his firing was accelerated and his chance to respond to the charges against him were abbreviated. >> and, chuck, he was targeted by this president not just for what you just described what he represented and his leadership

of the fbi but for his wife's political ambitions, going back to before donald trump was even elected, i believe, he started singling out and targeting andy mccabe for his wife's career moves. talk about that. >> jill mccabe, andy's wife, is a physician, pediatrician, i believe, in northern virginia who decided to run for the virginia state senate. and andy was careful to recuse himself -- first to seek ethics advice at the fbi and recuse himself from any matters that might be implicated from his wife seeking higher office or elective office in northern virginia. he may not have done it exactly right, he may have done it differently if he could do it today but he sought ethics advice and tried to play it by the book and tried to get it right. the president seemed very upset by this and alleged because jim mccabe received funding for her run for state senate from individuals associated with the

clintons, this somehow tainted andy. i think that's ridiculous. >> chuck, a source close to this filing today says the complaint is detailed and specific in laying out how the president pressured sessions and oig to do the wrong thing. is that suggesting the inspector general's office was somehow tainted and politicized? that seems like a pretty significant development. >> yeah, that's a hard pill for me to swallow. i worked with the oig folks. i know them. again, they're fallible, they're human, don't always get it right. but the notion they would sum couple in some way to political pressure strikes me as wrong. that said just on my brief review of andy's lawsuit, it does seem that some procedures have been abbreviated and others had been accelerated and that's troubling. i understand that the president was racing a clock. the president had wanted to get andy fired before he, andy, turned 50 and before all of his

pension benefits vested. so the president was the run racing the clock. i think that's an important question for a court to decide, whether andy didn't get the process he was due. if that's the case, nicolle, it would be a fifth amendment violation, which entitles all of us to due process. >> rick stengel, the president's war on justice was -- the word chuck described is right, merciless. it was unending. the lawsuit also alleges, quote, it was trump's unconstitutional plan and scheme to discredit and remove doj and fbi employees who were deemed to be his partisan opponents because they were not politically loy politically loyal to him. mccabe's termination was evident. donald trump told "the new york times" in an interview he wanted roy cohn. if you wanted a witness, i would pull out the recording of donald trump telling your colleagues at

mar-a-lago. >> yes, he absolutely politicized doj. he sees them as personal attorneys, not attorneys representing the united states. >> which by the way he has now in barr. >> yes. the thing this is a line with is the incredible pettiness of donald trump, of getting andy mccabe fired the day before his pension vests. he served 25 or 30 years. reminds me of this story from a couple of weeks ago where trump personally asked the lawyers who defended that navy s.e.a.l. of war crimes to be stripped of their medals. this is the president of the united states. you can't get pettier than that. and, yes, some presidents have micro managed things but no one has micro managed things with the viciousness and pettiness of donald trump. >> charlie, i have interviewed andy mccabe on this show. we're fortunate to have jim comey's voice on issues, big, national security and law enforcement issues. if you think about just the carnage in terms of professional

reputation, in terms of the brain drain that his pettiness cost the federal government and particularly if we really do believe as christopher wray has testified just in the last couple of weeks that the biggest threat to the homeland is domestic terrorism fueled by white supremacy, we're now out some of the best minds in terms of how to fight terrorism. >> absolutely. yes, this is petty but it's also vindictive. the goal was to destroy mccabe's reputation, to destroy his credibility. as part of his ongoing attempt both to politicize the fbi and department of justice, and to undermine his critics. but your larger point is i think will really haupt donald trunt what did he do to make america safer? what actions did he take faced with the russian attack, has he prepared the country to fight that? and has he weakened the country

