there's anything bad for donald trump at any time because they know they'll be drummed out of trump world if they do that. the truth is it's rare to see movement in the race and you're seeing it as you suggested, certainly moderately but you're seeing a significant and noticeable jump for joe biden that's not good for trump world, not good for donald trump. we'll see if that continues. you know, over the course of the biden presidency there have not been a lot of periods of time that have looked good for him, certainly in the last few weeks it's looking better for him. >> we know that pressure, political or legal, causes outbursts for donald trump we'll watch what he has to say tonight. jonathan allen, thank you we'll talk to you again soon. thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" with us on this tuesday morning.

"morning joe" starts right now. and good morning, welcome to "morning joe," it is tuesday april 2nd. we have a lot to get to this morning, including the expanded gag order in donald trump's -- jonathan, just have a seat -- >> may as well put my lipstick on. >> someone is passing notes. >> just getting set from the show. i had to mov from over here to over there. i had to put stuff down. >> right behind willie. >> sorry. have a seat. >> are you ready for us to begin the class? >> yes, let's do it. >> i know it's your first day. >> queue it up -- >> her name is mika. ♪♪ welcome everyone to "morning joe." >> that's a beautiful shot. >> if we still even have you.

thank you for joining us. i think it's tuesday, everybody is in their seats and we'll get to all that's going on this morning. the expanded gag order in donald trump's hush money case comes as the former president came up with the cash needed to appeal for his civil fraud judgment. we'll talk about that. on wall street, truth social looks more like a meme stock with shares lower -- >> i'm not sure of wall street, willie but who saw that coming? a company that is losing money from the very beginning who would have guessed it dropped. >> a company that loses money isn't probably worth $8 billion? >> kind of. >> yeah. exactly. also we're going to get -- >> i'm waiting for that call from wall street for you and me. >> we dropped the hint for like 15 years. >> exactly.

>> look at j.p. morgan. >> i feel like i'm a goldman. >> a goldman guy? >> yes. >> we need those two guys. right? >> right. >> good times and bad. >> now back to a two-shot. i guess tj is directing again. >> two shot. >> can you believe alabama won? >> i was very happy when alabama won. >> that's why joe looks the way he does. >> 30-0 run. >> tied 23-23 -- my parents went to illinois so i'm a fan and then it was 53-23, a 30-0 run. uconn men's team is one of the best that we've seen i can't remember since when in a long, long time. so balanced and so good. tough task for alabama but maybe pull off the upset. >> in the final four for the first time ever. >> okay. right here, back to me now, one shot -- >> one shot. >> plus talk about the key abortion rulings.

>> one shot? >> yes. good-bye. this is a major story, could the appearance of a measure on the november ballot put the state in play for democrats? a lot to talk about there, including just explaining what happened yesterday along with joe, willie and me we have the host of "way too early" he's made himself known, jonathan lemire, eddie claude jr. and molly john baste, and the great eugene robinson is with us. let's begin with the latest. this is interesting we don't do these every day but the latest morning consult survey shows president biden holding a two point advantage over donald trump 44 to 42. that's within the poll's margin

and error. what's interesting is it's a big shift from january survey which found trump leading biden 45% to 40%. the swing towards biden is partly due to an increase in support among independents. in january, independents backed trump by 10 points, 38% to 28%. in the latest poll, biden and trump were tied 34% each. what do you think? >> we say it's trend lines. this is one of many polls but we're saying that more often. this is one of many polls. one of many polls. what we saw last week was a poll that showed biden making great strides and doing it on the strength of younger voters coming home. now we're seeing biden making strides on the strength of independents coming home. i think it was dan pfeiffer saying the importance of the state of the union address

wasn't giving him a bump but it proved the republican lie. that this is a guy who gave better than he got. and it's actually house republicans and donald trump that are looking like, you know -- >> it's interesting because that's what the biden campaign want it is public to believe and us to believe, the more they see of joe biden, and in contrast they see of donald trump, the more independents in particular are going to like joe biden. they saw the state of the union, seen a bump since then for the president, he looks solid they're up to this. and now donald trump, they're sighing the repulsive stuff on social media and the courtroom antics. and people are starting to tune back in and say i don't want to see this show again, this movie again. >> and two things going on also

right now. you have trump getting more poor by the day. all these people, they're just tweets. they're not just tweets. no. call for authoritarian. this isn't just tweets. this is calling for the assassination of political opponents. you have that on one side. especially these wall street guys. i'll never vote for donald trump ever. and then three days later, yeah, i'm kind of leaning towards it. which is just obscene. and this bs, joe biden is a socialist. they love to say that. really? is that why you get richer by the second? is that why you have more money than -- you know, their problem tax season is -- it really is, if they're investing in the stock market it's not that he's a socialist and they have to figure out how to hide money, it's that they're making too much money and they have to figure out how to hide the

record profits they've made this year. stock market at an all-time high. that's one side. this desperation to justify supporting the fascist because you think it may be good for your bottom line and then on the other side, the fact that joe biden is doing something, gene, that nobody has done to donald trump in all of his years in politics. he's taken it to him every day. he's mocking and ridicuing him. donald trump can't put up anymore that he cheated to win his club championship anymore without biden making a fool of him. everywhere he moves biden and his campaign are just tweaking him. mocking him. and suddenly this bully isn't looking so tough. >> absolutely. don't underestimate the mocking. this is really, you know, a lot of people sort of question that at first, is this really the right line for the biden campaign to take? i think we can now say, yes, it is. it's a very promising line for

the biden campaign to take and it drives donald trump crazy. and that's a -- that's not much of a drive, actually. he's already there, but he's going to get increasingly frantic, increasingly cornered by all these court cases by all the money he has to put up. and this is a bad period in this campaign for donald trump. and i think there's ever reason to expect that it's going to get worse. as you said, watch the trend lines. the trend lines are clearly in biden's favor right now. i know we're going to talk about florida later, about what happened in florida yesterday. you know, potentially puts that red state back in play, a state without which republicans cannot win. donald trump cannot conceivably win. at the very least he has to put a lot of time and money in

trying to defend florida. it's -- it's -- it's not the sort of rosie political picture that they like to paint down at mar-a-lago anymore. in fact, it's not looking so good for the former president. >> so i was speaking yesterday to a senior biden campaign official who said first of all in the state of the union that target message was nervous democrats that's the democrats they need to reach. joe axelrod who said joe biden needs to step aside they're saying he's our guy and not just axelrod, there's a bunch of democrats feeling better that he's up to the job. the other thing the official said to me yesterday the theory of the case has long been, the more americans hear donald trump the more they'll be repulsed by him and independents and swing voters will say we can't do that again.

the issue is trump is off stage the last month and the numbers start to move. donald trump is going to be in wisconsin, delivering his first rally in front of a crowd of people in a month. if that easter truth social is a preview, he's going to have some unhinged comments. and court pressure, he has to be in court in two weeks. this could be going south. >> the visual of him sitting in a new york city courtroom for weeks and people like his former fixer, michael cohen, stomy daniels and maybe hope hicks, i think that's going to be a rough visual for voters. and we've never had an election where one candidate is sitting in a courtroom like this for weeks and weeks. so i actually think it's really going to be a heavy lift. and just because all of this has helped him with the base, he needs to expand the electorate

in order to win. he's never worked on expanding the electorate. i think that this is a bad look for swing voters. >> and has no interest in expanding the electorate. he won't go after nikki haley's voters who are republicans. and joe biden is taking advantage of that with aides courting nikki haley's voters. but what's interesting to molly's point. the top line number is interesting but the independent swing of 10 points in a couple of months, that's where the action is in the general election. >> right. we need to brace ourselves for an unhinged trump, jonathan is right but he's in michigan, for a reason. pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, i understand the poll is a snapshot but i want to understand what the swing has been in pennsylvania, wisconsin, and michigan because we know that's what matters, right. it's great to see joe biden out

there as joe you described what's happening coming out of the state of the union. but what matters, michigan, wisconsin, pennsylvania. >> i miss those three states. you're right. if he wins those. i'm curious, jonathan, how do they feel in those states right now? >> certainly better. there are still worries about michigan. we know the gaza conflict weighs heavily there. biden aids say they think those muslim vote es or arab american voters are gone. they're not going to donald trump but they're not coming to him. they feel like they can stitch together a coalition to win. wisconsin is actually usually the closest of these three states that's the one they feel best about right now. it's trending that way. there have been some abortion decisions there of late they feel like is breaking their favor. they like the senate race there too. >> and also strangely enough,

older, white dudes have held for biden. i say it's strange because we have these sort of simplifications of how voters go. but there are older white men are doing much better for biden and i suspect it's because, you know, i guess the older you are, the more conservative you are, which usually turns you against democrats and towards republicans but here conservative with a small c looks at a guy trying to destroy their life they've known for 60, 65 years. >> and also the president has done things for seniors, capping prescription drug costs and the like. and pennsylvania is where joe biden has spent a lot of time. it's in his back yard. they could argue it's whether they can turn out voters in pittsburgh, philadelphia, young

voters, black voters. that's the whole thing. >> having democratic governors in those three states does help. >> and good senate candidates in all three. a lot going on in israel, a lot going on across the region, none of it particularly good. >> no. and we have the major news out of florida and significant legal developments in trump's trials but first go to israel. the world central aid kitchen organization said seven workers were killed yesterday in an israeli air strike in gaza. in a statement the charity said a convoy carrying workers was struck leaving a warehouse where aide was dropped off. among those killed was an american who possessed dual citizenship with canada. the organization said it is pausing its operations in the region. the idf said it was conducting a thorough review of the tragic incident.

meanwhile, the associated press reports iranian officials claim two generals and five officers were killed in an air strike in syria yesterday. the times of israel reports one of those kills was an iran revolutionary guard core senior most official in syria. four israeli officials confirmed israel launched the strike, israel has not officially commented. it happened the same day israel and the u.s. met for virtual talks to discuss alternatives to a ground invasion of rafah. let's bring in columnist david ignatius. break down what's going on here at the same time of all of this we're supplying military aid to israel, is this becoming more complicated for the biden administration? >> let me just say a word about the tragic deaths of the world central kitchen volunteers.

two weeks ago i was with chef jose andres who runs this wonderful charitable organization and he was passionate. occasionally to the point of tears in speaking about the humanitarian need of the people his workers were going to serve in gaza. it's a tragedy to see these people trying their best to keep thousands suffering now under this six month war alive. so i want to note that. our hearts go out to the people trying to help. the shadow war between israel and iran exploded yesterday in damascus, in a building currently next to the iranian embassy. who was killed there, the apparent principal target ran iranian proxy operations for the

kuds force in syria and le-bannon which means he was directing so many aspects of this one declared war against israel. it's said he was meeting to plan the next stages in gaza. so it was an important meeting. the iranians must be wondering how did the israelis have the information to target that place at that moment. this is an example to me of what israel does with sometimes chilling brilliance, this precision targeting killing. it's a sign of israelis turning to something they can do as difficult as it is at a moment when the gaza war itself remains so difficult. the head of hamas may be underground but the kuds force

chief in the region is not underground he's in a building you can strike and they did. this has all the earmarks of something approved by prime minister netanyahu. these kinds of targeted strikes are not taken without a prime minister's direct approval. we need to see this as something that netanyahu in a very frustrating moment in a war decided to do. this shows israeli force of arms at their toughest. the most excellent journalist on this wrote a book called "rise and kill first" and he says that really thousands of these operations over 30 plus years have been almost always tactical successes but you have to be honest that in terms of overall strategy they haven't brought

israel closer to the kind of settlement of these problems it seeks. >> the biden white house reached out to the iranian government said it did not know about the strike and had nothing to do with it. this was an israeli operation. i want to go back to what happened on the ground in gaza with what happened with the world kitchen group killed, apparently seven people killed in that israeli strike that israel is not -- it's not claimed the strike yet. that wonderful group that rushes in for the last decade or so in places like ukraine or haiti or wherever else they're needed to feed people. at a time the israeli mission perception has turned. the sympathies are with the israeli people over october 7th. but the white house pressure campaign on benjamin netanyahu has stepped up, this obviously makes things more difficult does it not for the white house as it tries to stand with an ally in israel? >> i think it does.

these killings need to be investigated. how did it happen that humanitarian relief workers ended up getting killed. i hope there's a sincere, deep, idf investigation they have that obligation. knowing chef jose andres, he'll continue with these missions if it is in any way possible. it's rare to find somebody in our world who's as dedicated to doing good as he is. i was in ukraine last week, rolling down the highway and i saw a convoy of world central kitchen trucks rushing towards front lines where hungry people are suffering. so he's everywhere. but we'll have to see exactly how this happened. it matters to find out the details here. >> we're going to move to ukraine and house speaker mike johnson reportedly coming around to the idea of ukraine aid so

long as he can get a political win out of it. "the new york times" reports johnson is allegedly hinging his support on a measure that would force president biden to reverse a pause on new permits for liquifieed natural gas export facilities. johnson has also discussed financing some of the aid by selling off russian sovereign assets that have been frozen and turning money into loans the ukrainians would have to pay back. the speaker has not pledged support for any option but has stated the house will address ukraine once it returns to washington next week. let's bring nbc news capitol hill correspondent ali vitali. what more do we know about this? a trump sound to that, making ukraine pay back.

