good evening, welcome to politicsnation, tonight's lead --

right now, our country's legal system is being pushed to the limit over the criminal investigation of former president, donald trump. this morning, in my capacity of ahead of national action network, i lit a prayer vigil for district attorney brig, as he faces a death threat for doing his job. that job has been to investigate donald trump's role in hush money payments to an adult film star. there were no indictments in the case this week, even after the former president predicted there would be. but the grand jury continued this proceeding on monday. trump will hold a campaign rally in waco, texas, in a few hours from now. where he will likely hurled more insults and veiled threats at brag and other prosecutors

for investigating him right now. attacking them once again for doing their job to uphold the law. the former president appeared to be getting help with that on capitol hill, three house gop chairman sent another letter to brag just hours ago. insisting that he turn over documents related to the hush money investigation. a demand brag calls, quote, unprecedented. earlier this week, we had with us our trump lawyer, -- standing by. and later, or going to look at how the justice system works in this country, for those who aren't politically powerful. civil rights attorney, ben crump, will join me along with the mother of -- of the video of her son's death at the hands of the the police, were released earlier this week. no, seven cops and three security officers are facing second degree murder charges.

i'll be talking to them and i'll be giving the eulogy at that young man's funeral this wednesday. first, we're joined by joe -- defense attorney representing donald trump. joe, thank you for joining us. i appreciate you coming on. it's a bit tough, but a respectful conversation. you and i have worked together on mcmillan case, you've done the show with mike mill, a$ap rocky and others. that's why i want to talk to you, why would someone like you, with respect you have, and still have with me, represent donald trump? and what many of your friends, many of people like me, consider a racist who has now put this district at her internees life in danger. >> you know, i spoke to a lot of people. yourself, some of my clients, who you know, we just talked to some of them.

rocky and meek and others, about doing just that. you know, i'm a litigator. i represent people on the far left, as you know, i was on the biden national extraction network one of the greatest achievements i've received. -- >> that was something that was important. i represent people on the right, in the middle. i'm a political when it comes to litigation. what i do, is take things steadily. this case, i believe in. i believe in this case, and the other cases i'm representing former president trump on. because i believe that the rule of law is in jeopardy. that's why i'm so passionate about these cases. we have to represent, as defense lawyers represent people who may be unpopular, obviously, he's popular some people, unpopular with others. the rule of law and what it means to apply here, when we start to stretch the law to get a political opponent, which i believe is the case here, it is really possible to return that law towards original shape, ever.

we're in a situation, no there's no one else, reverent, who will be prosecuted. with the same set of facts other than donald trump by alvin bragg. >> let me put you on that, i think that you raised something, the facts as this case has unraveled, clearly is contradicting. alvin bragg, the manhattan da, is the same alvin bragg that would not go forward with the case when he first came to office, correct? two of his -- a.d.a.'s designed, one wrote a book. clearly, alvin bragg must have seen, almost a year later, or had presented to them, evidence that does say he has to uphold the law. if he was doing something political, he'd already decided not to go it, he was attacked, he was maligned, and he didn't do it. so, if there's anyone that would be -- for me to believe was doing something political, it would be a guy who didn't do the case in the first place. what everybody wanted to. >> he came under an enormous

amount of pressure, -- >> the pressure was over. >> when that book was released, after he went on 60 minutes, he talked about how bragg would not go forward. it was then that he took a case that was deemed dead on arrival. >> after was over. >> the book did not make the best sellers list. >> i hope not. >> but there was pressure. >> no one else would be prosecuted for doing what his alleged. -- >> people have been prosecuted. you have people that have been prosecuted that have been cited right on the station. a lady about a couch that she turned in the wrong receipts. there's all kinds of cases. >> it's very simple. you have a lawyer, who paid a woman, ten years after the alleged sex act. >> okay. >> right before an election, he was reimbursed by your client. how is that not a -- >> it clearly not. >> why? >> talk to massive extension here, in campaign finance law