in its ability to deal with other terror attacks, like the white national terrorism observed. but what's interesting about this case is it provides another venue to litigate and find out the truth. discovery, if it's allowed to go forward, would be extremely interesting. >> what do you think we'll learn in terms of donald trump has the pulley bull pi pulpit and authority to hire and fire. but this may reveal some of the darker underbelly of the politicalization of the highest law enforcement agencies in the land. >> i'm interested in andy mccabe has other documents or evidence of what he's alleging in this complaint. i have not read the whole thing yet. it is possible several things are true at once, the oig of justice did find evidence of infractions on mccabe's part, that the president was out to get him and procedures for his termination were fast for theed at the same time. the question for the court could

be notwithstanding the fact he was terminated, were the procedures followed the proper way? >> chuck rosenberg, thank you for jumping on tv with us. we're grateful. when we come back, when la bear said background checks would not do anything, did that keep the president from doing anything? anything why don't we just ask geico for help with renters insurance? i didn't know geico helps with renters insurance. yeah, and we could save a bunch too. antonio! fetch computer! antonio? i'll get it. get to know geico and see how much you could save on renters insurance.

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and we want everyone to know, this is not a democrat or republican thing. this is an american thing. this is about security. the number one responsibility we have as legislators and as elected officials, whether you're a councilman or congressman is keep your people safe. this is an issue that we need to address to keep our people safe. it's time for a change. and we need that change to happen in the united states, and it starts with getting mitch mcconnell to pass this and rebuilding trust. >> that was congressman and presidential candidate tim ryan out today leading a caravan from

ohio to kentucky with a message for senate majority mitch mcconnell. do something. mcconnell has ignored calls from democrats to bring the senate back from its august resource to vote on two bills that would strengthen the federal background check for gun purchases. without any pressure from trump, action from mcconnell is unlikely. according to "the washington post," the president has someone else in his ear who doesn't want the bills to pass. quote, nra chief executive wayne lapierre spoke with trump on tuesday after the president spoke about support of the background check bill and he told trump it would not be popular. our roundtable is back. what do you think? >> the senate is the firewall for the nra. because of the structure of the senate the votes of gun enthusers have to cut more weight than the senate than people clamoring from gun control. on the other hand, it's nice wayne lapierre can take time

from shopping for suits and mansions to cal the presidel th on this issue. but i think republicans have milked all of the seats they can get out of that issue. in '94 when the assault weapons ban passed, the democratic party was a lot more rural and southern and centrist. it's now more rural and diverse. i'm not sure it's a winner for democrats in the house election in every district but it's no longer a thing that can't be touched if you're a democrat. >> charlie sykes, could you please explain, i have had conversations this week, why are republicans awol on guns? why is it not even debated? i asked two reporters, am i missing something on this? is there a big friction happening behind the scenes and he said absolutely not. explain the republican position on guns. >> yes, believe it or not, it's not just the money from the nra, and the public opinion polls i don't think fully captured

intensity of the power of the gun lobby. and i think what republicans tell themselves is look, this is part of our core constituency. in 2020 we can't afford to have any part of our base not aroused and any part of our base be demoralized so we cannot be perceived to be weak on this. the nra is sbeet beset by scand weakened. donald trump probably could bring republicans along if he switched. but bottom line, donald trump feels, and a lot of republicans feel, that he won in pennsylvania, in ohio and michigan and wisconsin on the back of this gun issue. not because it's overwhelmingly popular but because of the intensity of the feeling on the part of the base. i don't think there's going to be any movement on that whatsoever. >> so to me that analysis i think explains why republicans are intractable on the issue of guns. but i think the political overlay is it speaks to trump's weakness. trump is so afraid of his base.