>> that's an idea that's percolating in large part because we've seen the idea of giving direct aid to ukraine fall flat especially among people in johnson's house republican conference. if not ukraine it would be the appropriations package, if not appropriations it would be the border. you can pick an issue and the realities of a slim margin that is getting slimmer in the house gop becomes evident in the way that mike johnson is going to navigate the stretch going forward. the house has been on recess since last week, they come back next week. but it's the second time we heard the idea of frozen russian assets being a way to give aid to ukraine even if it's on a loan basis. this is not just something that house republicans are talking about themselves either. when president zelenskyy spoke with johnson last week we

referenced this in his tweet. so this is something that could be gaining traction but it's important note the way he's pairing it with the possibly to do more on liquified natural gas and also the idea they're going to contend with the border which is a thorny issue the entirety of the time he's been speaker, which is not the entirety of this congress. we know what happened that landed johnson into the speakership. >> you know he has to hear yes, i'm sure he's hearing from his chairmen, women running the most important foreign policy committees saying get there or we'll get there. but it looks like we're moving in that direction. >> it looks like things are moving in that direction but boy are they moving slowly.

the house doesn't even get back until next week. so meanwhile, the days pass, the clock ticks. a question for david ignatius, you were just in ukraine, you interviewed president zelenskyy what is the situation on the ground there now? how long can ukraine hold out and how are the ukrainians doing? >> so gene, he was very specific about what the delay of nearly six months in approving this package has meant for ukraine, they can't get started in building new brigades that they need for offense coming later this year or next year. he said that unless the aid comes he's going to have to shrink his lines. meaning retreat, if he's only got 2,000 of the 8,000 artillery shells he needs. the only way to handle that is to have a smaller front line

that he has to defend. so he's talking about having to move west as the russians advance. a lot of frightening possibilities. i think ukraine will be enormously relieved if the package does go through. i'm told that ukrainian soldiers in their trenches look at their phones to see what the latest news is from the u.s. congress, if you can imagine that. so this will be a morale booster for people fighting so hard in that country. just a final things. while the ukrainians have been waiting for the united states to provide this aid, they haven't just sat around, they've been developing their own weapons. they're now sending those weapons into russia. there was a strike over the last 24 hours, 1,300 kilometers from ukraine to a russian target. so they have drones of their own that can hit targets that far away. those refineries that you've seen ablaze, those have been hit by ukrainian drones. they're not waiting.

they need the weapons but they're determined not to give up. >> david ignatius, thank you so much for your insights this morning. we have a lot more to get to on "morning joe." florida's supreme court upholds the state's strict abortion ban but will allow voters to have the final say in november. we'll go over the key rulings and what they could mean down the road and explain how the issue factors into confidence that florida is winnable for the biden campaign this fall. plus we'll break down the major legal developments surrounding both donald trump's civil fraud and hush money cases. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ning joe." we'll be right back. well done, viv. you got the presents, the balloons and the raptor cake. now, how about something to put a smile on your face?

aspen dental provides complete, affordable care with dentists and labs in one place plus free exams and x-rays for new patients without insurance... and 20% off treatment plans for everyone. quality care at a price worth celebrating. it's one more way aspen dental is in your corner. ♪ today, my friend you did it, you did it, you did it... ♪ centrum silver is now clinically shown to support cognitive health in older adults. it's one more step towards taking charge of your health. so every day, you can say, ♪ youuu did it! ♪ with centrum silver. i know what it's like to perform through pain. if you're like me, one of the millions suffering from pain caused by migraine, nurtec odt may help. it's the only medication that can treat a migraine when it strikes and prevent migraine attacks. treat and prevent, all in one. don't take if allergic to nurtec. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain.

relief is possible. talk to a doctor about nurtec odt. voices of people with cidp: cidp disrupts. cidp derails. let's be honest... all: cidp sucks! voices of people with cidp: but living with cidp doesn't have to. when you sign up at shiningthroughcidp.com, you'll find inspiration in real patient stories, helpful tips, reliable information, and more. cidp can be tough. but finding hope just got a little easier. sign up at shiningthroughcidp.com. all: be heard. be hopeful. be you.

this is our future, ma. godaddy airo. creates a logo, website, even social posts... in minutes! -how? -a.i. (impressed) ay i like it! who wants to come see the future?! get your business online in minutes with godaddy airo hi, i'm michael, i've lost 62 pounds on golo and i have kept it off. get your business online in minutes most of the weight that i gained was strictly in my belly which is a sign of insulin resistance. but since golo, that weight has completely gone away, as you can tell. thanks to golo and release, i've got my life and my health back.

31 past the hour. the florida supreme court has issued two landmark rulings on abortion access in the state in a pair of conflicting decisions yesterday they upheld the state's strict abortion ban and said it would allow a proposed amendment to enshrine abortion access to appear on a november ballot. the court's ruling was for a planned parenthood lawsuit against a 15 week abortion ban signed into law in 2022 but in allowing the ban to take effect the conservative leaning court has also made way for the more strict six-week abortion ban that governor desantis signed in 2023 to move forward. the court's decision on the 15-week ban yesterday means that six-week ban on abortion will take effect in 30 days.

also yesterday in a narrow 4-3 ruling the court agreed to allow floridans to vote on enshrining abortion access under florida law. the supreme court must approve the language of any citizen led constitutional amendment before it can move forward. opponents of the ballot measure criticized the proposed words of the ballot question saying it was unclear. at least 60% of voters will have to back the move for it to ultimately pass. kind of a mixed bag yesterday, joe. but in a way, not a way i would choose, but florida is being set up for a very important vote in november and they will have some pretty searing examples along the way as to why perhaps a ban on abortion is a problem. >> in the short run, bad news obviously for women's health, for women's reproductive rights, for women's choice.

in the long run, molly, you brought it up during the break. both items by the supreme court were bad news for donald trump yesterday because first thing the court did was stick trump with ron desantis' six week abortion ban, will be extraordinarily unpopular. and the second thing, making the election in '24 a referendum on a six-week abortion ban. that's just bad for trump and republican candidates up and down the ballot. does that mean biden is going to win florida? still a long shot but if i'm a florida republican i hate this being on the ballot. >> right. they worked hard to keep it off the ballot and the democratic state party worked hard to keep it on the ballot. almost 1 million signatures and through the court a bunch of times. what's interesting, it tends to be when abortion is on the

ballot or any -- it tends to be when abortion is on the ballot it wins. people even in red states like ohio. what i think is interesting about florida, we see how much this republican party has moved even on abortion. they started with the six-week heartbeat bills and now they are -- they really have moved on to embryonic personhood so states like alabama they're going after ivf. so you can see if you give these people a little bit they're not satisfied. so i do actually think this is something democrats can run on. >> it was a year ago governor desantis signed the ban in the cover of night. there was no splashy suppress conference it was under cover of night. but ali vitali you've been covering this case closely. how does it work now?

the 15-week ban is upheld but as mika pointed out, a month from right now, a month from today, perhaps, that could become a six-week ban? >> exactly. i think for people watching where reproductive access is on the map, this is a whiplash moment. because florida used to be a state that was considered a safer place to go for abortion care and now we are watching in the span of just a few weeks, it going from a state that used to be a safer state to now being at a six-week ban. it is really stunning and a reminder of the way things can move so quickly. but i think that i always thought based from what i was hearing on the ground from advocates in florida they thought they were pushed to the precipice on this. they're trying to enshrine abortion protections in the ballot amendment, putting it around 24 weeks and also thought

they would do it against the backdrop of one of the most restrictive bans in the country, a six-week ban. so i think most of the folks working on this from an advocacy perspective and political perspective on the ground thought this is where they were going to end up. i was in ohio and i feel like we talked about it so many times on the show before. last august in ohio, millions of people should not have turned out on a random tuesday in the summer for an election on a referendum that didn't have the abortion word in it but everyone was knew was about abortion access and reproductive health care. when you watch what happened in ohio, kentucky, florida could be the next place to join a long line of political winners on the abortion access side of things. it's why you see house democrats going down to florida today. it's why in my conversations

around the florida senate contest we're hearing democrats sound more optimistic than they tend to sound. i remember when i first started coming on the show in 2018, i was covering the gillum desantis race that gave us ron desantis. so midterm elections matter because than how we got to this place in florida on abortion access so heavily restricted but also why florida could be the next place we are looking in an on year where democrats have a steep climb here. i know you know this so well but why the white house is saying they feel might be winnable this year. abortion is a motivator for voters, it gets people off the sidelines. say it once, say it again, you can never under estimate the impact of female rage or allies especially on an issue as visceral as this one. >> ali vitali, thank you so much. appreciate it.

tj can you put up the fox news poll showing 32% of americans oppose -- or want abortion to be illegal most of the time. you see that number, 32%? you can go back and look at gallup polls at other polls over the past 10, 20, 30 years. that number is always about a third. right? think about this. americans' position on abortion hasn't changed. their legislators have become that much more extreme. and because of it, republicans are losing races everywhere. kentucky, kansas. i think about wisconsin. where they had a judgeship. a supreme court judgeship that would determine the future of so

many things in wisconsin but because republicans were stuck defending an abortion ban, they got wiped out. i'm not saying that republicans are going to get beaten in the state of florida. i will say this, though, jonathan lemire. you look at those numbers and then you look at the type of republican that has put florida out of reach for democrats. it's not like right wing christian nationalists saying let's move down to florida. it's people moving down because they don't want to pay state income tax. people moving down for business reasons. all in all, that's been -- that's been the story. that's been the issue. so when you have such an extreme position being taken, and it is extreme if you look at the polls. if you look at the numbers. this isn't going to help

republicans, even with the influx of 500, 600,000 republicans that have streamed into that state over the past several years. >> some to escape covid regulations everywhere else. since the supreme court overturned roe v. wade, abortion has been a winner. that's why the biden campaign thought north carolina was the place to pick up this time around because abortion is on the ballot there as well. the campaign manager put out a memo last night to nbc suggesting they think florida is winnable too. i think we can all register some skepticism to that. but at the least it might make the republicans span resources. resources they don't have defending florida, an expensive state to advertise. but more how we started this. this is something donald trump has to wear. he's trying to dance about abortion rights. he tries to distance himself from the fight on one hand.

the other hand he brags about appointing three supreme court justices who overturned roe. and now he has to wear a policy that ron desantis put in place. that's not easy beyond the borders of florida. >> and we know that women across a range are animated and they're going to turn out. i don't know if that means florida will be winnable but it will force republicans to spend resources in the state that they don't have. i want to say this that's really important. in the interim between this six week ban and the constitution, we have to think about what happens to women in the state of florida. we understand the politics. it's important to think about what this means in the long run but we need to mindful of what's happening to little girls, young women, and women and their reproductive health care in the state of florida because of this nonsense. >> i totally agree with you i think it's going to be grim in

the next few months. coming up we have more to get to. the two big legal developments involving donald trump. the modified gag order in his hush money case and the $175 million bond he just put up while appealing the civil fraud judgment against him. msnbc legal correspondent lisa reuben joins the table to break it down for us next on "morning joe."

(psst! psst!) ahhh! with flonase, allergies don't have to be scary. spray flonase sensimist daily for non-drowsy long lasting relief in a scent free, gentle mist. flonase all good. also, try our allergy headache and nighttime pills.

diabetes can serve up a lot of questions, like... what is your glucose, and can you have more carbs? before you decide... with the freestyle libre 3 system... know your glucose and where it's headed. no fingersticks needed. now the world's smallest and thinnest sensor... sends your glucose levels directly to your smartphone. manage your diabetes with more confidence, and lower your a1c. the number one cgm prescribed in the us. try it for free at freestylelibre.us. ♪♪

here we go. sun starting to come up over our building here in new york city. >> the land of the new york yankees. >> it is. the unbeaten yankees. >> we talked about it in the break. what do you put the over/under for it to be a successful season. >> the yankees start 5-0. five wins on the road against good teams. >> great teams. >> i think the over/under for it to be a successful season, 129

wins maybe. >> i was going to put it 119. let's put it 124. >> split the difference. >> 124, just you know what, pull up the stakes and move out of town. >> you know, guys -- >> sell soda. >> we're on the fast track to the yankees/pirates world series. but there will be peaks and valleys, it's a long series. the orioles are great, jays are good -- >> you're already overcoming advers adversities. >> you know who's good? juan soto. >> we do not have -- oh, good, yankee highlights. >> look at this catch. >> sliding. >> does it all. >> can play right field. >> good in the clubhouse.

>> the kids look up to him. >> we'll talk about sports in a moment. we have baseball, caitlin clark going off last night. let's turn back to news. the judge who will preside over the new york hush money criminal trial has expanded a partial gag order against trump following attacks against the judge's daughter by name. and the posting of the $175 million bond while his case is under appeal. good to see you this morning. you can weigh in on the yankees, resox. >> i can't compete. >> we'll keep it legal there. the posting of the $175 million bond knocked down from 450-some million dollars. any surprises? >> we expected to him to post. the document itself is not much

of anything in terms of what it reveals, except for who underwrote this bond, night specialty insurance company out of los angeles, a constellation of companies called don hinkey. the king of sub prime loans. but he's the largest individual shareholder in axos bank that refinanced doral the golf course in florida. trump owes in principal, $225 million to axos bank and now he has pledged more than that to get the $175 million bond. >> so don hinkey is a guy who rode in and had donald trump's

back several times. >> at the time he was not the largest, the then ceo of the bank. so it's hard to say that don hinkey was the white knight. when we think about the bond litigation, allen garden filed the declaration that said we consulted 30 different insurance companies to see who would post the bond. when you look at the list of that, i consulted it last night, knight specialty insurance is not on it. how we got from there where allen garden is telling the court we talked to the 30 largest insurers in the country nobody will underwrite the bond to don hinkey and his company are willing to put up that $175 million, i'm looking forward to see how that unfolds. >> as you look at the story is there any evidence on the surface? it sounds like a naive question. is there any evidence on the surface this is just a business

play? the guy thinks he repays his debt. you know, he -- he had a lot of bankruptcies in the past but, you know, you look at the people that he borrowed money from when he inflated those values, even those banks are saying it was a good business deal for us. a better way to ask that, is there any direct evidence that this was a political play? trying to curry favor? that's a lot of money. >> i don't think there is right now on the surface. i think you can say don hinkey already has a sizable amount of wealth tied up in investments related to donald trump. in some respects this looks like a self-protected move -- >> in for a penny, in for a pound. >> that may be part of it. the other part he might believe, as donald trump has said many times my assets are worth more than some people in the universe think they're worth.

he's making a play if the former president ends up owing hundreds of millions of dollars to i'd rather own it myself rather than see it go in a fire sale. >> and now the gag order includes the judge's family we know that trump had been going after his daughter recently on social media. what does it mean? it feels like something that trump is running up against nearly on a daily basis. >> it does feel appropriate to me because we're at a break last moment in terms of what trump is saying and how it endangers a range of participants in the case. i spoke with michael cohen earlier in the week. whatever you think of michael cohen, he will tell you that gag order or not he lives in a constant threat environment where he walks down the streets in new york city as friendly as

you think some people might be to him he doesn't know if someone wants to shake his hand or take a gun out of their jacket. so the gag order is appropriate given the way the rhetoric has ratcheted up against people like the judge's order. one of the things interesting is the remedies. at the end of the order not only is he expanding the gag order but saying two things that are important to point out to the viewers. first if donald trump engages in any conduct that threatens the safety and integrity of the jury, jury selection process, including making threats to people who are not themselves participants in the process but making perspective jurors fear for themselves on the basis of what he's saying to other people you're going to forfeit your right to the naples of jurors. there's a statute in new york that says people get to know the names of jurors.

so right now, president trump will know the names of jurors. the judge is saying i can take that from you. and the second thing, if you're violating this, you will have sanctions under the two provisions that have to deal with criminal contempt. 751 says the remeies can include up to 30 days imprisonment. the judge is not playing. >> given all this, this is a simple question. we're two weeks out, april 15th. what should we be expecting as we get closer and closer to this criminal trial? >> i was going to say what are we expecting day one. there's 14 days between then and now. but we can expect other last minute efforts to delay the trial. donald trump was talking about how judge marshawn should be

recused. but they're telling us we've sought permission to file another recusal motion. donald trump has on the table a motion to postpone the trial because of publicity due to people like michael cohen speaking out or stormy daniels participating in a documentary. never mind the largest part of that is donald trump himself. but i think you'll see a number of other efforts to postpone that first start date of the trial, the april 15th jury selection date. watch for donald trump to do anything and everything he can to make it not a reality. >> right now it is april 15th. msnbc's lisa reuben. thank you. thank you. >> still ahead colin allred joins us live in studio as he challenges, ted cruz. and sarah paulson is our

guest to talk about her new role on broadway. t her new role on broadway. ah, these bills are crazy. she has no idea she's sitting on a goldmine. well she doesn't know that if she owns a life insurance policy of $100,000 or more she can sell all or part of it to coventry for cash. even a term policy. even a term policy? even a term policy! find out if you're sitting on a goldmine. call coventry direct today at the number on your screen, or visit coventrydirect.com. hi, i'm janice, and i lost 172 pounds on golo. when i was a teenager i had some severe trauma in my life and i turned to food

for comfort. a friend told me that i was the only one holding me back from being as beautiful on the outside as i am the inside. once i saw golo was working, i felt this rush, i just had to keep going. a lot of people think no pain no gain, but with golo it is so easy. when i look in the mirror, i don't even recognize myself. golo really works. (♪♪) with wet amd, i worry i'm not only losing my sight, but my time to enjoy it. but now, i can open up my world with vabysmo. (♪♪) vabysmo is the first fda-approved treatment for people with wet amd that improves vision and delivers a chance for up to 4 months between treatments, so i can do more of what i love. (♪♪) (♪♪) vabysmo works differently, it's the only treatment designed to block 2 causes of wet amd. vabysmo is an eye injection. don't take it if you have an infection, active eye swelling, or are allergic to it.