which i become expert in, i look at bradley smith the former head of the ftc, unlike john edwards, this was personal funds. there's a massive mistake here. >> it doesn't matter. >> there's a statutory. >> what was the intent of the payment. >> it matters to himself in his family, even michael cohen said that, under oath when he pled guilty, -- >> you are saying that michael cohen paid the store, the poor no star, so that donald trump wouldn't be embarrassed to his family. and it's just coincidentally happened a couple weeks before the election. for ten years they weren't worried about it. >> she came for when he was running for presidency, she can cover for ten years before. some might call it extortion. but putting that aside, reverent, listen to me, it has to be a campaign finance law violation. it has to be exclusively done for the campaign. >> you and i would it -- >> let me read back your statement, she came forward two weeks before the election, which meant you are reacting to be elected. >> it meant your reacting to an

extortion attempt, to hide something that didn't happen, the president says it didn't happen. she said it did now, before she said it didn't happen. here's the thing, when michael cohen pled guilty, then now cooperative against donald trump. you said two things, this was done for the election, and was done to protect the president and his family for personal embarrassment. that takes out the realm of personal campaign finance law, because we use personal funds. listen, the bright line is simply this. the expenditure of payment was made with personal funds, would it have been made irrespective of the campaign? the answer is wondrous and yes. -- i've done these every single day. every single day. >> donald trump has been accused of many things in those ten years, that he could've been personally embarrassed by. he didn't pay, and he did have his lawyer pay. you're gonna tell me, by some coincidence -- >> there were no settlement in the last ten years. confidential, that supposed to be confidential. they're confidential as opposed to be. i can say plenty but their potential. >> before the election, you had

his lawyer that made the payments say, it was because of the election. and because of personal embarrassment to himself in his fame. >> does it matter. >> it does. >> because of the election, an election violation. i'm not a lawyer. >> the ftc chairman said it does matter if it was something for a personal funds were used, other than exclusively the campaign, then it's out of campaign finance law. you could pay with tax funds, you gotta pay with campaign funds. >> if mr. donald trump reimbursed a lawyer, for paying this woman at a time that there was going to be damage to his campaign, it is, in fact, about his campaign. >> no. >> that is campaign finance. laura >> lowe, the law has to be exclusively for the campaign. >> your defense, if there is an indictment, is that, well, he did it for the campaign, but he also did it because he would've been embarrassed. that's the defense? >> no, the defensive there is no crime committed. what is the crime here? please explain to me. >> the crime is that you have a

lawyer, pay hush money, which is on behalf of donald trump to prevent any embarrassment or any kind of issue before the campaign. >> you just laid out our defense. reverent, i appreciate that. >> that campaign finance. >> i said because of the camp. it >> any personal embarrassment. i did not say personal bears. >> you did. >> let me get your reaction to something else. we can disagree on the law. even though i'm not a lawyer. i can speak to that. they're not lawyers in the grand jury, by the way. let's go to some of trump's statement about the investigation, because they seem to have a pattern of behavior. last week, he lashed out repeatedly on manhattan da alvin bragg. on thursday, calling him a, quote, animal. backed by jewish billionaire, george soros. she did this on truth social media site. they later, just after trump

looked promised death and destruction, i'm showing what he wrote. if he was indicted, he said death and destruction. the da received a letter containing a non hazardous powder. and the note that read, alvin, i'm going to kill you. this morning. does he have no obligation, that some who held the highest office in the land, can actively seek all that office again, does he have some obligation to denounce the kind of violent threats that alvin bragg is facing. or at least not making the statements that appear to be encouraging that kind of behavior. >> listen, reverent, honestly, i am not here to defend all things donald trump. i'm here to defend this case. donald trump is donald trump. >> does he have an obligation to denounce the rhetoric and what has happened to donald -- to alvin bragg. we have a prayer rally for

alvin bragg, this man's family. could be under serious threat. >> what was said to melvin bragg, has only two with donald trump. >> because donald trump had nothing to do with. >> donald drunk wrote death and destruction. she announced that he was going to be indicted tuesday. >> that came from leaks. >> the post with about. >> no he didn't, let me explain it. >> just a minute, there was a picture with a bet that someone had put together, that he re-posted. did he not? >> when i witnessed answer the question? >> i'm about to enter the question. >> did he re-post? it >> however that post was, repulsed-ing, that -- >> does that mean that he didn't re-post? >> will he did re-post. >> i know we took down when he realized what it was in that photo. he was posting an article. >> i stab your go back but i took the knife out. >> before was damaged. >> before -- >> so if you are alvin bragg, and his family, and you see a re-post by the former president