he can't lose a single white supremacist in this country so he can't condemn the manifesto from the killer. he can't lose a single gun owner in this country so he can't stomp a stiletto into wayne lapierre's weak spine. he's a hostage of the most extreme part of the republican base. >> white supremacist too, that could be their slogan. i think there will come a time and there will be a tipping point on this. we do know what has to be guns with universal background checks. >> of course we do. everybody does. >> it will switch just the way day marriage switched and suddenly is there will be a consensus around it. not until then, of course, and -- terrific time to cover it. >> explain for everyone in the car. what's the cover? >> all of the words associated with gun violence and in that little -- i was there today actually -- in that little red box it's what we have to take, action against guns. but the problem is, as you say,

his base is small, it's vanishing, it's ephemeral. and if he doesn't do the loud dog whistle in favor of gun reform, he's afraid of losing votes. i don't think it's about gun use in particular but sending the message to white voters, hey, you're on our side. >> if i were a democrat running for president and i knew the way to bother trump, the way to get him to send angry tweets from aboard air force one flying from one grieving community to another is call him weak, call him afraid and threaten him politically. that's really all he cares about. we have proof point after proof point that he's politically terrified. >> he is politically terrified. you're right. he's stuck in this corner because of all of the people around him purposing nra, nra president. and it's funny because he took the nra president's call but he did not take congresswoman escobar's call. it's funny, we know exactly where he stands.

this is the same organization that gave him $30 million in his presidential election. but to take politics out of it a second, people are going to die. they need to do something. mitch mcconnell needs to move. how many more kids have to die? how many churchgoers have to die? how many people that go to the club have to die? how much more blood do we need to see before they act? it's not going to end unfortunately with what we saw this past weekend. it is going to continue and the blood going to be on their hands if they do not act. we can move forward with a background check. that's easy. there's a bill that came out of the house that mitch mcconnell just has to move forward with it. just one step. and that's the sad part. just take all of the politics out of it, people are going to continue to die. >> charlie sykes, we will give you last words. i hear you looming. >> i do think on this topic and our previous topic, a lot of

republicans are realizing the price tag for the bargain is coming through. they were saying by playing dog whistles and going after the squad, we are sending the missage to our base and this will work for us. now they realize oh, my goodness, by doing this we're alienating this broad swath of voters. we're going to be absolutely wiped out in the suburbs of the states that we think we need to win. but i think they're trapped. i do think they're trapped. they're afraid to the move away from the base. as a result of this they're finding out exactly what the consequences are for this deal they made. let's go along, let's keep our heads down, let's enable and rationalize donald trump and now they're stuck with all of this. >> they sure are. after the break, raids targeting hundreds of immigrant workers leave children in mississippi stranded on the first day of school in that state. that state. ting right and staying ac? on it! audrey thinks she's doing all she can to manage her type 2 diabetes and heart disease, but is her treatment doing enough to lower her heart risk?

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on the very same day donald trump visited a community torn apart by a man linked to an online manifesto regarding the invasion of immigrants, this is what happened in mississippi. i.c.e. plants across the state arresting nearly 700, mostly latino undocumented workers. >> it was the largest single-day one state sweep in u.s. history. >> it was also the first day of school for much of mississippi. the washington post write -- because their parents were detained in the raid. volunteers set up a make-shift shelter for the children in a gym. joe biden said on a day when president trump is supposed to be embracing a grieving community and sell operating our american diversity in el paso, his administration is instead stoking fear by conducting massive immigration raids in mississippi. he is morally unfit to lead this country. joining our conversation nbc

news correspondent julia ainsley. julia, i worked in the white house, i know that a raid gets planned in advance, and it's down the chain of command from even the secretary. but there's never a scenario where the secretary of an agency can't call and say, hey, i saw on the news yesterday that you're going to these funerals, the community is ripped apart by some of the hate-filled language in the killer's screed about invasions of immigrants. do you want us to wait a week? the white house surely, surely could've made this not happen if it didn't want it to. >> it's true. it's hard to believe that they didn't know this was going to happen because it is so full scale. it's something that the president has been calling for, for a while, which is large-scale immigration raids. we know he didn't get what he wanted in june and he didn't get it in july. we've seen, nicole, dozens of times where i.c.e. does call off immigration raids because say there's a hurricane headed toward the area where they want to arrest people.