treatments like vabysmo can cause an eye infection or retinal detachment. vabysmo may cause a temporary increase in eye pressure after receiving the injection. there is an uncommon risk of heart attack or stroke associated with blood clots. severe swelling of blood vessels in the eye can occur. most common eye side effects were cataract and broken blood vessels. open up your world with vabysmo. a chance for up to 4 months between treatments with vabysmo.

iowa trying to get to the final four for the third time in program history. in a rematch with lsu, clark evades. that will do it. this time it's iowa! >> iowa wins the rematch of last year's title game against lsu last night beating the tigers 94-87 to earn a second consecutive trip to the final four. caitlin clark was unreal leading the hawkeyes 41 points in the game. including a single game record tying nine three pointers. just for good measure, clark also broke the ncaa tournament assist record with 12 of those, for a total of 140. unbelievable. iowa now faces uconn in the

semifinals. the huskies knocking off usc, 87-83. uconn is on a record 23rd trip to the final four. the winners of friday night's matchup play for the championship on sunday, likely against the team people aren't talking about as much, south carolina they're undefeated this year. you can't say enough about the game last night. caitlin clark was awesome, angel reese was great for lsu until she fouled out. everybody wanted it to be a thing, you don't like each other, the trash talk. and they both, angel reese and caitlin clark handled themselves so well.

>> there was trash talk people thought it would happen again. this time they did -- there was none of that and praised each other after the game, extraordinarily classy, and what a game and caitlin clark met the moment again. this women's tournament is probably the most watched, anticipated one they ever had and only getting berth as we go. and that undefeated south carolina team looms. if we get that as a championship match, you know what that is? it's michigan state/indiana state. >> speaking of larry bird, it's not often you see one individual, caitlin clark, decide i'm taking this game over, i'm going to win this game myself my team is going to help me but i'm back to win this game myself beat them instead of last year happening. she put it on her shoulders. nine three pointers. >> she does it every time out. you think there's a bad game,

but no. >> and what about geno. >> and uconn they were racked by injuries, lost three starters to season ending injuries. and i think he thought this was a year we don't go back but he made it back. with another superstar, juju watkins. who's only a freshman. >> and the final four. >> never happened where a school had their men's and women's team making it to the final four. >> and caitlin clark, another story similar to it, the red sox. perhaps one of the best teams of our lifetime. >> you want to talk about the little engine that could. you're looking at it. look at that pitching staff. look at it quickly, though. >> yeah. look quickly. >> only two out though. >> it's early april.

>> that oakland situation is so sad. why would you go when you're a fan. >> why does major league baseball let that owner -- the fact they're leaving oakland for those of us tharm exactly what the oakland a's meant to baseball through the years, it's ridiculous. >> they're leaving oakland but where are they going? they have nowhere to two next year or the year after because they're going to build a stadium in las vegas, are they going to sa sacramento? are they playing around various fields in california. the owner is a wealthy guy, the idea that he is running a major league baseball team like this is obscene and major league baseball ought to do something about it. >> it's a great baseball tradition, fan base that lost the raiders even the warriors moved to san francisco.

you're right. the las vegas stadium if it happens is years from now. they have to play in a triple a park, this is not tenable. drawing 3,000, 4,000 fans a night. i don't blame the fans at all why would you want to support that group. that's the latest on ohtani? everybody forgetting about it. >> everybody prayed on easter sunday for ohtani. >> everyone prayed it would go away. that interpreter can take $4 million out -- >> there are active investigations it's probably going to go quiet while they look into it. but ohtani said he didn't know, he was the victim of theft this was the interpreter paying off gambling debts. >> i've had to deal with mika paying off her gambling debts. you have to do what you have to

do. a couple of years back i had to sell eggs. >> remember the fund-raiser we had. >> i know. it was embarrassing. but people pony up. >> just ride the waves. we shall get to the news and barnacle is here. donald trump appears to be making his strongest push yet for support from evangelical christians. michael c. bender has a new piece entitled "the church of trump: how he's infusing christianity into his movement" here's bender explaining how trump's rallies have changed. >> i'm here in south carolina for a donald trump rally where thousands of people have been lining up for hours to get inside. >> usa! >> showing the endless devotion that these supporters have for the president. one of the more striking ways we

see this impassioned loyalty from trump fans is at the end of the rallies where there's a sudden shift in tone where it goes from high energy into almost a solemn church-like atmosphere. where trump gives a ten to 15 minute sermon praeching to his crowd. >> three years ago we were a great nation and we will soon be a great nation again. zblsh. >> initially his supporters greeted this moment but holding up an index finger in the air, signaling qanon. in its place what we see are people almost in prayer. the effect here is trump has turned the republican party into something resembling the church of trump. there's a couple of reasons why trump is doing this, one is to

deflect and distract the 90-some charges he's facing. portraying himself as a political martyr here, targeted because of his supporters' believes and not everything he's done wrong. >> in the end they're not after me they're after you, i just happen to be standing in the way and i always will. >> the next thing is the trump campaign can spend less money turning out the voters. they ole come out in mass to vote for him and the other hand the democrats will use it against hill, trying to make it seem consult-like in order to spook moderate voters back to their column. >> let's bring in jim wallace his latest book is out today "the false white gospel".

eddie glaude jr. is back with us as well. jim thank you for being with us. i'll just ask you outright what i've been wondering for years. if you have what we christians consider to have, the greatest story ever told, the most -- and especially as we -- as we move past easter, a story, a life, a savior who needs no embellishments. if we have that, and that savior has changed so many people's lives, and completely rewritten the history of western civilization time and again over the past 2,000 years, why do they have to make things up? why do they have to embrace qanon? why do they have to embrace a

failed reality tv host and take him on as the other jesus? their new savior? >> first of all, joe, thank you for covering the faith factor in this election. what i call the faith factor. i think it could be decisive. so the old story, it's often been distorted and manipulated, and used for purposes of power. it's being used again. we face in this crisis, a test of democracy, indeed. but also a test of faith. and the integrity of our faith communities is really at stake here. and politics is fine but we got to go deeper than politics. because every nation has its better angels and worse demons. and donald trump, in what i call

the false white gospel, is marketing our worst demons. marketing our worst demons. so how do we engage our better angels? i like you mention easter. as you and i know easter is not just a day, it's a season. so we're entering into this easter season as i begin this nationwide town meeting tour about faith and democracy. this is an easter book. an easter book. it's about resistance and hope at the same time. >> eddie, i'll ask you the same question and then please feel free to ask jim a question. but why do we find ourselves where we are with people of faith who, again, have all they need in the four corners of the bible? why now do they -- do they seek

false idols? and just say it out loud that he is a christ-like figure. he is the other christ. he is their savior. why? >> you know, joe, there's a complicated history of christianity in this country. we talk about the tradition of american liberalism. but the historian steven hahn talks about the story of american ill lib arism. and there's a religious gaffe to that. talks about the slave auction block next to the church steeple. that compromise that infected american christianity. that before one shell was shot at fort sumpter the church had split over the issue of slavery. so there's also this in the united states, the temptation of idols that can lead to the

distortion of one's faith and one's belief. that's why i have to ask you, what's the substance of the false white gospel, why not just a false gospel? how are we to respond to this? in the book you give the wonderful passages from the bible, take us to the word as a way to respond to what we're seeing. give us a sense what can we do in the face of what you described? >> as we both know, our demons, our racial demons run very deep, run very deep. so this is a time to bring the story back. bring that story back. so i've taken six iconic biblical texts. you'll know the truth says jesus and the truth will set you free. and the opposite of truth isn't just lying, it's captivity. truth and freedom are indivisibleable we have a lot of

people who are stuck. and the false white gospel is coopted by nationalism. a gospel coopted by nationalism and the good samaritan story which i love, i tell in the book. here's jesus lifting up the samaritan who was othered by people of his day who helps other him by the side of the road and the good samaritan was mixed race, attacked all the time. here's the one jesus lifts up how to be a neighbor. so your neighbor probably does live in your neighborhood. so i'm taking these texts to refresh them and reframe them. and i want to let jesus do the talking, right. so i want to take it to these surrogates of trump and i want to say, okay, here's what the text is, here's what jesus says. do we believe it? or not? we either say we believe it and then apply it or not.

so i want to, in this easter season, also critical political season, i want to have a conversation, an interrogation of things. >> i'm so glad you brought up the good samaritan because willie in our easter service on sunday the pastor talked about the question about what might i do to make it to the kingdom of heaven and jesus said you must of course love god and you must love your neighbor as yourself and he was asked directly who was my neighbor. and what did jesus do? he picked the despised samaritan. he picked the foreigner. he picked the person that nobody he was talking to would want to stop by. that's who your neighbor is. just like when people ask jesus why do you hang out with the dregs of society? what did jesus say, he said i didn't come here to like heal

the healthy. i came here to heal the sick. so all of this other talk, all of this other -- like the others is the antithesis of everything jesus talked about through the entire bible, it's crazy. >> that's the perfect set up for what i was going to ask you, jim, which is you look at the life of jesus christ and contrast it to the life, the character, behavior, morality of donald trump, you couldn't find in our public life more polar opposites yet there are many people in this country that you write about in the book who are equating the two, jesus christ and donald trump. in your studies, what are the mental and morale gymnastics people have to perform to get to the conclusion that in some ways donald trump does represent jesus christ. that he is here to carry on somehow that legacy. >> the question who is my neighbor may be the most important question for

democracy. and its future. it was asked by a lawyer, by the way. i think he was a washington lawyer. i recognize that tone of voice. who is my neighbor. exactly, who is my neighbor. how can i get out of obligation here. so i think every movement has to figure out who they can persuade and who they must defeat at the ballot box. so i think there are persuadable people out there. i'm going to meet them across the country. turning a book tour into a town meeting tour on faith and democracy. i want to bring the people back to the story what did jesus say, what did he mean? you can't keep saying you're a believer, jesus said why do you call me lord lord and not do the things i tell you? that's the question. i want to have a debate on faith. because i think faith could be a factor now in these weeks and months ahead. and the fact that it's easter makes it more significant.

so i know the history of those people. i come from that background, right. but i had to find jesus outside outside of my white church, white neighborhood, white school. the whiteness is an idol. and in the phrase white evangelical. the defining word there is not evangelical. it's white. and that has to change. i think we can change it and i think we can transform too but also we can help people find the language. i want this book to be a tool for people. find the text, find the language. find the ways to speak about this. because we're all influenced as people talk to their family and their friends. everybody can do -- this book is my two cents. but i want others to offer their two cents and i believe in a god who increases the value of our two cents.

>> gene robinson? >> yeah. jim what about the evangelical pastors. tell me how they -- they're supposed to be leading their flocks. they read the bible because they have to preach from it every week. how do they, who know what jesus said in detail, how do they lead their followers to follow donald trump? how does that happen? >>. >> some pastors tell me they're getting death threats. pastors. so what i want them to do is preach these texts and there's six texts. we'll do six sundays to preach these texts. and a lot of those folks are just afraid. they're conformed. some of them know it's wrong, but they don't know what to say. this book i think will help

them. and some choices have to be made. this isn't a neutral time. we have to make choices about our faith. so this book is for pastors. it is. this book is about how pastors can make critical choices to speak the truth to power and trust god for the consequences. >> jim, there's a stunning piece in "the new york times" this morning by michael bender about donald trump turning his rallies increasingly and largely to religious affairs winding down towards the end of each rally with him posing as their savior. i am your savior. i am your retribution. many people, as you certainly know, go to church, go to mass, go to whatever church they go to, for the comfort of their faith. i think the president of the united states enjoys going to mass each sunday for the comfort of his faith and what it does

for him. do you worry at all about the talk of mixing politics and religion and having a candidate running for president who is part al mcgahntry, stealing a piece of people's fate. >> faith is meant to comfort us but also knowing the truth and living the truth and trying to speak the truth into a world of lies. so i worry, yeah. i very worry about how the faith factor could be this white christian nationalism which is idol tryst, a word we don't like to talk about, it's false worship. worshipping false god. harrisy, it means what draws

christians and others away from christ. trump is a sacrilege, he is a blast fommer, all of that is true. i want to talk about what the real story is, true story is, a lot of pastors would like to find the real story again. some have been part of the political takeover as you put it. the political takeover of the church. this is a right wing political takeover of the church. my father, who was an evangelical way back in the day, he told me this jerry fallwell guy he's a fundamentalist who wants power. fundamentalism always seeks power. that's what this is. it's wanting power and using the gospel, using faith to gain power. and we can't let that happen. we have to go back to the story, the truth, and jesus teachings

have always been used, every revival movement, renewal movement has always come back to the teachings of jesus. at this critical moment in our life, politically, culturally, historically, not since the civil war have we faced this kind of crisis. it's time to come back to the text, to what jesus said. i love the first chapter, the first book of genesis. all the political enjoys we're surrounded with. i love it then god said. be quiet. then god said. let us make human kind in our own image after our own likeness. that means any attempt to sub press, subvert a vote. so unless we go deeper here,

don't go left or right, let's go deeper here, this isn't about politics. it's politics for sure. but this is about the integrity of our faith. and the third test is a new generation is watching us. they're watching us. if we come down on the wrong side of this, we're going to lose a whole -- >> let me tell you, that is not a good story. that's not a good story looking at the church and the pews emptying out. look at the new generation looking at their elders and saying really is that what they're doing? is that why they're going to church. i want to say this is so important but for people who don't understand what's happening in churches, at least churches i i grew up. i'm not talking about first baptist church pensacola, meridian, or anyone else i went specifically, but i hear from a lot of pastors and friends of pastors, they're like republican politicians, they're scared to

confront their flock. and it happens time and again, and when they do confront their flock, a lot of times they pay for it. a lot of times they're run out. pastor i know back in february had two part series and it was about politics. and he said you can have your politics, this is very conservative church by the way. you can have your politics. keep it outside the door. because when we come inside here we're talking about jesus. if you're a republican pray for a democrat, if you're a democrat pray for a republican. boom. that's the way i wish a lot of people would do it. >> the political parallel. trump is projecting a trajectory of politics of fear, hate and violence. now that's being projected onto religion. same thing. how do we overcome the fear, how do we talk about the politics of neighbor love?