and the knighted states, with a bat next to your name. >> that was not his. photo without seeing the picture. when he saw people notified, he took it down. >> you're telling the american public, donald trump didn't see the picture? >> i'm telling the american public, we discuss the case in the facts, social media is not what i do, i'm not a pr person, donald trump, i'm here to litigate the case. there is no crime in this case. so, i can understand why he's becoming upset, he is becoming politically persecuted. look, people on the left, people on the right, no one's country should want to weaponize the justice system to go after political opponents. reverend, -- >> i agree. >> that is why -- that is why there's -- people want to get people. >> if alvin bragg was going political, and listening to political pressure, he would've done it a year ago when he didn't do it. -- >> everyone, everyone from the left. >> once they resign, there wasn't political, they wouldn't do it.

>> no, no. >> now is doing it because of pressure. >> ahmed and the way we started, i respect you and we were together. >> thank you, reverend. >> do you feel donald trump has an obligation to deal with the threats that are now pouring into the da's office? >> i can tell, you donald trump does not want anyone threatened in this case. >> does he guess speaking that does he have the obligation? to denounce it i am not speaking on his behalf regarding his personal obligation as a leader i'm here is a lawyer. reverent, i'm sorry i can't answer those questions anyway believe me i understand. i'm not argue with you about that. by the way. you understand. i'm not argue with you. i know he's made it clear he doesn't want anyone threatened alvin bragg. that's what he said. >> do you know that for the first time in my life, the new york post and i agree that this is outrageous, that in the defenses that he may not have seen -- you are a great lawyer but even you can get the jury to believe

that. thanks for coming and sharing your insight tonight. >> thank you very much, sir. >> thank you for your time. and i hope you will come back, if there is -- >> reverend, whenever you want that. >> even if there is not an indictment let's talk about it. moving on, the prospects of the former president being indicted is nearly unprecedented in american history. and we have mentioned trump phrases, possible criminal charges in multiple cases across multiple jurisdictions right now. joining me now to talk about it, nbc's legal analyst danny cevallos. donny, thanks for coming on to explain something for us. starting broadly, what's your immediate reaction to what we just heard from trump's defense attorney joe tacopina. >> look, i mean, there is a lot of very helpful information about the defense of the case. i suspect that with it, the misdemeanor charges, falsifying business records, i think mr.

tacopina would probably agree that that presents that greatest threat. but at the same time, if it is a misdemeanor, i do know what mr. tacopina would say, well, wait a minute, it was michael cohen that initiated these payments. it was michael cohen who got reimbursed. trump believed he was being legal fees. and michael cohen, michael cohen, michael cohen is that guy. but we've all known for about a long time that if there's a prosecution, the defense will stand on the idea that michael cohen as a liar and a fraudster. and of course, the prosecution will use michael cohen likely do while cooperating with witnesses, and say, okay he may be a criminal, but it takes a criminal to catch a criminal. but beyond michael cohen, this case will be a document case. and it's true there are checks made out to michael cohen, but they are made out to michael cohen, which may bolster trump's argument that in fact it was just doing what his lawyer told him to do and paid his lawyer directly. and joe tacopina is right and that michael cohen did go in and plead guilty, and did testify to the state that the

payments were made to save trump and his family harm. and he is right, under federal election law, as long as that one reason is there, he may not even matter that there are additional reasons -- helping the campaign. so, if you had family embarrassment, that trump's, sorry for the pun, the campaign reason for the payments. so, all in all, look, this is a case that you can see a path of conviction, but you can also see a path to acquittal. and if reasonable minds can disagree, that might mean reasonable doubt. >> now, does it matter that we do not know what stormy daniels may testify when she is called, say what she was told that this was -- whether it was relating directly to the election, says joe tacopina, and said that he she had came out with this because of the election. could there not be a connection based on what miss daniels says? >> this is my view on stormy

daniels and michael cohen. it is just this rhetorical question. do any of us out there still have any questions or doubts or wonder at all that what stormy daniels or michael cohen would say to a grand jury. michael cohen has a podcast. he wrote a book. he testified before congress. he goes on all the shows. so, no one really has any doubt with michael cohen. i think it is fairly safe to say, we all know everything that stormy daniels has to say. and we've known it for five, six years. so, even if she came in and dispatched -- and ultimate criminal prosecution, i think we largely know what that testimony would be. and of course, thinking like mr. tacopina, you're gonna have plenty of things to cross examine, stormy daniels and michael cohen about. but stormy daniels, the fact that she entered into this agreement, and i think if stormy daniels becomes a witness, the defense will make an argument that she was arguably an extortionist, although i don't think the facts support that because the facts aren't traditional