say there's some other issue where all of a sudden it gets out that they are going to do raids. they will cancel the raids in that case. but i also have a few numbers i can update us on because i just got off of a call with i.c.e. officials and a u.s. attorney for the southern district of mississippi. if you're ready for that, nicole. >> yeah. >> first of all they say that there were 277 that were released. those people still have court dates. about 370 still remain in custody. some were released about 32 were released at the worksite for humanitarian reasons. and they say that 18 of those who were released were juveniles. there was a child as young as 14 working in these facilities. so, that's an update on the numbers -- again, just because they're released doesn't mean that they are living in fear. they still have a court date that they'll have to go to. what really stood out to me were we've learned that the head of mississippi detective for child prekive services says she she

was not given a heads up. and on this call officials said we notified the schools. but when reporters pushed on -- well, when did you notify schools because obviously this had a rippling effect the first day of school across the state of mississippi. they said, well, we told them when we were going in to do the arrests. so it's not as if these schools had any kind of real heads up. the other thing i got a chance on the call to ask mr. hurtz, who is the u.s. attorney for the southern district of mississippi, point blank what is about the employers, what about these companies if you're trying to send a message, why aren't they in trouble right now? and he said i'm going to have to remain vague on that. there could mean that there's an ongoing investigation. but i also asked is it because perhaps these companies cooperated, handed over their employees, knew full well what would happen when their employees came to work that day. for that they may be able to get some sort of lighter fine or lighter penalty for hiring these illegal workers. there was nothing he could comment october but, to me,

that's the biggest question. >> julia is absolutely right. workplace enforcement has always been at the center of any policy conversation about comprehensive immigration reform, that it's not the migrants or the immigrants' fault for taking the jobs. it's the employer's fault. >> and these are very interesting invaders, nicole, aren't they? they envad this country and they go to work in a factory to afford food and they pay taxes going in and out. the problem is not the undocumented immigrants who are hard-working people who want their children to go to school. the problem is the employers who are illegally hiring them and they know they're doing that. and by the way they're probably backers of the president. >> the problem is us. we are the ones who are eating the chicken and the hamburgers and the vegetables and the blueberries and everything else that these people into the country and are employed to

provide for us our food. we are all part of an economic system that relies on their labor. and when i see a story like this, i think, look, the government has the right to enforce the immigration law and so does i.c.e. but we should all think about who is benefitting and who is being hurt and what cost we are along to bear for the comforts that we have. >> this also, though, you know, the president's political message about immigration is not about these people. the president's message about immigration, the 2,000 facebook ads are about an invasion. these are people getting up and commuting in rushhour traffic to their jobs and factories in towns where their addresses are readily available. this isn't even when the president's language of being at war against immigrant has been really going at a rally. this isn't who he's talking about. >> and i'll take you even back to 2015 when he announced he wanted to go after the criminals. he's moved the goal post because

we were never going after criminals. it's mom and dads. and we are traumatizing children. we put children in cages, we separate them from their family, and this is just another version of his zero-tolerance policy this is what we are doing under our name. he's doing this under our name. and, you know, it's just cruelty. it continues to be the cruelty of the trump administration. >> julia ainsley, thank you for this important reporting. we're going to sneak in our last break. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured and left those doubts behind. i faced reminders of my hep c every day. but in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured. even hanging with friends i worried about my hep c. but in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured. mavyret is the only 8-week cure for all common types of hep c. before starting mavyret your doctor will test if you've had hepatitis b which may flare up

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watching. my thanks to charlie sykes, karine jean-pierre, and nick confessore. i'm nicole. "mtp daily" with my friend chuck todd starts now. ♪ welcome to thursday. democrats united by division. the 2020 candidates who are at each other's throats last week sure seem to be united on a message now. and it's all against one man. plus, how el paso and dayton have transformed the 2020 conversation. democratic presidential candidate steve bullock will weigh in. and why is president trump so interested in possibly freeing disgraced illinois governor rod blagojevich? i have a theory. welcome to thursday. it's "mtp daily." i am chuck todd here in washington. divisive may be the best way to sum up pre