that's what we're talking about here. >> that is the key. the new book is titled "the false white gospel" author jim wallis. thank you so much. >> with a forward by eddie glaude. how about that, it all comes around. >> well, he had such credibility and then just undercut it there. i tell you what, that is awesome. eddie, i'm very excited about your book coming out. >> thank you. >> when is it out? >> next week. >> fantastic. before we go to break. mike you and i were not on yesterday and i want to talk about a dear friend of mine. and i know a guy that you loved too. bill delahunt. i served with a lot of people in the house. bill was as far left as i was right. we didn't agree on one thing on the judiciary committee. he was constantly trying to get

me to go to columbia to visit the rebels in the mountains. i'm not going up, man. he goes they're great guys, joe. no they're not. i think bill was just poking me. but i just love that guy so much. he had such a great spirit. he was such a positive, happy guy, and he was -- that's just a perfect example of congress working the way it should work. two guys completely different worlds, completely different ied -- ideologies and we figured out where to come together. >> he represents a lost congress. a congress you were part of initially that's now gone but his is long gone. a congress you could walk across the aisle and work across the aisle. a congress where members of congress and their families knew each other because they weren't always fund-raising they were located in washington. they knew each other as friends

not as political rivals first. and it was a large group of members of congress on both sides of the aisle who operated like this. guess what happened. look at the legislation passed from lyndon johnson being sworn in as president. the great society and everything like that, all through the '70s and '80s. legislation much of it is still the foundation and the growing foundation of what we benefit from today. that's gone. >> mike you can take it to the '90s when bill and i were there. >> that's what i mean. >> fighting, impeachments, government shutdowns. but it's interesting, even during those difficult times when everybody was yelling at each other up here. we were quietly best of friends, getting things done. balanced the budget four years in a row. passed incredibly meaningful legislation because of the core of the people there on both sides wanted to get things done. >> you were there to serve your

constituents. >> right. >> now they're there to serve tiktok. >> still ahead on "morning joe." when congress returns next week, house republicans are going to make the case for removing the secretary of homeland security. there we go. mayorkas, during his impeachment trial in the senate. why the trial is going to end very quickly. former secretary of homeland security under president obama, jeh johnson joining us in studio for that conversation. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ." we'll be right back.

(♪♪) with wet amd, i worry i'm not only losing my sight, but my time to enjoy it. but now, i can open up my world with vabysmo. (♪♪) vabysmo is the first fda-approved treatment for people with wet amd that improves vision and delivers a chance for up to 4 months between treatments, so i can do more of what i love. (♪♪) (♪♪) vabysmo works differently, it's the only treatment designed to block 2 causes of wet amd. vabysmo is an eye injection.

don't take it if you have an infection, active eye swelling, or are allergic to it. treatments like vabysmo can cause an eye infection or retinal detachment. vabysmo may cause a temporary increase in eye pressure after receiving the injection. there is an uncommon risk of heart attack or stroke associated with blood clots. severe swelling of blood vessels in the eye can occur. most common eye side effects were cataract and broken blood vessels. open up your world with vabysmo. a chance for up to 4 months between treatments with vabysmo. ask your doctor. capitol. 34 past the hour. welcome back to "morning joe." next week house republicans will argue in favor of removing homeland security secretary alejandro mayorkas in his impeachment trial in the senate. he's the first cabinet member to

be impeached since 1876 and the move is raising concerns surrounding the handling future impeachments. former homeland security secretary under president obama jeh johnson says i fear that other attempts to impeachment cabinet officers will now follow. like supreme court confirmation hearings history teaches once we lower the bar, the whole process is degraded. and no other president will be able to recruit a serious person to protect homeland security. jeh joins us now. the key word of the day is normalization. normalizing things like that. are you concerned about the department of homeland security being undermined in the long term especially? >> yes.

many people forget that homeland security is more than border security, it's cyber security, counter terrorism, maritime security, aviation security, protection of our leaders through the secret service. it's fema, protection of government buildings. so the secretary, at any one time, has at least ten different missions, including the immigration border security mission. and my biggest concern about this political charade which we're about to under go in the senate is that it, first of all, degrades the process, it's a constitutionally prescribed process, it degrades the process but it degrades the office of secretary of homeland security and makes it much much harder to recruit somebody in the future willing to step up and protect our homeland. >> let's pull back and get one more house man. we have the moorehouse caucus

here. 40% of all "morning joe" guests morehouse men. >> he's a big younger than me. >> just a tad. >> i was the greatest class, class of 1979. >> class of '89 actually. given your description, would you see this politicization of the process as a threat to national security? >> yes. >> given the level of talent that we're concerned about. >> yes. >> so say a little bit more about that. >> first of all it distracts the cabinet secretary with the responsibility for the protection of all of these different missions. and second, it makes it much harder to find somebody in the future who's willing to step up and do the job. the job has become such a political lightning rod. it wasn't a walk in the park when i was there. but it's become such a political lightning rod that i worry that you're never going to find

anybody credible after this, who's willing to step up and do the job. some retired governor or four star, they're going to say i don't need this. make me secretary of agriculture. >> there you go. the senate may move to dismiss the charges. >> and they should. >> they may say we're not going to entertain this. speaker johnson said you have to go through the process. we'll see. let's put the impeachment aside to the root of what we're talking about here, the border. the objection of republicans in the congress but also of many americans to what's going on down there. it's not a radical trump position to think that something has to change at the border. so as a former secretary of homeland security, what is reasonable to expect to change at the border to have more orderly system of immigration? >> what we need to have changed down there is what's emboied in the legislation. that jim langford, chris murphy

and kyrsten sinema negotiated. the fact that republicans in this congress seem to have pushed it aside in favor of the politics because they'd rather have the issue to campaign on -- >> and they say it out loud. trump has said blame me for everything that happens at the border just blame me because it will help joe biden if it passes. >> i don't want it fixed unless i'm president, but the bill fixes the asylum adjudication system, lowers the bar on the front end it's easy to establish credible fear when you first enter the country which serves as a magnet for illegal immigration. more border patrol agents, judges, and emergency title 42-like authority when the numbers reach a certain level. and this was a -- you know, a

hard-negotiated bipartisan bill. that appears to be going nowhere because it's an election year and donald trump doesn't want it to happen. meanwhile, there are people in texas, arizona and the communities across the border and here in new york and elsewhere that are in crisis right now because of this situation. i don't know why more members of congress, including republicans, are not stepping up and saying hey, let's fix this problem my constituents demand it. >> and border patrol wants it fixed as well. can you help us understand what's driving -- politics, political season, joe biden has been too lax. no, people don't -- they're not hanging out in el salvador going joe biden said this and so now we're going to -- you know, everybody is going to be flooding north. this started, actually, in 2017 with donald trump. people don't like to hear it, the reality is that when barack

obama and joe biden left office, illegal border crossings across the southern border were at 50 year lows. when biden and obama left office and your administration too. >> i was there. >> you were there. illegal border crossings were at a 50-year low. they spiked under donald trump. and they've continued to spike. why? >> we're in in the midst of a hemispheric shift north. venezuela, nicaragua, haiti, el salvador, because of the drought, corruption, violence, it's a bigger problem than when i was in office, frankly. and the push factors always overwhelm any defense you can put on the southern border. we can do certain things like a title 42 authority, send that

message, but so long as those push factors exist, they're always going to overwhelm what we -- what we try to do. and toward the end of the obama administration we began providing very targeted aid to central america to get people hope there, to try to address the violence. enable coffee growers to get their product to the market quicker and give people a reason to stay. experts will tell you even though it's a drop in the bucket, 7 -- $750 million it was beginning to work. my second year in office we had the second lowest number of apprehensions in 20 years. donald trump's third year in office we had over 1 million. it dropped when he took off because oh my goodness trump is in office. but so long as those underlying

push factors persist they're always going to revert back to the longer term trend lines. that's what we're seeing now. and so, the bill that's pending in congress, i guarantee would address this problem. it would drive the numbers down. not necessarily long term but i guarantee if that bill became law it would drive the numbers down. >> so all the central american countries that you just named, they are still in flux. people still want to get out. looking for better economic conditions, better life. that's natural, normal, understandable. >> yes. >> but there's a gate keeper, there's a gate keeper before they get to the border, it's mexico. >> yes. >> why is it that mexico seemingly plays games with the united states with regard to this issue? >> couple of reasons. one, mexico immigration is considered a human right. two, the mexicans don't have much of a border patrol. though their border with central

america is only 300 miles versus ours which is 1,900. there have been instances in the past during this administration, the trump administration, and the obama administration where we prevailed on the mexicans to step up and do more on their southern border which has an effect but they're never able to sustain it. and from the mexican point of view, it's in their interest to let them keep going north. and, you know, the stay in mexico policy creates -- it creates a bottleneck on their northern border. but one of the central tenants of addressing this problem, in my view, is helping, encouraging, persuading mexico to do more on their southern border with mexico without a doubt. >> former homeland security secretary, jeh johnson, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. we appreciate it. and coming up on "morning

joe," democratic congressman colin allred will join us live in studio to talk about his bid to oust republican ted cruz from his u.s. senate seat in texas. "morning joe" is back in a moment. back in a moment when you're not blamed for a condition you can't control. ♪♪ you'll get better when your pain isn't minimized, dismissed, forgotten. we will never stop trying to get better. because when medicine gets better, all of us can get better. ♪♪ ♪3, 4♪

♪ all of us can get better. ♪hey♪ ♪ ♪are you ready for me♪ ♪are you ready♪ ♪are you ready♪ hi, i'm jason. i've lost 228 pounds on golo.

♪ changing your habits is the only way that gets you to lose the weight. and golo is the plan that's going to help you do that. just take the first step, go to golo.com.

why choose a sleep number smart bed? can it keep me warm when i'm cold? wait, no, i'm always hot. sleep number does that. can i make my side softer? i like my side firmer. sleep number does that. can it help us sleep better and better? please?

sleep number does that. 94 percent of smart sleepers report better sleep. and now, the queen sleep number c4 smart bed is only $1,599. save $300. shop now at sleepnumber.com boy, that's a beautiful live picture, the sun up over fort lauderdale at 7:48 in the morning. the texas senate race will be one of the more closely watched matchups in november. ted cruz is tied now with democratic challenger congressman colin allred who joins us in studio. i think a lot of people saw the poll and went whoa. ted cruz has been elected and reelected. been around a long time in texas politics.

why are we seeing this kind of movement in your favor? >> i think fundamentally freedom is under attack in texas, it's no who we are whether it's the right to make your own health care or attacking and banning books or telling kids what kind of hair style they can have in school. to me i see ted cruz, that's not the texas i know. i grew up in texas, and i know who we are and this isn't it. this is what we're seeing in the polls now, folks want a in flor and the supreme court upholding 15 weeks will become six weeks as signed by governor desantis last year. are you seeing the impact of strict abortion laws in texas in your race as well? >> i feel for the folks in florida. they are going to experience what we experienced, which is what a near total ban on abortion looks like. it's a mother of two, like kate

cox, who has a one in third pregnancy has to go to the emergency room four times, her doctor says she needs a medically necessary abortion. they say we are going to prosecute you, your doctor, hospital. we are at the beginning of seeing the impacts of this across texas, university systems, medical schools, business economy, it will be harder to recruit and retain top talent. this extremism can't last. we have to rectify at the federal level. >> in florida, some people -- there are some people who like the six-week ban. many independents, republicans, persuadable, perhaps in the middle, wait a second, that's way too far for us. >> we have seen in the states where they banned abortion women who are pregnant get much less good medical care. are you seeing that on the ground? >> from my state of the union guest was an ob/gyn in dallas. she had to flee the state to get an abortion because of her

baby's skull didn't form correctly. her husband is also ob/gyn. my wife and i had two boys in dallas the last five years. these ultrasounds or genetic tests you are holding your breath and hope they don't say there is a problem with the baby. if there is, that conversation becomes harder. we want to talk to the medical schools. they are worried about who is going to be applying to come to texas, who is willing to come to texas, wants to be a interest in texas. this fundamental. when you attack the right like this, make these very difficult conversations even more difficult, it has these downstream impacts that we are just beginning to experience. >> that experience that we are talking about right now is going to be enormous in the fall. state to state to state. i would imagine and you will correct peif i'm wrong, tlos no state that's more impacted by the issue of immigration at the

border. >> yeah. >> in texas. >> that's right. >> what are the differences between you and your opponent ted cruz on the border? >> yeah. first of all, my family's from the border. my grandfather was a customs officer after serving in the navy in the pacific. my mom, i spent my childhood in brownsville. our border communities are not just a political backdrop. i am sick and tired of folks treating it like they are on a safari. they point out migrants in the weeds. we need them to pass legislation to help us try to address this and i heard y'all talking about it on the last segment. the legislation that we were trying to consider in the congress, no state would have benefitted from that more than texas, the immigration judges they would have hired, changes to the asylum system. we had 300,000 crossings in december, 10,000 a day. that's a crisis. i am a kevin mccarthy who says we have a crisis of the border. we have to respond in a way

that's consistent with the values. these a big difference between me and cruz. he wants to use it as a political issue instead of solve it. that's untenable in texas. >> i am curious, winning as a democrat in texas is no easy feat, especially statewide in a senate race. when you go back to waco where you played college football and talk to maybe a republican voter who doesn't love ted cruz but votes for him because he is on the ballot but maybe is persuadable. what is your argument to those voters, why you are not the last guy who ran against ted cruz or you are a different kind of democrat. >> i am a different cat. i am the most bipartisan member of the texas delegation. i am proud of it t i have gotten awards from the chamber of commerce, named the most bipartisan. i work hard at that to try to bring us together. also fundamentally the issue in texas with ted cruz, he only cares about himself. that's how you go to cancun, 30 million texans are freezing in the dark, i think you can

podcast three times a week instead of being serious legislator trying to get some things done. i am the exact opposite. i was raised by a community. when you are raised by a single mom, rely on the schools, ymca, i played football because that was a way out for me and taught me to lead and bring folks together. that's the fundamental difference between us. we have one of the chief dividers in the country in ted cruz. i will unite us. >> you have a pretty wild statehouse situation where ken paxton impeached, there was a trial. does that help democrats at all? >> we are experiencing kind of a civil war, i guess you could say, in texas republican party where the speaker of the house, who is incredibly conservative and passed a lot of conservative priorities also thought that you shouldn't be allowed to use the public dime to pay off for your affair, which is what the impeachment of the attorney general was all about.

and for whatever reason, politically in the senate that didn't happen. now they are going after all of these very conservative republicans who said this is a bridge too far for me. i also think it's a bridge too far for texas voters. we have had it with the extremism, with being embarrassed by our elected officials and we have to have a confident correction. that's what i think this election about be about. self-correcting for texans. sending a message this kind of extreme doesn't work. that will be a win for texans and make a better republican party in texas for that. >> i am looking at congressman what ted cruz said the press release he put out when the dobbs decision came out. he called it nothing short of a massive victory for life. is that where texas is? and how do you appeal to people who are used to having him representing them as the state of texas? >> in a lot of ways, as i said,

we are experiencing what a near total ban on abortion looked like and it's deeply personal for so many texas families and the stories are heartbreaking. you could say that i am sure many texans didn't realize that this is what it would look like, victims of rape and incest have nowhere to go, families who really want to welcome a child but have -- get the bad news we hope we don't getting it won't be viable, have to flee the state. this was the predictable outcome of the policies ted cruz has been pursuing. he doesn't want to talk about this. he wants to get in front of a camera about everything except this because of what's happening in texas is a disaster and we know that we can only restore it at the federal level. he won't protect ive after the ruling in alabama. we had a panic in texas clinics for families hoping to welcome a child worried their embryos were at risk. this is untenable, outrageous. when i'm in the senate, we will

restore this right. >> congressman colin allred, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. appreciate it. and up next, we'll discuss new polling that shows joe biden regaining the lead over donald trump nationwide with one key group of voters fueling biden's surge. plus, trump has secured the $175 million bond needed to appeal the decision in the new york civil fraud trial. we'll explain where that money came from. also ahead, award-winning actor jon hamm will be our guest. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ight back.