extortions. it is more like she was shopping your story, and then maybe they were gonna try and buy it. so, it is not a traditional extortion condition, but i totally understand where mr. tacopina is coming from because that's the way they're gonna frame it, if this case goes to trial. >> now, you've seen trump's reaction to his indictment all week long on his truth social site, including a repose that appears to show trump aiming at alvin bragg's head with a baseball bat. you heard tacopina, and i just talk about it. and others calling for bragg and other prosecutors, new york attorney general chris chains, fulton county georgia da fani willis, and doj special counsel jack smith to be removed, trump has said. he wanted to see them removed from their respective roles. telling his followers last week to be prepared to protest in the event of his arrest. and now you have bragg and his staff and the manhattan's da's

office getting one hundreds hundreds of the threats, literally hundreds, including of course that letter that bragg received yesterday containing what ended up not hazardous powder. directly threatening bragg with assassination. from what you see this week, are any of trump's social posts potentially criminal? >> this is where mr. tacopina will have a bit of a challenge and could not say as much, but i'll say it. defense attorneys, all clients say moronic things sometimes. mr. tacopina can't say that, i can. and maybe he would admit it, and have tried it. but the bottom line is, sometimes our clients do really stupid things -- >> what is it -- i'm not talking moronic, i'm talking about -- you're talking about the man that said that death and destruction. let's not forget it's the same and being investigated for inciting an insurrection that

deadly destruction on the capitol. is this not criminal for him, knowing what words can do that he's being investigated for right now, for him to do this now against this prosecutor? >> yes, that's what he's getting at. he's being moronic. but is it something that goes beyond the first amendment protections? because we know that threats aren't covered by the first amendment. and in order to make that prosecution arguable, you have to take, for example, that post off the baseball bat picture next to the picture of alvin bragg, and see how trump we posted it, but that is still a constitutive threat. there you see it there. and then, you have to convince a jury of 12 beyond reasonable doubt that this was something that was directly intended as a threat. i think it is a weaker case with the pictures, maybe a stronger case when somebody goes on, and says things like, death and destruction. and, of course, any kind of encouragement of those kinds of threats or violence can absolutely be held liable if, if there's a clear and present danger, if it's a direct

threat. and if it's completely reasonable to perceive it as a threat. but the problem with that law is that no two statements are really the same. and the reality is, threats are things that sometimes reasonable minds can disagree on. and once again, when it comes to reasonable minds disagreeing, that might not give you the reasonable doubt you need. now, don't get me wrong, i think maybe you can get to an indictment on those facts, but that's not the way prosecutors to make those decisions. they should only charge the cases they believe they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt. and threat cases, especially political speech being as protected as it is, these are really tough statements to win. >> i want to thank you, because i'm out of time. but i thank you for giving us a fair and balanced analysis. danny cevallos, thank you again. let's now bring in my political panel, to msnbc contributors and political strategists, susan del percio, a republican. and juanita tolliver, a

democrat. let me start with asking you to give me your reaction to what you just heard from joe tacopina. let me start with you, susan. >> i think what joe tacopina that was exactly what donald trump wanted him to do, which was to muddy the waters a bit on this case. i will say, and after hearing danny, i think this case is going to be difficult for alvin bragg. mostly because i don't think it's hard to convince one person that donald trump, whether it is because he was reported to embarrass his wife, or because he had a -- with his wife, wanted this money to go as hush payment. that being said, i'm not an attorney. but what donald trump has done now has been so dangerous to our democracy and our judicial system. and that's because he's trying

to weaponize our court. when he said i'm going to be arrested tuesday, i want people to be up and on. you want to see protesters. he wanted to raise money and talk about it, one point $5 million, maybe not as much as he's used to, but he's still raised over 1 million dollars. at the end of the day, donald trump has to be treated like anybody else, and while i think it is a difficult case for district attorney bragg to bring forward, i think he set himself a bit between the rock and a hard place. >> juanita? >> well, politicsnation rev, tacopina was exclusively committed to rejecting reality at every point in your interview, and i appreciate that you emphasize that this grainger is not comprised of lawyers, it's comprised of regular people have some common sense, who will be able to say to the three weeks before the election, donald trump made a payment to silence someone. and it's not hard to connect those dots for regular people