(vo) in three seconds, this couple will share a perfect moment. (woman) is that? oh wow! but we got to sell our houses! (vo) don't worry, sell and buy in one move when you start with opendoor. close in a matter of days. (woman) yes! (vo) start with an all-cash offer at opendoor.com. for moderate to severe crohn's disease skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor that can deliver remission and visibly improve damage of the intestinal lining. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. liver problems may occur in crohn's disease. control of crohn's means everything to me. ask your gastroenterologist about skyrizi. ♪ control is everything to me ♪ learn how abbvie could help you save.

business. ♪ control is it's not a nine-to-five proposition. it's all day and into the night. it's all the things that keep this world turning. the go-tos that keep us going. the places we cheer. and check in. they all choose the advanced network solutions and round the clock partnership from comcast business. see why comcast business powers more small businesses

than anyone else. get started for $49.99 a month plus ask how to get up to an $800 prepaid card. don't wait- call today. okay. >> somebody passing notes. somebody is passing notes. >> getting set for the show. moved from over there to over here. >> yeah, right behind willie? okay. all right. just have a seat, jonathan. >> ready for us to begin the class? >> let's do it. >> it's your first day. >> cue it all up, t.j.. okay.

♪♪ >> all right. okay. welcome, everyone, to "morning joe." >> that's a beautiful shot. >> so nice to have you. thank you for joining us. i think it's tuesday. everybody's in their seats. and we'll get to all that's going on this morning. hi, willie. the expanded gag order in donald trump's hush money case comes as the former president came up with the cash needed to appeal for his civil fraud judgment. we'll talk about that. meanwhile, on "wall street journal" looks like a meme stock with shares of the company plunging yesterday significantly and lowering trump's net worth. i never understood this. >> who saw that coming? a company that has been losing money from the beginning. who would have guessed it would have dropped? >> a company that loses money probably isn't worth $8 billion?

is that what you're saying? >> kinda. >> exactly. >> all right. also, we are going to get -- >> "wall street journal" for you and me. >> what's going on? we dropped the hint for 15 years. >> exactly. >> impressed by -- >> j.p. morgan? >> you want to go to -- >> goldman. >> goldman guy? >> yeah. >> okay. >> like the culture. >> okay. what we just said there, we need those two guys. right? >> there we go. okay. now that's -- back to a two-shot. i guess t.j. is directing again. >> alabama won this week. >> i was happy for you. roll tide. a tough task. >> that's why joe looks the way he does. . >> 30-0 run. >> tight at 23. my parent went to illinois. then it was 53-23. 30-0 run. . >> yeah. >> uconn men's team one of the best that we have seen. i can't remember since with when. a long, long title.

so balanced and so good. tough task for alabama. >> we will see. good, good, good. back to me now. one shot. plus we will talk about key abortion rulings -- >> do the one. goodbye. abortion rules yesterday from florida supreme court. could the appearance of a measure on the november ballot put the state in play for democrats? a lot to talk about there, including explaining what happened yesterday. joe, willie, me, the host of "way too early," white house bureau chiv at politico jonathan lemire, eddy glaude jr. and special correspondent at "vanity fair" and the fast politics podcast molly john best. she is an msnbc political analyst. and pulitzer prize-winning columnist the great eugene

robinson. this is interesting. we don't do these every day. the latest morning consult survey shows president biden holding a two point advantage over donald trump. 44-42 among registered voters nationwide within the poll's margin of error. what's interesting, it's a pretty big shift from a january survey which found trump leading biden 45% to 40%. the swing towards biden is partly due to an increase in support among independents. in january, independents backed trump by ten points, 38% to 28%. in the latest poll, biden and trump are tied with 34% each. what do you think, joe? >> you know, we always say, it's about trend lines. this is one of many polls. we are saying that more often lately, one of many polls. what we saw last week was a poll that showed biden making great strides and doing it on the strength of younger voters coming home. what we are seeing now is biden

making good strides on strength of independents coming home. i saw dan pfeiffer saying the important thing about the state of the union address wasn't that it would give biden a quick bump. it proved the republican lie that he was some dottering old man, dottering idiot, just proved that to be a complete lie, this is a guy that actually gave better than he got, and it's actually house republicans and donald trump that are looking like, you know -- >> and that's what the biden campaign wants the public to believe and us to believe. the more they see of joe biden and, in contrast, the more they see of donald trump, the more inld pents in particular will like joe biden. they saw the state of the union. we have seen a bump for the president. they said, okay, he looks solid that night. he is up to this job. now they are seeing more and more of donald trump thefrmt seeing the repulsive stuff he is putting on social media. they are watching how he basis outside the courtroom. bewho tried to tune politics

out, who could blame them the last couple years, are tuning back in, i don't want to do this show again, see this movie again. we will see if trend lines continue. the last couple of weeks in the favor of president biden. >> and, gene, two things going on right now. you have trump getting more -- by the day, you know, they are just tweets. they are not just tweets. no. call for authoritarianism. this is calling for the asix flags assassination of political pundits. especially these wall street guys. i will never vote for donald trump ever, and then, you know, three days later, yeah, i'm kinda leaning towards it, which is just -- it's obscene. it's absolutely obscene. this b.s., joe biden's a socialist, they love to say that. really? is that why you get richer by the second? is that why you have more money -- you know, their problem tax season, it really is, if

they are investing in the stock market, it's not that he is a socialist and they have to figure out how to hide money. they are making too much money and they got to figure out how to hide all the record profits they have made this year. stock market at an all-time high. that's on one side, right? this desperation to justify supporting the fascists because you think it may be good for your bottom line. on the other side, the fact that joe biden is doing something, gene, that nobody has done to donald trump in all of his years in politics. he is taking it to him every day. he is mocking and ridiculing him. donald trump can't even put up any more than he cheated to win his club championship without biden making a fool of him. everywhere he moves, biden and his campaign are tweaking him, mocking him. suddenly this bully isn't looking so tough. >> absolutely. don't underestimate the mocking.

this is really, you know, a lot of people sort of questioned that at first. is this really the right line for the biden campaign to take? i think we can now say, yes, it is. it's a very promising line for the biden campaign to take, and it drives donald trump crazy. and that's not much of a drive, actually. i mean, he is already there. but he is going to get increasingly frantic, increasingly cornered by all of these court cases, by all of the money he has to put up, and this is a bad period in this campaign for donald trump and i think there is every reason to expect that it's going to get worse. as you said, watch the trend lines. the trend lines are clearly in biden's favor right now. i know we are going to talk about florida later. but what happened in florida

yesterday, you know, potentially puts that red state back in play, a state without which republicans cannot win. donald trump cannot conceivably win at the very least, he is going to have to put a lot of time and money in trying to defend florida. it's not the sort of rosy political picture that they like to paint down at mar-a-lago anymore. in fact, it's not looking so good for the former president. >> i was thinking yesterday to -- speaking to a senior biden campaign official, that is the audience they needed to reach. david axlerod, a few months ago said joe biden step aside, now saying he is our guy. a lot of democrats are feeling better about their candidate's chances that he is up to the job. we are seeing that movement here after a pretty -- campaign blitz

through eight battleground states. the other thing this official said yesterday, their theory of the case has been the more americans hear donald trump the more they will be impulsed by him and independents will say we can't do that again. trump has been off stage the last month. that changes tonight. donald trump be in wisconsin delivering his first rally in front of a crowd of people in a month. if that easter true social post is a preview, we will be in for unhinged comments. we know how he reacts to pressure. political pressure, trailing in the polls, legal pressure, he's got to be in a court in two weeks. this could go south pretty quick for him. >> the visual of him sitting in a new york city courtroom for weeks and weeks with people like his former fixer michael cohen, stormy daniels, and maybe hope hicks, right, we don't know who is testifying, i think that's going to be really rough visual for voters. and look, we never had an

election where one candidate is sitting in a courtroom like this for weeks and weeks. so, i actually think it's -- i think it's really going to be a heavy lift. and just because all of this helped him with the base, he needs to expand the electorate in order to win, right? he has never worked on expanding the electorate and i think this is going to be -- i think this is a bad look for swing voters. >> has no interest in expanding the electorate. he won't go after nikki haley's republicans. joe biden is taking -- the campaign taking advantage of that with aides courting nikki haley's voters. what's interesting to molly's point inside that poll, the top line number is interesting but the independent swing of ten points in just a couple of months, that's where the action is in the general election. >> right. i mean, we need to brace ourselves for -- jonathan is right. he is in michigan and wisconsin for a reason. pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin.

so i understand the consult poll, a snapshot. i want to understand what the swing has been in pennsylvania, wisconsin, and michigan because we know that's what matters, right? it's great to see joe biden out there. joy you described what's happening coming out of the state of the union. what matters? michigan, wisconsin, pennsylvania. >> i miss those, those three states. you're right. if he wins those -- >> that's it. >> that's it. and i'm curious, jonathan, how do they feel in those states right now? >> certainly better. there are still worries about michigan. we know the gaza conflict weighs heavily there. biden aides said to me some of those young voters are gone. they are not going back to him. they are not going to donald trump. they will find a third-party candidate. they feel like they can stitch together a coalition to win. wisconsin is actually -- usually

the closest of the three states, the one they feel best about right now. it's been trending that way. there was, obviously -- there have been abortion decisions there of late they feel like is breaking their favor. and they like the senate -- >> strangely enough, older white dudes. >> yeah. >> have held for biden. >> yeah. >> it's -- i say it's really strange because this -- we have all these sort of simplifications of how voters go. but there are older white men are doing much better for biden. and i suspect it's because, you know, i guess the older you are, the more conservative you are, which usually turns you against democrats and towards republicans. but here conservatives with a small "c" looks at a guy that's trying to destroy their life they have known 60, 65 years, they want no part for it. >> the president has capped prescription drug costs and the like. pennsylvania, of course, the

state president biden spent the most time in, in his backyard. they know trump's strength in rural areas. the election is going to come down to whether they turn out voters in pennsylvania, philadelphia. young voters, black voters. coming up, overseas with an update on a shadow war spilling out into the public. an israeli strike in syria targets top officials from iran's military wing. david ignatius has the details next on "morning joe." let's get started. bill, where's your mask? i really tried sleeping with it, everybody. but i'm done struggling. now i sleep with inspire. inspire? inspire is a sleep apnea treatment that works inside my body with just the click of this button. a button? no mask? no hose? just sleep. yeah but you need the hose,

you need the air, you need the whoooooosh... inspire. sleep apnea innovation. learn more, and view important safety information at inspiresleep.com (reporters) kev! kev! kev! (reporter 1) any response to the trade rumors, we keep hearing about? (kev) we talkin about moving? not the trade, not the trade, we talking about movin'. no thank you. (reporter 2) you could use opendoor. sell your house directly to them, it's easy. (kev) ... i guess we're movin' (♪♪) with wet amd, i worry i'm not only losing my sight, but my time to enjoy it.

but now, i can open up my world with vabysmo. (♪♪) vabysmo is the first fda-approved treatment for people with wet amd that improves vision and delivers a chance for up to 4 months between treatments, so i can do more of what i love. (♪♪) (♪♪) vabysmo works differently, it's the only treatment designed to block 2 causes of wet amd. vabysmo is an eye injection. don't take it if you have an infection, active eye swelling, or are allergic to it. treatments like vabysmo can cause an eye infection or retinal detachment. vabysmo may cause a temporary increase in eye pressure after receiving the injection. there is an uncommon risk of heart attack or stroke associated with blood clots. severe swelling of blood vessels in the eye can occur. most common eye side effects were cataract and broken blood vessels. open up your world with vabysmo. a chance for up to 4 months between treatments with vabysmo. ask your doctor.

israel. a lot going on across the region. none of it particularly good. >> no, and we've got the major news out of florida and significant legal developments

in trump's trials. first, as you said, let's go to israel. the world central kitchen aid organization says seven of its workers were killed yesterday in an israeli airstrike in gaza. in a statement, the charity says, a convoy carrying workers was struck leaving a warehouse where aid was being dropped off. among those killed was an american who possessed dual citizenship with canada. the organization says it is immediately pausing its operations in the region. the idf said they were conducting a thorough review of the tragic incident. the associated press reports iranian consulate says two generals and five others killed yesterday. one of those killed was an iran revolutionary guard senior-official in syria.

four israelis confirmed. israel launched the strike according to "the new york times." israel has not officially commented. this happened the same day israel and the u.s. met for virtual discuss to discuss alternatives to ground invasion of gaza. david ignatius, break down what's going on here. obviously, at the same time of all of this, we're supplying military aid to israel. is this becoming more complicated for the biden administration? >> so, mika, let me just say a word about the tragic deaths of the world central kitchen volunteers. two weeks ago i was with chef jose andres, who runs in wonderful charitable organization, and he was passionate, occasionally to the point of that tears in speaking about the humanitarian need of the people that his workers were going to serve in gaza. it's just a tragedy to see these

people trying their best to keep palestinians who are suffering under this now almost six-month war alive. so, just want to note that and our hearts go out to the people who are trying to help. the shadow war between israel and iran exploded yesterday in damascus in a building currently next to the iranian embassy. who was killed there, the apparent principal target ran iranian proxy operations for the force of the irgc in syria and lebanon, which means he was directing so many aspects of this war, undeclared war against israel. it's said he was meeting with palestinians to plan next stages in gaza. it was a particularly important meeting. the iranians must be wondering how did the israelis have the

intelligence to target that place at that moment and take out not just zahedi, but six keep deputies. this is an example to me of what israel does with sometimes chilling brilliance, this precision, targeted killing. it's a sign, i think, of israelis turning to something that they can do as difficult as it is at a moment when the gaza war itself remains so difficult, yet sinwar, the head of hamas, may be underground, but zahedi, the chief in the region, he is not underground. he is in a building you can strike, and they did. this has the earmarks of something personally approved by prime minister benjamin netanyahu. these kinds of targeted strikes are not taken without a prime minister's direct approval. so i think we need to see this as something that netanyahu and

a very frustrating moment in the war decided to do. just a final point. this shows israeli force of arms at their toughest and in some ways most effective. the most expert journalist on this subject, bergman from "the new york times," wrote a book called rise and kill first about this program of targeted assassinations. he says that there are really thousands of these operations over 30 plus years, have been almost always tactical successes, but you have to be honest that in terms of overall strategy, they haven't really brought israel closer to the kind of settlement of these problems that it seeks. >> the united states government, the biden white house reached out to the iranian government, said it didn't know about the strike and had nothing to do with it. this was an israeli operation. david, i want to go back to what happened on the ground in gaza with the world kitchen group that was killed, apparently,

seven people killed in that israeli strike there, that israel is not taking -- has not claimed the strike yet, that wonderful group that rushes in for the last decade or into places like ukraine and haiti and wherever they are needed to feed people, in a time when public perception of the israeli mission there has turned. obviously, the sympathies of the world are still with the israeli people over what happened on october 7th. the public perception, the white house pressure campaign on benjamin netanyahu stepped up. this, obviously, makes things much more difficult, does it not, for the white house as it tries to stand with an ally in israel? >> i think it does. these killings need to be investigated. how did it happen that a humanitarian relief workers ended up getting killed? and i hope that there is a sincere, deep idf investigation that they have that obligation. knowing chef jose andres, he'll

continue with the missions if it is in any way possibility. it's rare to find somebody in our world as dedicated to doing good as he is. i was in ukraine last week rolling down the highway and i saw a conway of world central kitchen trucks rushing towards the front lines where hungry people are suffering. so he is everywhere. but we'll have to see exactly how this happened. it matters to find out the details here. >> all right. we're going to move to ukraine and house speaker mike johnson reportedly coming around to the idea of ukraine aid. so long as he can get a political win out of it. "the new york times" reports johnson is allegedly hinging his support on a measure that would force president biden to reverse a pause on new permits for liquefied natural gas export facilities. should that happen, it would give the speaker a personal win

unblocking a proposed export facilities in his home state of louisiana. johnson has discussed financing some of the aid by telling off russian sovereign assets that have been frozen and turning the money into loans. the ukrainians would have to pay it back. the speaker has not publicly pledged support for any option, but stated the house will address ukraine once it returns to washington next week. let's bring nbc news capitol hill correspondent ali vitali. what do we know about this? there is a trumpy sound to that, making ukraine pay back. >> yeah, that's definitely one of the ideas that's percolating, mika, in large part because we have seen the idea of giving continued direct aid to ukraine fall flat, especially among key people within johnson's house republican conference. if it wasn't ukraine, it would be the appropriations package that has him in trouble. if not that, the border. you can really pick any issue

and the realities of a very slim margin that seems to always be getting slimmer in the house gop becomes evident when you speak about the way that mike johnson is going to navigate this next stretch going forward. the house has been recess the last week. this is him getting his ducks in a row here. it's the second time we have heard this idea of frozen russian assets a way to possibly give aid to ukraine even if it's on a loan basis. >> this is not just something that house republicans are talking about amongst themselves. when president zelenskyy spoke about this, giving a readout of what he talked about. this could be gaining traction. it's important to note the way he is a pairing it with the potential to do more on liquefied natural gas, that's something that helps him at home, as you mentioned, as well as abroad. and the idea they are going to try to contend with the border which has been such a thorny

issue the entire time he has been speaker, which again has not been the entirety of this congress. we remember what happened the end of last year that landed him in this tough position. >> gene robinson, looks as if the speaker understands he really needs to get some -- i am sure he is hearing from his -- the chairperson that run the most important policy committee, you get this or we will find a way, whether it's a petition or -- but, but, it looks like we are moving that direction? >> yeah, it looks like things are moving in that direction. but, boy, are they moving slowly. the house doesn't get back until next week. and so, meanwhile, the days pass. the clock ticks. a question for david ignatius. you were just in ukraine. you interviewed president zelenskyy. what is the situation on the ground there now? how long can ukraine hold out?

how are the ukrainians doing? >> so, gene, he was very specific about what the delay of nearly six months in approving this package has meant for ukraine. they can't get started in building new brigades that they need for offense coming later this year, next year. he said that unless the aid comes, he is going to have to shrink his lines, meaning retreat if he is las only got 2,000 of the 8,000 artillery shells he needs, he said. the only way to handle that is to have a smaller front line that he has to defend. so he is talking about having to move west as the russians advance. a lot of really frightening possibilities. i think ukraine will be enormously relieved if this package does go through. i'm told that ukrainian soldiers in their trenches look at their phones to see what the latest news is from the u.s. congress,

if you could imagine that. so this will be a morale booster for the people who are fighting so hard in that country. just a final thing. while the ukrainians have been waiting for the united states to provide this aid, they haven't just sat around. they have been developing their own weapons. they are now sending those weapons into russia. there was a strike just over the last 24 hours. 1,300 kilometers from ukraine to a russian target. so they have drones of their own that hit targets that far away of those refineries that you have seen ablaze have been hit by ukrainian drones. so they are not waiting. they need the weapons, but they are determined not to give un. coming up, abortion will be on the ballot in florida. it's one of several reasons why team biden believes the sunshine state could be in play this november. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

announcer what if you could whiten your teeth by simply brushing your teeth? now you can with smileactives, the teeth whitening breakthrough that safely gets your teeth white and keeps them white every day just by brushing your teeth. christine i never thought that whitening my teeth could be so easy.

i just put the gel on the brush, the toothpaste on it, brush and i can see my white teeth. announcer simply add smileactives to any toothpaste, and our patented polyclean technology activates into a powerful micro foam that penetrates into the enamel surface to safely lift and remove stains. robert you need a simple way to withen your teeth without strips, without trays, without going to the dentist. and it was about time that a product was developed that you would be able to do that with just brushing. announcer and now smileactives is even better. with new pro whitening gel with 33% greater whitening power. clinically shown to whiten teeth faster up to eight shades. 100% of users saw whiter teeth on food stains, coffee and wine stains, even on veneers, crowns and dentures. paul i eat the blueberries, i drink the coffee and i know that smileactives will keep my teeth white every day. janell if you could do something so easy like smileactives to take yellow teeth to white teeth, why wouldn't you? announcer why spend hundreds of dollars for whitening treatments

at the dentist, when now you can whiten your teeth with new smileactives pro whitening gel every time you brush your teeth. call or go to smileactives.com and for a limited time get new pro whitening gel for just $24.95. order in the next 5 minutes and buy one get one absolutely free for just $24.95. that's two for one and save 58%. we■ll even include free shipping. get your teeth whiter, guaranteed, or return it within 60 days for your money back. i smile every day now. the difference is literally night and day. so now i'm always smiling or cheesing because now my teeth are much wither. announcer this offer is not available in stores, so call or click now before the special buy one, get one free offer goes away. only purple's gel flex grid passes the raw egg test. no other mattress cradles your body and simultaneously supports your spine. memory foam doesn't come close. get your best sleep guaranteed right now! save up to $400. visit purple.com or a store near you.

her uncle's unhappy. visit purple.com i'm sensing an underlying issue. it's t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit... unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials. “the price lock, the price lock...” so, if you could change the price, change the name!

it's not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that's uncalled for. the florida supreme court has issued two landmark rulings on abortion access in the state in a pair of conflicting decisions yesterday. the court both upheld the state's strict abortion ban and said it would allow a proposed amendment to enshrine abortion access to appear on the november ballot. the court's ruling was for a planned parenthood lawsuit against a 15-week abortion ban signed into law in 2022, but in allowing that ban to take effect, the conservative-leaning court has also made way for the more strict six-week ban that

governor desantis signed in u 2022 to move forward. the decision yesterday means that six-week ban will take effect in 30 days. also yesterday, in a narrow 4-3 ruling, the court agreed to allow floridians to vote on enshrining abortion access under florida law. the supreme court must approve the language of any citizen-led constitutional amendment before it can move forward. opponents of the ballot measure criticized the proposed wording of the ballot question, saying it was unclear. at least 60% of voters will have to back the move for it to ultimately pass. kind of a mixed bag yesterday, joe. but in a way, not a way that i would choose, but florida is being set up for a very important vote in november, and

they will have some pretty searing examples along the way as to why perhaps a ban on abortion is a problem. >> well, in the short run, bad news, obviously, for women's health, for williams reproductive rights, women's choice. in the long run, molly, and you brought it up during the break, both items by the supreme court were bad news for donald trump yesterday because, first thin the court did was stick trump with ron desantis' six-week abortion ban. extraordinary unpopular. the second thing, making the election in '24 a referendum. the six-week abortion ban. that's bad for donald trump and republican candidates up and downtown the ballot. does that mean biden's going to win florida? it's still a long shot. tell you what. if i'm a florida republican, i hate this being on the ballot. >> they worked hard to keep this

off the ballot. the democratic state party there worked really hard to get it on the ballot. a million, almost a million signatures be. and it went through the court a bunch of times. what's interesting, it tends to be when abortion is on the ballot or any, you know, tends to be when abortion is on the ballot, it wins. people -- >> right. >> even in red states like ohio. what i think is super interesting about florida is that we see how much this republican party has moved even on abortion. remember, they started with the six-week heartbeat bills, heartbeat, right, and now they have moved on to, like, embryonic personhood. when states like alabama, they are going after ivf. so we can really even see the progression of if you give these people a little bit, they are not satisfied. they are not satiated. so i think that this is really something that democrats can run on. >> coming up, donald trump posts a $175 million bond in his new

york civil fraud case. lisa rubin joins us with details on that and much more when "morning joe" comes right back. for moderate to severe crohn's disease skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor that can deliver remission and visibly improve damage of the intestinal lining. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. liver problems may occur in crohn's disease. control of crohn's means everything to me. ask your gastroenterologist about skyrizi. ♪ control is everything to me ♪ learn how abbvie could help you save.

the seizure of his assets whitele indicates is under appeal.

form litigator, mbs correspondent, lisa russian nl. the posting of the $175 million bond that was knocked down are from 450 some million dollars. any surprises? >> we expected him to post. the document itself is not much of anything in terms of what it reveals except for who underwrote the bond. a company called night specialty insurance company out of los angeles, a can stellation of companies owned by billionaire don hankie, the king of subprime loans. he is 127, i think, on forbes 2023 billionaires list. most importantly for trump world, he is the largest individual schroeder in the bank that in 2023 refinanced both the commercial portion of trump tower and doral, the golf course in florida. trump owns in principal $225 million to access bank and has pledged more than that to

don hankie to get this bond. >> so he is a guy who wrote in, had donald trump's back several times when no one else would? >> he was a large individual shareholder of access when those loans were written. at the time he was not the largest, the then-ceo of the bank was. hard to say don f he was donald trump's white knight at that point in time. i think he was the unexpected white knight here. when we think about the bond litigation, alan garden, chief legal officer of the trump organization, filed a declaration that said we consulted 30 different insurance companies to see who would post this bond. when you look at the list of that, night specially insurance is not on it. how we got from there where allen garten is telling the court we talked to the 30 largest insurers in the country, nobody will underwrite this bond, don hankie and his company are willing to put up

$175 million. that's a story to be told. >> let me ask you, as you look at that story, is there any evidence on the surface -- seems like a very naive question. is there any evidence on the surface this is just a business play that the guy thinks, you know what, he repays his debts. i mean, you know, he had a lot of bankruptcies in the past. but, you know, you look at the people that he borrowed money from when he inflated his values, even those banks are saying, well, it was a good business deal for us. i guess a better way to ask that, is there any direct evidence this was a political play? he is trying to create favor? that's a lot of money to be currying political favor. >> i don't think there is right now, joe, on the surface. i think you can say don already has a sizable amount of wealth tied up in investments related to donald trump. some respects, this looks like a

self-protective move by helping him -- >> in for a penny, in for a pound, right? >> that may be part of it. >> yeah. >> he might believe as donald trump said many times, my assets are worth a lot more than some people in the universe think that they're worth and he is making a play if the former president ends up owing hundreds of millions of dollars to letitia james and others, i could end up owning some of this real estate myself. i'd rather own to outright than see him sell it as a fire sale given my status as an investor. >> the expansion ever the gag order in the new york criminal case extending to include the judge's family. trump had been going after his daughter recently on social media. what's your read? is this appropriate to you? what does it really mean? it feels like something that trump is running up against nearly on a daily basis. >> first of all, it does feel appropriate to me because we are at a break last moment in terms of what trump is saying and how

it endangers a whole range of participants in the case. i poke with michael cohen earlier in the week. whatever you think of michael cohen, he will tell you gag order or not, he lives in a constant threat environment, he walks down the streets in new york city, as friendly as you think some people may be to him, he doesn't know if people want to shake his hand or ache a gun out of his jacket. that will continue to the emt environment for people, gag order. given the way the rhetoric ratcheted up against people like the judge's daughter -- coming up on "morning joe" -- >> i feel bad for you. >> i don't think about you at all. >> alrighty. don draper didn't always treat his co-workers with love. but actor jon hamm does. he is here to explain the idea behind that. the madman is standing by and he joins our conversation straight

ahead on "morning joe." (♪♪) (♪♪) try dietary supplements from voltaren, for healthy joints.

on medicare? have diabetes? with the freestyle libre 3 system... you'll know your glucose and where it's headed. no fingersticks needed. now covered by medicare for more people managing diabetes with insulin. visit freestylelibre.us/medicare.

everyone wants choices, but in the end none wants to be one of a hundred in a box. she's unique. she makes the choices, and she's chosen him. she wants to tell the world "he's mine, he belongs to me, not you." she marks her man with her lips. he is her possession. you've given every girl that wears your lipstick the gift of total ownership. >> sit down. >> no. not until i know i'm not wasting my time. >> sit down. >> that was actor jon hamm portraying the iconic advertising executive don draper

in the award winning series "man men." now he is out with a new project, narrating the audio edition of the book "when business is love." the book was written by the firm's ceo and dives into the company's beginnings back in 1852 to now offering their hand-crafted beds globally, with some selling for as much as a million dollars. i have so many questions, jon hamm. [ laughter ] >> first of all, you were just on broadway. you were on "the morning show." you're starring in an apple

series podcast "american hostages" coming up. how does this project play into who jon hamm wants to be today? what drew you to it? >> i liked the message. i thought running a company and running one's life and treating people with respect and love and how you might want to be treated is a message that we seem to have lost the thread of, not only in modern business, but in day-to-day interactions with people. when jan and the company approached me, i thought i respect this guy. i respect what he's done. i respect how he leads with positivity. i think that's a message that needs to be amplified out there. >> when you say it needs to be amplified, do you have a personal connection to this given your upbringing and the family that you developed in your life given circumstances?