with common sense. so, i think coming back to that reality is something that his attorneys are gonna have to deal with because tacopina did not have anything substantive to counter that reality about the timing -- >> that's what i was trying to get at -- the timing, i think, is going to be hard to get around. >> susan, we have some breaking news. senate minority leader mitch mcconnell has been released from the -- after receiving patient treatment following his fall and hospitalization earlier this month. nbc news is reporting that mcconnell will work from home next week and is not expected to be back in the senate until april 17th, at the earliest. susan, your reaction? >> well, i'm very happy that the senator is doing well, and he's able to be released from the hospital. obviously, we don't want to see any harm to any of our elected officials, or each other, for that matter. i think politically, and i know

it's a political matter, but mitch mcconnell, this is working up very well for him, because he wants that republicans in the house to basically step their hair on fire, and he feels, you know what, you keep doing things when it comes to real conversation, i'll be backing a forum to talk about it then. >> let's switch gears to florida governor ron desantis who seems to have been overshadowed this week by all the trump news. polling shows desantis flipping to his lowest numbers since december. in a hypothetical race for the gop presidential nomination against the former president. and in an interview with piers morgan this week the governor found himself talking more about voting than politics. >> i have to put it to you, governor, have you ever eaten a chocolate pudding with three fingers? >> i don't remember ever doing

that, i'm telling you. maybe when i was a kid, but it's interesting, you know, there's a lot of people, when they go at shia, sometimes they have wrecked really good ammunition, like you did this, you did that. for me, they're talking about putting, like is that really the best you've got? okay, bring it on. >> juanita, it is still very early, desantis hasn't even declared his candidacy at. what's your take on how he's performed so far? >> i think he needs a new -- who should have told morgan don't ask that question, first informants. but number two, i think he's working on his skills, like he has to backtrack on his equate comments. he barely took a swipe for trump about this potential indictment out of new york. he needs to figure out what his position is going to be because it is gonna be another republican who sits along while trump's calls for violence and action against prosecutors, but, rev, it's really early on.

he still needs to establish himself quickly because it's not gonna be -- >> susan, how is he doing so far, quickly? >> not to great, but at the end of the day, he doesn't have a political team in place. i won't worry about the polls. of course he's higher than december, after he came off in a huge win. he hasn't done anything to increase his recognition or favor ability in those polls. he's taking a certain route of being an elected official and only an elected official until june. it may be dangerous but only time will tell. >> susan del percio and juanita tolliver, thank you both. new video showing how law enforcement treated a virginia black man before his death is now public. after the break -- the mother of that young man and civil rights attorney ben crump join me to discuss next steps in their fight for justice. ♪ ♪ ♪ with nucala. nucala is a once-monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma that can mean less oral steroids.

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>> welcome back to politicsnation. in the coming days, i will be eulogizing -- irvine otieno. i'm just trying to stay say it properly, the 28-year-old who died in police custody earlier this month at a mental health facility in virginia. and there were surveillance footage released tuesday with no audio, showing the man's final moments, as he's being pinned down to the ground, handcuffed, and shackled by a sheriff's deputy and staff for about 20 minutes. he was held down until his body was motionless and the staff began unsuccessful resuscitation. ten people involved in this incident have been charged with second degree murder and his

death. joining me now is caroline ouko who is the mother of irvine otieno, and civil rights attorney general, black american ben crump. let me go to the mother first of all, and let me again talk -- we talked on the phone, give you my complete condolences and extreme sorrow for your loss. and when irvine was sent to a mental health facility, this is not what you expected to happen. can you describe the type of person irvine was and what type of support where you looking for him to receive while at the facility? >> thank you so much for having me on your so. this is an honor. and to allow me to talk about my lovely boy. irvine otieno. irvine was a young man that was

having a mental health crisis. i was looking for help and never thought he would end up dead. they took the life out of him. i never expected him not to come back home. we can't prevent mental health illness -- mental illness should not be a death sentence for anyone looking for help. they should get that help that they need. >> why is it important that surveillance video it's police to the public? what do you hope will come from this case? >> i think it's important to

release the surveillance video because seeing is delivering. i don't know what to expect. and when i saw the videos, i was able to comprehend what my son went through. and so, i think it is important for the public -- it is important, as a parent, as anyone, you know, any citizen, to be able to see what went on. >> attorney crump, prosecutors have said state police investigators were told that irvine had become combative during admission to the facility. what is your reaction to that account? what do you know about what led

to this incident? >> well, reverend al, as caroline had said, her baby boy irvine with having a mental health crisis. and there is nothing at that video, reverend al, that we see that was justified them literally smothering him to death. i mean, they had seven officers and three security guards on top of him for 12 minutes, reverend al. i mean, why would police officers ever put a person who's handcuffed and with leg irons on his ankles completely restrained. i mean, almost lifeless, when you look at the video, reverend al. but yet they smothered him to death. mental health crises for people should not be equal to death sentences.

and that's why we need you, reverend al, because this is happening far too often in america. >> well, i'll be there with you and the mother on wednesday for the funeral and beyond, and whatever the family needs. let me ask you this, while i have you on, to switch gears to other cases you're involved in. there is a new development in the tyre nichols case in memphis. it was decided yesterday as for memphis police officers are involved in the beating and death of 29 year old tyre nichols. it they cannot work as long enforcement again in the state of tennessee, according to a state panel. what do you make of this and how do you see this helping the trial? >> it is very important, reverent, just like i hoped the officers of irvine otieno would be barred from being released -- when you use excessive force, like what we saw in the videos with tyre, you should lose your

certification. you should not be able to go from one department to the other department as if nothing happened. but that's what happened when you know, 12 year old in cleveland, and so many other cases that we've champion for. one department, after killing a black person -- and then, uses excessive force again another department. so, they should be decertified so they cannot again show their propensity to treat black people unjustly, reverend, treat them rather like citizens. >> i want to ask you about the latest with raheem connors investigation. on tuesday, the mississippi bureau of investigation announced the state medical examiner could not reasonably determine his cause of death. now, what's next in this journey for connor's family? >> or ask him -- civil rights

division of the department of justice to take over this investigation. remember, reverend al, with this young man, he told his mother about, you know, being chased by a truckload of white people in mississippi. and then, he was caught and decapitated -- 200 people were there, and the sheriff said, they didn't think there was any reason to suspect foul play. how could you say that is not felt play, if a mississippi lynching, and we have to get answers, because raheem carter could not die of that cause. >> well, let me say, carolyn, i will do all i can to raise this issue about your son. i think irvine otieno it's a symbol of many, and you are a

symbol of many mothers who have to deal with young sons and daughters with mental health issues. it should not, as you said so eloquently, be a death sentence. and those that have done it ought to be held accountable. caroline ouko and benjamin crump, i thank you both for being with us and for joining us to talk about this very difficult story. just ahead -- time is running out. the tiktok, as the company deals with threats to sell or face a ban in the u.s.. my guests explain why he is among the few in congress fighting against that man after the break, we'll hear from him. ♪ ♪ ♪ you're just gonna stand there? or are ya gonna take your lawn back. we're gonna take it back. we're gonna take it back. with scotts turf builder triple action! it gets three jobs done at once - kills weeds. prevents crabgrass. and keeps your lawn growing strong. glorious! -agggghhhhhh! -aaagghhhh. no no no.

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yes! ♪ ♪ ♪ april 5th. rated pg. >> welcome back to politicsnation. my next guest is in your congressman jamaal bowman. thank you for joining me today, congressman. let's get started with yesterday, trump escalated his weathering against manhattan district attorney alvin bragg wanting to, quote, potential death and destruction, if he's charged with the hush money payment made during his 2016 campaign. on thursday, your republican house colleagues demanded testimony from da bragg, calling his investigation an abuse of prosecutorial authority. but earlier this evening, those

robin lawmakers sent an eight-page letter to da bragg making their case for why congress should be privy to documents and testimony in the ongoing investigation. now, congressman, what is your take on house republicans trying to second guess this democratically elected da's work, while it is still in progress? congressman? we can't hear you. you are muted. >> we have no jurisdiction over district attorney bragg, period. this is intimidation. this is a pressure campaign trying to stop the aid brag from doing his job. this is following the vile, disgusting language from donald trump, in which he referred to da bragg as an animal. and this is the playbook of maga republicans and the