or is it the political division you're seeing out there? >> you could certainly make a case for both of those things to be true. for my personal aspect, i've been the beneficiary of the kindness of strangers my entire life, whether teachers or mentors or what have you. we all are the sum of what we are given and what we make of our sort of communities and families, not only families we're born to but families by choice. that extends into your work family. if you work in an environment that treats you with kindness and love, you tend to work better. if you sleep on a bed that's hand crafted with love, your day is better. we're learning more as we roll through this existence. without getting too existential

and esoteric about it, it really does affect our days and our communities at large. they've been doing this for 170 years. they know what they're doing. >> i just wonder if jon hamm has the answer. if you sleep better if the bed costs a million dollars. >> let me make this very clear. the beds don't start at a million dollars. it's a sliding scale for sure, but they do make a wonderful product. i've sleep tested. >> let me bring donny deutsch, famed ad man into this conversation. >> jon, what a pleasure to talk to you.

you so nailed it. just even that scene of you pitching a client. what don draper understood is arrogance was so important in advertising. even though you were in a service business, the client had to want you as much as you want them, and you just nailed it. >> thank you very much. you can thank matt winer for writing that scene. the sales aspect, that's one way of looking at it. what jan and his team and this project have actually identified is a different way too of running a business. it's not necessarily selling your wares, but how you treat your employees, how you establish your workplace. he describes the method of getting to that place. they went through some downtimes in the '70s where it wasn't really working out. they were selling this premium product that there wasn't really

a market for. it was an existential problem with the business. he termed if he started at the home base and said i'm going to treat everybody with as much respect as i would like to be treated and lead with this thing that we are creating something that will ultimately benefit everybody that it touches. like i said, starting with a good night's sleep will give you the foundation for a good day, which will give you the foundation for a good week. extend that out infinitely. it was a radical idea. over the course of jan's generation, it has created amazing dividends for not only their company but the world at large. >> you just described the atmosphere there at that company. business is love, the idea of empowering and making employees

feel like they're part of the bigger thing. that's not how sterling cooper worked. that's not how don draper worked at all. was this a sell for you to say, hey, i'm the right guy to do this? >> it's not how many americans would associate business. it's not how ibm worked in the old days either, but that doesn't necessarily mean that isn't how it could work. jan's example here is proof that it can work. it might not work for every company in the world, but it's a paradigm and example of a template for a different way of doing things and a more evolved way of doing things.

maybe it needs to evolve into something more mature and less retrograde or sort of binary. >> jon, i'm coming out of the bullpen to rescue you. all this talk of good night's sleep and workplaces filled with love, when do you think molina should manage the cardinals? >> teddy is a great baseball mind. we'll see. i think we've got to give him a little more leash and see what's happening. the season's very young. we'll see how it works out.

>> okay. okay. that's good enough. i like it. the new audio book is titled "when business is love." it's available now. actor jon hamm, thank you very much. it's always great to have you on the show. thanks for coming on. >> thanks for having me, guys. we are now two minutes into the fourth hour of morning show. it's just past 6:00 a.m. on the west coast, 9:00 a.m. in the east. donald trump will be back on the campaign trail today in the battleground state of michigan, his first company event in three weeks. he's expected to attack president biden on immigration and securing the southern border, which is hypocritical, because, well, we know. gabe gutierrez is in grand rapids with more. >> reporter: overnight, donald trump posting a $175 million bond in his civil fraud case. for now, the money will prevent the former president's assets

from being seized while the case is appealed. he's also facing a serious cash crunch as he fights four criminal indictments. his share of the social media company dropped by more than a billion dollars after it reported $58 million in losses, causing the stock to drop 21%. it comes after last week he announced he'd sell "god bless the usa" bibles for $60 each. here in grand rapids he'll focus on 25-year-old ruby garcia who died last month in what authorities have called a domestic violence homicide. police say the suspect is an undocumented immigrant who had previously been deported during the trump administration. >> we had him out of here, and he came back. >> reporter: while there are

hundreds of murders in michigan each year committed by legal residents, republicans are citing the case as evidence president biden is not doing enough to secure the southern border. biden's michigan allies are firing back. >> it's been 40 years since our last comprehensive immigration reform. both parties bear responsibility. meanwhile, in a pair of decisions yesterday the florida supreme court upheld a 15-week ban on abortion in the state, while also allowing a proposed amendment that would enshrine abortion protections in the state constitution to be on the november ballot. the division also means that a six-week abortion ban signed into law last year will take effect. the biden/harris campaign now appears to see an opening to gaining ground in florida this november.

in a new memo, the campaign calls florida a winnable state, where they are looking to make inroads. the campaign highlights state leaders', quote, extreme agenda as one of the reasons they believe they can flip it. democrats have seen success making abortion rights a key election issue. moments ago, the biden campaign released a new campaign ad that goes after donald trump's attacks on reproductive freedom. take a look. because for 54 years they were trying to get roe v wade terminated, and i did it. and i'm proud to have done it. >> in 2016 donald trump ran to overturn roe v wade. now, in 2024, he's running to pass a national ban on a woman's right to choose. i'm running to make roe v wade the law of the land again so women have a federal guarantee to the right to choose.

donald trump doesn't trust women. i do. i'm joe biden and i approve this message. >> the ad is part of a $30 million spring ad campaign targeting voters in the battleground states. joining the conversation, we have john heilemann, symone sanders townsend and jennifer palmieri. jen, you were just in michigan. i want you to talk a little bit about what we're seeing with voters in michigan as it pertains to the southern border. do they understand that donald trump had republicans hold back on legislation that would have closed the border to an extent? or are they falling for his lies? >> it just doesn't come up. i was there last week.

i did stops in three states. governor whitmer in michigan -- i'll tell you what does come up. it's breaking through on infrastructure. people, particularly in the state of michigan, where she did an event about battery workforce initiative for electric vehicles, for reopening a nuclear power plant in western michigan, that's breaking through. the broadband investments are breaking through. insulin being cheaper, they understand that's because of president biden. and the other big thing, national abortion ban. michigan passed a ballot initiative last year to enshrine that right in the michigan constitution, but they're very aware and will parrot back to

you that concern and what it means, both for republicans in congress or for trump to get elected. but border, i didn't hear about. >> interesting. what happened in florida yesterday, it sort of feels like good news/bad news, but really big bad news first, because in the next few months it's going to be unimaginable what women in florida will have to face, especially if a six-week ban goes into effect as is expected. are those stories then going to fuel the drive to turn the state blue in november? >> as you said turning the state blue, yes, because everyone feels that florida is not a blue place. it used to be purple, increasingly has become red. but in the last couple of

cycles, particularly the runoff election in jacksonville, florida, for mayor. for the first time ever, a woman is the mayor of jacksonville, florida, and only the second democrat to lead that city in 30 years. abortion was a part of that story. democrats in florida have been organizing. because of that, i think they are seeing gains. what the florida supreme court did yesterday, they ruled in favor of a 15-week abortion ban. last year when republican legislators in florida passed that abortion ban because people were coming to florida to get abortions because it was one of the only places left in the southeast where you could get an abortion if that was the care you needed. ron desantis didn't like that, so he pressured the legislature to pass an even stricter abortion ban and they wrote in that provision that if the supreme court ruled in favor of the 15-week, the six-week would

automatically go into effect. democrats are launching, particularly in florida today, their field hearings, house democrats. democratic leader hakeem jeffries is down there with a host of democrats, debbie wasserman schultz. this is part of a six-month campaign to make florida ground zero for the reproductive rights fight and reproductive freedom. couple that with the biden ad, democrats definitely think there's a path in florida, and i don't think they're wrong, given the extremism we're seeing. >> thanks to donald trump -- and he does take the credit for the overturning of roe and all the different things that have happened as ripple effects to that momentous decision taking away 50 years of rights. i just want to point out as we turn to john heilemann on all of

this, you know, the far right and trump republicans and right to life activists have poisoned the word abortion. they make it sound like some sort of crime by some sort of lazy woman who is immoral. theypocrisy is incredible. at the same time, i think democrats need to be smart with their words. i would take the word life, life of the mother, especially with the cases of unviable pregnancies where we see mothers' lives at risk, right to have life, ivf, right to have a family. i would take their word and i would tell them what to do with it. but it's abortion health care.

it is part of our normal health care. that message needs to be sent to democrats and republicans who will vote on this issue, because it affects their everyday life. john heilemann, michigan and florida, go. >> well, first of all, i think that the message that you're putting forward there, that's out there. i think a lot of democrats are hearing that message and we've seen that over the course of politics. florida emphasized the human cost of this. you said good news/bad news. obviously this decision yesterday is bad news for women in florida, bad news for everybody who loves women in florida, bad news for women's

health care in florida. florida is a state that barack obama won twice, hillary clinton lost in 2016 and joe biden lost it by 3.5 points in 2020. trump increased his margin there. why? almost entirely for one reason, which was the hispanic vote in florida, where donald trump overperformed anybody's expectations in 2020. what's happened with latino votes over the last three years? trump has, by all polling that we have, has gotten stronger with hispanics than he was three years ago. this is why john lemire and people in the biden campaign have looked at florida and said, that's not a battleground state anymore. that's not in the six or seven

states that are going to swing the election. the big caveat to that is this post-dobbs era and injecting abortion into the debate in florida. it is going to change things in florida. it is going to bring out new democratic energy, at least if we judge it on the basis of everything else we've seen post-dobbs. the question is, where are we going to be in september? i don't think you can say right now there's anybody in the biden campaign that says they are convinced today that florida is a state they're going to spend money in to turn into a battleground state. there's too much data that suggest it might be out of reach. but i do think if we get to september and things have tightened there to the point where it does look winnable, you may see that become a reach state for the biden campaign. that would alter the whole calculus of the election if florida became a thing that was in reach for biden.

you'd have this additional state with a giant number of electoral votes in play. sitting here today, i'm not going to bet on that, but i'm certain the biden campaign is going to push to see if they can nudge it into that vicinity. >> at the very least, it will be misdirection that will make republicans spend resources they don't have in florida. let's broaden this beyond the state of florida. what this also does, this is ron desantis and his really tough, really strict abortion measures that now are hung around donald trump's neck. trump, who of course, we know, depending on the day, vacillates on abortion. some days he tries to walk away from it. other days he proudly brags

about it. this makes it a lot harder to distance himself from abortion. >> i want to go back to that ad. it's a fantastic job. the biden people are doing a great job. one reason is they have a lot to work with. when you can put up an ad and have donald trump saying "i'm responsible for overturning roe v wade," when you can run an add that say he tries to take health care away, tries to cause an insurrection, tries to have election interference, when you can run an ad that says crime is actually down, they have facts and accomplishments on their side and they have donald trump to work with. i'm very encouraged in what i'll call the potpourri of what they have to work with. >> jen, you wanted to talk about florida as well in the grand scheme of things, in terms of especially how the biden campaign plans to strategize

moving forward. >> i think lemire is right. at a minimum, this is why the cash advantage is such a big deal, because it puts the trump campaign on notice that they may have to spend a lot more money in florida than they were intending to do. the cash problem can compound itself to make you bleed more money because the biden campaign has more money they can invest in. if the six-week abortion ban takes place in florida, that means the southeast region of the united states is going to have an abortion ban in effect. florida, the gulf coast states, i think we're probably underestimating how this is going to feel to women in america. that means women in florida or anyone in the southeast that needs to get abortion care is going to have a really difficult time to do it.

this is the overturning of roe v wade taking hold in a very tangible, life-threatening way. i think it will have a huge impact in florida, of course. but beyond that it's going to have a national impact. every couple of months the ivf decision in alabama, the six-week abortion ban, which governor ron desantis signed but didn't have anything to say yesterday about the court saying that it was going to take effect. it's going to have a big impact on politics nationally, not just limited to florida. >> if you look at the trump campaign, there's a darkness to it, it's a fear-filled darkness.

it's not about tomorrow or where we're going. it's largely about we're all gone unless donald trump becomes president again. how does that work long-term with all of these other issues? >> it's very doom and gloom. fear is a motivator, obviously, in elections and politics. hope, though, and aspiration is also a motivator. donald trump's campaign is really about retribution. it is about getting at those people, whoever they are, that are not with me. i don't think that resonates with a broad base of the american electorate, particularly independent voters or suburban women voters that donald trump is going to have to win if he wants to be successful. in terms of the ads, they're powerful because these are donald trump's own words. we don't have to put words. this is what donald trump said. he means what he says. he wants the darkness.

if we go all the way back to his inaugural speech when he first became president, he promised american carnage. he meant that. he is trying to make good on that promise in this campaign. if he wins in his second term, i think the american people should take him very seriously. the lack of money for donald trump, though, is a serious issue. he has a speech in grand rapids and then in wisconsin to be a rally. donald trump is doing presidential election type events, which could run him anywhere between 15 k to 20 k per event. i know. we were doing those when i worked on the biden campaign in 2019 and 2020. at one point we were very cash strapped and we had to stop doing the presidential level events because we didn't have presidential level money. but joe biden is a prolific retail politician. donald trump is not.

he hasn't go do the things in diners and coffee shops and what not that joe biden could do. when people get a good look at donald trump, i definitely think they know what they getting. they're getting a man who has a chip on his shoulder, a lot of grievances, seems very uncomfortable with the wool being pulled back from people's eyes about who he is. when they look at joe biden, they see a man that's empathetic, someone who has given his entire life to public service, someone has experienced tragedy and continued to step up for the american people and someone who has made good on his promises that were aspirational, not about retribution, carnage or hate. >> symone sanders townsend, thank you. still ahead on "morning

joe," potential multibillion dollar windfall for donald trump was wiped out on wall street yesterday along with a big chunk of his net worth. we'll talk about the former president's cash crunch as he faces mounting legal bills and an uphill campaign fundraising battle. plus, should the law shield employees from having to answer work calls while off work? call?