far-right, whenever anyone challenge them, especially a person of color, they seek to undermine and do everything they can to stop that person from being effective and being seen as competent in the work that they are doing. da bragg has an exemplary career. he is not out here playing politics. he is doing his job at the highest level, and again, congress has no jurisdiction over da bragg or any district attorney duly elected in their state as they seek to indict and prosecute anyone they believe to have broken the law. >> trump attacks black prosecutors, whether in georgia or in new york, and calling them names like animals and other despicable names. a few moments ago, like i said, the threat is a real concern to

me, and it's one that has been -- these things are not a joke. you wake up, somebody is crazy. if you don't believe, then look at the case from january 6th. let me go to another subject with you. congress is holding hearings this week on a proposal to a ban about popular social media app tiktok. critics argue that chinese owned platform poses a serious national security threat. you are one of the few lawmakers from either party who have vocally opposed such a ban, and you've expressed concern about what you call other xenophobic, anti china rhetoric surrounding the issue. can you explain your position, a little further? >> so, republicans cannot govern on issues, so they often use fearmongering tactics to displace display themselves as being strong lawmakers. so, whether it is fearmongering, as it deals with the border, or the death limit, or crime, or

china, this is how they govern. and i'm disappointed that some democratic lawmakers are responding to them and acquiescing to this rhetoric. we need to take a step back, and if we want to really analyze social media, the harms that happen on facebook, twitter, youtube, google, microsoft, amazon, i can argue, are far worse than what tic tac tiktok has presented. facebook knew russia was colluding with trump in 2016 and looked the other way. they did nothing to stop this from happening. our data is being bought and sold on the open market by countries like china and private corporations and other countries. so, to ban tiktok is to, you know, put a ban on maybe a small group versus what's

happening in the social media landscape. we need a national data privacy piece of legislation, and that's what we should be focused on, not scapegoating tiktok. >> congressman, on thursday, you unveiled the law teaching less testing act, which is a proposal that will make classroom teaching time a priority over standardized test preparation. why this legislation is meaningful at this point? many of us are very much concerned about it. quickly, please, not a lot of time, but i think it's important to explain. >> in this case, i've been on it for 20 years, as you know before coming to congress. we've been testing goods for 20 years. we still don't have 100% literacy rates, or we haven't even called achievement gap. so, we need to focus more on teaching than deal with the skills that kids need, but also the variety of schools with kids have. kids love to build things and work with their hands. kids are artists and musicians and athletes. they love working in groups.

they are curious. they have big imagination. and we need to help them problem solved. in a circle, circling on a test every year is not necessary. we can dramatically decrease it, and improve the results we have been getting, because we haven't been getting the results that we claim to be fighting for. >> representative jamaal bowman, thank you as always for giving us your time. after the break -- my final thoughts. stay with us. ♪ ♪ ♪ oven roasted turkey. all on the subway club. three peat - that's great. three meat - that's epic. the subway series. the greatest menu of all time. why give your family just ordinary eggs when they can enjoy the best? eggland's best. the only eggs with more fresh and delicious taste. plus, superior nutrition. which is now more important than ever. ♪♪ moderate-to-severe eczema. it doesn't care if you have a date,... ...a day off,... ...or a double shift. make your move and get out in front of eczema...

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>> tomorrow, i will be in chicago, illinois. i will join ministers and civil rights activists and the general population to get out the vote loudly, calling on people to come out and the runoff election on april 4th to choose the next mayor of chicago, a city that has had violence, gun violence, and police brutality. and they need to choose the

right person that they feel can bring the city together, to deal with that as well as other challenges. i have invited both candidates, both brandon johnson and -- to be on the show live from chicago before i go and speak at the rally. and brandon johnson will be on the show live from chicago on tomorrow. let me say also in closing tonight, i joined the nation in mourning the passing of randall robertson, founder of trans africa, a true giant in the field of human rights and human dignity. he helped to sensitize this country and the western world about apartheid in south africa and civil disobedience unlike we've seen on that level before on a consistent basis, as well as his fight for haiti. may randall roberson rest in peace and power. you served us well. we'll be right back.

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>> that does it for me. thanks for watching. i'll see you back here tomorrow at 5 pm eastern for another live hour of politicsnation. american voices with alicia menendez starts right now on msnbc. >> thank you so much, reverend sharpton. what a show you had! we are going to be revisiting some of that. hello to you at home. i am alicia menendez. we will begin this wnd