♪♪ imagine a future where plastic is not wasted... but instead remade over and over... into the things that keep our food fresher, our families safer, and our planet cleaner. to help us get there, america's plastic makers are investing billions of dollars to create innovative products and new recycling technologies for sustainable change. because when you push for smarter solutions, big things can happen.

speaking of truth social,

the company's stock is plunging after it was reported that last year it lost $58 million. yep, truth social stock tanked so fast, they're changing the name to twitter. when he heard another one of his businesses was tanking, trump was like, "they blow up so fast." as a result of the stock tanking, trump's net worth dropped $2 billion. trump is so panicked, he's now selling copies of the torah. my bible is doing so well. >> donald trump's net worth dropped by over a billion dollars yesterday after his social media company's stock took a nose dive, falling more than 20% in one day. the market free fall wiped out a large portion of the gains it had made since going public last week. the stock tanked after an sec filing revealed trump's media's

main product truth social lost $58 million in 2023. joining us now is andrew ross sorkin who promises to explain all this to us. and we have stephanie ruhle with us. andrew, yesterday i was like, what is this about? >> it's not that this is a company that loses any money. if it makes any money, the revenue number is $4 million. that's it. that's all the campaign makes and it's being valued in the billions of dollars, something like 2,000 times the revenue number. why the sec thinks there's some stock manipulation going on, and it's a meme-like stock that

pushes up the price to transfer money potentially to the former president. that's what's going on here. the question is whether he can sell his shares or get a loan against the shares. he can't just go sell the shares tomorrow. he would need to get permission from the board and that would have to be disclosed. that in itself would have to tank the stock even more because he would be a massive seller of the stock. >> even yesterday when the stock went down 25%, it is still valued at a number greater than what harley-davidson is valued at. technically speaking, you would say this company does not do anything. any other social media platform that went public has a real business. this is nothing. all this is is donald trump posting. you have that whole kind of wall

street bets trump loyalist thing saying i'm going to take this thing to the moon. what could be more dangerous, what an unbelievable transfer of money, unofficial payments, unregulated almost political donations that nobody is going to track. that's when people are looking at the sec saying, are you kidding me? >> what does this say about the stock market? >> it doesn't speak well about the stock market. that's why i said, where's the sec in this? this is one of those true manipulations. some of that manipulation is even happening on different social media sets including truth social about how this all is working. people have trying to push up the price almost like in a pyramid-like way to try to get money to the president to try to influence the outcome of the election. why nobody's going, what is going on here, makes no sense. >> the sec is watching this thing like a hawk. he's worth all this money on paper right now.

but the day he goes to sell this thing, look out below. >> this is a metaphor for how he deals with his voting people. he ends up screwing everybody. if anybody gets any money out of it, it will be him. but you have all these people here buying worthless stock. >> that's on them. let it be them rather than taxpayers. >> the other reason it's never going to make money is nobody's going to advertise on a trump platform other than gold bouillon or these crazy things -- >> mypillow. >> you cannot monetize this. you cannot sell ad space on this thing. i don't know where the revenue stream is going to ever be in this company. >> we know that truth social is not twitter in terms of the former president's reach. it gets amplified on cable and

so on. but this feels like a lifeline. you think, man, he's going to get away with it. >> i also would say the difference between truth social and twitter at this point, you know, content-wise -- i'm not sure which has a greater degree of white nationalism, naziism and other things. i do think the point that steph made and i'm sure sorkin agrees. everybody says, well, donald trump lost a lot of his net worth yesterday. well, he never had that net worth. this whole thing has been a classic con. a, it's not real money. b, he didn't have it until the stock got pumped up the way it

did. of course the stock was going to come down to earth. the question that has been asked and i defer to the business and market savants over there about what trump would have to do at any given point, whatever the value of truth social is in the market, what he would have to do for the board to approve that. i know there's a way to get at it. i know the board is fixed. but i still don't know what would be required for trump to tap the value of that stock. that's one of the big questions about whether trump is going to be able to do this obviously manipulate thing that's phony in almost every respect to get a greater lifeline in terms of his legal and financial woes. >> to keep it at that valuation and sell the shares at the same time is almost impossible. the second there's a disclosure that he's allowed to either borrow against it or sell it is

the day there's going to be a big problem. >> he can't just sell in the night. he has to publicly disclose it beforehand. there will be times for everyone to look out below. >> if you look online of the people who are "investing" in this company, it's not a traditional investment to them, it seems. some of them are being told, invest in this because you're going to make a fortune. but a lot of them literally think they are transferring wealth to former president trump. it's a completely different philosophical approach to investing. >> we can mock the fact that he's selling bibles, but there's a market for it. >> yes, there is. i don't really get it. >> he's the luckiest man in the world. you can't say he's not. >> i want all of you to chime in on this. steph, who works until midnight

and myself who gets up at 4:00 a.m. tell me about the right to disconnect bill. >> in the state of california -- by the way, this has happened in other countries -- there is a bill in place now that would prevent your boss from calling you or e-mailing you after hours and expecting a call back. the bill wouldn't say that it can't ever be done. it would have to be contractual. if part of a contractual arrangement is the boss gets to call you at midnight, that's allowed. but the starting point is no calls after hours and a $100 fine if you call more than three times. >> that can take place in california and stay there. you know who that's for? shift workers. if you want to work on the

clock, that's fine. but if you want to be in it to win it -- and not everybody wants to -- then you're in it to work your tail off. i'm not saying everyone should, but come on, it should be outlawed? >> particularly today everybody is working from home. china is laughing. that's all i got to say. >> there's a lot of laughing going on. also, on campaigns, really you're going to disconnect at 5:00 p.m.? i don't think so. certain presidencies had jokes about when the presidents would clock out, but the campaigns don't. your thoughts? >> the campaigns don't. the white house doesn't. it's a 24-hour, seven-day-a-week job. that's not for everyone, but if

you're really in it to win it for politics, that's what it takes. >> i also think i've seen and heard of anecdotally in my life employees that start freaking out at 4:00 on a friday if they get e-mails and they don't respond because it's already leading into their weekend or they're triggered or whatever. >> work/life balance is hugely important. every individual and every company has to find their own path. for this to be regulated by the government, hey, california you're the only state who gets people to want to leave. >> i'm glad i didn't say that. >> wow. >> thanks for coming in, stephanie.

thank you both very much. coming up, the editor of a major paper is out with a letter to its readers acknowledging the paper's trump reporting upsets some readers, but there aren't two sides to facts. it's a great piece. we'll read it to you just ahead on "morning joe." t to you just on "morning joe. my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis held me back... now with skyrizi, i'm all in with clearer skin. ♪ things are getting clearer...♪ ( ♪♪ ) ♪ i feel free... ♪ ♪ to bear my skin, yeah that's all me. ♪ ♪ nothing is everything ♪ ( ♪♪)

with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. and most people were clearer even at 5 years. skyrizi is just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions... ...and an increased risk of infections... ...or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms,... ...had a vaccine, or plan to. ♪ nothing and me go hand-in-hand, ♪ ♪ nothing on my skin, that's my new plan. ♪ ♪ nothing is everything ♪ now's the time,... ...ask your doctor about skyrizi,... ...the number one... ...dermatologist-prescribed biologic in psoriasis. learn how abbvie could help you save. we're traveling all across america talking to people about their hearts. ooh, take this exit. how's the heart? i feel like it's good. you feel like it's good? how do you know when it's time to check in on your heart? how do you know? let me show you something. it looks like a credit card, but it is the kardiamobile card.

that is a medical-grade ekg. want to see how it works? yeah. put both thumbs on there. that is your heart coming from the kardiamobile card. wow! with kardiamobile card you can take a medical-grade ekg in just 30 seconds from anywhere. kardiamobile card is proven to detect atrial fibrillation, one of the leading causes of stroke. and it's the only personal ekg that's fda-cleared to detect normal heart rhythm, bradycardia and tachycardia. how much do you think that costs? probably $500. $99! oh really? you could carry that in your wallet! of course you can carry it in your wallet, right? yes, yes. checking your heart anytime, anywhere has never been easier. don't wait. get kardiamobile card for just $99 at kardia.com or amazon.

we've been talking a lot in the past few weeks about covering donald trump and his supporters and the truth and who you should talk to, who you have to call out, yada, yada, yada.

the editor of the "cleveland plain dealer" chris quinn is acknowledging that the paper's reporting on donald trump upsets some readers, but that there aren't two sides to facts. his piece really crystallizes it. he says, "the north star here is the truth. we tell the truth even when it offends some of the people who pay us for information. the truth is that donald trump undermined faith in our elections in his false bid to retain the presidency. he sparked an insurrection intended to overthrow our government and keep himself in power. no president in our history has done worse. this is not subjective. we all saw it. plenty of leaders today tried to convince the masses we did not

see what we saw, but our eyes don't deceive. trust your eyes. trump on january 6th launched the most serious threat to our system of government since the civil war. you know that. you saw it. the facts involving trump are crystal clear. as newspeople, we cannot pretend otherwise, as unpopular as that might be with a segment of our readers. there aren't two sides to facts. people who say the earth is flat don't get space on our platforms. if that offends them, so be it. sadly, many believe the lies. they trust people in authority without questioning the obvious discrepancies or relying on their own eyes. these are the people who take offense to the truths we tell about trump. no one in our newsroom gets up in the morning wanting to make a segment of readers feel bad.

no one seems to demean anyone. we understand what a privilege it is to be welcomed into the lives of millions of people who visit our platforms each month for news, sports and entertainment. but our duty is to the truth." mike barnicle, i thought it was important to read that. sometimes things get pretty muddled. free speech is free speech and we should let people say anything when sometimes they know what the truth is. and that's the problem. >> that was a terrific piece from the editor of the "cleveland plain dealer." we were talking earlier about the trump campaign in terms of its darkness and its less than accurate impressions of america and american life going forward.

it's a very dark, fearful campaign. the news media's job is to report the truth about the campaign, no matter how ugly the truth might sound to people who are true believers in donald trump. some of them you have to feel bad before because they have bought into a lie, but others are on the campaign for all the wrong reasons. that has to be pointed out as well. that happens to be the job of newspapers and news organizations like nbc news. we try our hardest. we're going to upset some people sometimes. we're going to make a mistake once in a while. it happens in life and in the business of life. but we should stick with it because the truth, hopefully, in the end always wins out. >> i'll tell you why the media has no other choice, beyond it's the right thing to do. the media as we know it won't exist if they don't do this the right way. people have to understand if trump wins, he's going to do an

orban. he's going to call up various networks and say if you don't take this guy off or that guy off, i'm not going to let this deal go through. >> our job is simply to call it accurately and plainly. if he engages in racist language, call it racist language. if he fuels an insurrection, he fuels an insurrection. >> readers and viewers have to understand that some platforms that call themselves news organizations don't live by the same rules. that's what's made it very difficult out there. donny deutsch, thank you very much. >> i ordered online "the million dollar bet." there's website you go to the wire your money. i got the bet. >> my mental picture is not good. thank you. coming up, we'll speak with

the all star cast of the broadway play "appropriate," which is about siblings who come face to face for the first time in decades following the death of their father. sarah paulson is here to talk about the show that has critics raving. we'll be right back. raving we'll be right back. (vo) you might be used to living with your albuterol asthma rescue inhaler, but it's a bit of a dinosaur, because it only treats your symptoms, not inflammation. treating both symptoms and inflammation with rescue is supported by asthma experts. finally, there's a modern way to treat symptoms and asthma attacks. airsupra is the first ever dual-action rescue inhaler that treats your asthma symptoms and helps prevent attacks. airsupra is the only rescue fda-approved to do both. airsupra is an as-needed rescue inhaler and should not be used as a maintenance treatment for asthma. get medical help right away if your breathing

does not improve, continues to worsen, or for serious allergic reactions. using airsupra more than prescribed could be life threatening. serious side effects include heart problems, increased risk of thrush or infections. welcome to the modern age of dual-action asthma rescue. ask your doctor if airsupra is right for you.

not all caitlin clarks are the same. caitlin clark. city planner. just like not all internet providers are the same. don't settle. you want fast. get fast. you want reliable. get reliable. you want powerful. get powerful. get real deal speed, reliability and power with xfinity. she shoots from here? that's kinda my thing.

now i want you to try. the tip of the tongue, the teeth, the lips. you can do it. >> start with what? >> the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, the tip of the tongue, the teeth, the lips. the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, the tip of the tongue, the teeth, the lips. i'm doing it faster. the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, the tip of the tongue, the teeth, the lips.

the lips, the teeth, the tip of the tongue, the tip of the tongue, the teeth, the lips. >> heart attack! >> it is what joe does before the show. that was actress sarah paulson teaching jimmy fallon what she does to get ready for her leading role in the hit broadway play "appropriate." paulson stars alongside theater veterans corey stoll, michael esper in a play that centers around the three estranged lafayette siblings who reconnect after their father died to deal with his estate. however, they soon discover things in their father's house that lead them to question the true history of their family. and joining us now, the three lafayette siblings, sarah paulson, corey stoll and michael esper. good to have you all with us. it is already a situation that is fraught with tension, right,

siblings getting together after the death of a parent, adult siblings, a lot of reverting, a lot of tension. what are some of, sarah, the surprises that they happen upon along the way that make it worse? >> well, the most significant thing is that they haven't really seen each other in a very long time. michael esper who plays my youngest brother frank, the black sheep of the family, i haven't seen him in ten years, so a lot can transpire in ten years. and some of the things that we discover in the house itself should not really be revealed here on this here edition of "morning joe." i think you have to kind of come to the theater to witness it and buy a ticket because it is a little bit of a -- i wouldn't call it a spoiler, it has got more gravity than that. but i would rather people discover that in the dark of our theater. >> corey, tell us about your character, but also what drew you to this production.

>> you can say me. just kidding. it was not me. it was not me. >> but i play bo, the middle child and i'm very much the middle child, the one who sort of -- the peacekeeper trying to -- >> backstaging me. >> life does imitate art sometimes. but i read it like in 2019, i had been given a stack of all the exciting new plays and that one really, really stood out, just the writing was so funny and instantly surprising. and it continued to surprise me as i read it. >> so, michael, i'm not going to give up the tell. >> okay. >> can't do that. >> in this play. but, it is a play that not to the extent that the play reveals what is revealed. but there has been hundreds of times dad dies, you're going through dad's things, and someone in the family says,

jesus, did you know that dad did this? >> unfortunately true. >> are you -- is your role in this, are you the ultimate truth teller to these two? >> i really like the sound of that. i like the sound of that so much. i don't know if that's true. >> definitely not true. >> i know that they would definitely think that's not true. but i do think i come back with knowing something. and i come back with a really strong intention and a sense of the past and whether or not i'm here to tell them the truth or not, i don't know, you have to judge that yourself seeing the play. >> so, sarah, as mike suggested here, this is a familiar idea. are you -- what sort of resonance are you finding with audiences in terms of how they can relate to something like this? >> i certainly think one commonality is that everyone is a member of a family, whether it is a family of origin or a family of creation by, you know,

the self, that sounds really complicated, but really intense and i don't mean it that way necessarily, but i certainly think every person can see themselves reflected up there. and that is a unifying experience that someone can have as an audience member to be able to connect to what's happening up there. but it is also just very funny too. >> corey, similar question to you. what has been the response for audiences? this is also now, you were a couple of years coming out of the pandemic, broadway feels really back, it took a while to get there, we're all as new yorkers grateful that it is. what has the response been like? >> it is incredible. i never had a reaction like that on stage before. there is some moments, some gasps, some laughs that feel like a sonic boom hitting you from the audience. and there is something remarkable when you have a group of people who are all strangers, somehow they coalesce into this

unit and there is this incredible sense of relief and excitement every night. >> mike esper, last word to you. whatever you want. >> wow, there it is. it is just -- it is an astonishing experience, but i think on both sides of the curtain line, i think doing it is a real gift. i wish everyone had the chance to act with these two. it is really quite something to do and to watch, i think. >> how nice was that? >> that was -- i got to say, pretty special. pretty special way to end it. >> let's leave it right there. on that happy note. you can catch "appropriate" at the belasco theater in new york city. thank you, all, congratulations. >> thank you. >> that does it for us this morning on "morning joe." we'll see you right here again tomorrow at 6:00 a.m. eastern. ana cabrera is next. among her guests will be independent senator bernie sanders of vermont. she picks up the coverage in just one minute. of vermont she picks up the coverage in just one minute. wow.

(avo) request a cash offer at opendoor dot com switch to shopify and sell smarter at every stage of your business. take full control of your brand with your own custom store. scale faster with tools that let you manage every sale from every channel. and sell more with the best converting checkout on the planet. a lot more. take your business to the next stage when you switch to shopify.