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all of the events and tickets online. a few tickets left in kingston, new york for saturday may 4th. that will do it for me for now. now it is time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. >> finally something to watch ly on tv on a saturday night

before snl. finally. rachel, of course, the breakingh news of this minute is the celtics 102, miami one 88. they are up 3-1. i have arranged with adam silver, the nba commissioner, to make sure the celtics are not playing after 10:00 p.m. on any night of the playoffs so that i can watch. >> people ask is what we do with our political capitol we accrue by having television shows. i think that is a very noble use of it. >> rachel, being the multitasker that i am, i was i watching you and the celtics and i loved that you went into detail. i just can't get tired of reviewing the detail of who has not shown up for donald trump and he's begging them to show ng up at this trial in manhattan and he's pretending there is some problem. i have been doing my credit reports, as you know, by walking down there and it is

such a pleasant morning walk to go down to the courthouse and check it out and there is three, was my last count the last time i was down there last week. i do think it is an important story because we saw this horrible terroristic activity on january 6th that was inspired by donald trump and eight on by donald trump. we've had a right to live in some fear of how might that recur and he promised us that it would recur at his indictment of more than a year ago. and it didn't. >> he is demanding that it recur. he's telling, the relationship between him and his followers is a little hard to suss out. i still haven't quite got my head around the fact that when he tries to brag about having green light the vaccines, operation warp speed, his crowd boos at him about that so he doesn't know, there's some weird dynamics in the relationship between him and his followers. in this case, is wenot just predicting to the normal people

that his followers are going too go crazy, he is directing them to do it and they are responding by yawning and not showing up. that has to upset him in some sort of curdling way. i don't know how that results but it has to be just infuriating to him. >> there is an interesting term on twitter where when i mention that people don't show up for this, there is this common response now which says well, on we all have jobs. we trump supporters all have jobs so we can to be there. i don't ask them what jobs they have on january 6th. it is too easy. i don't want to go into that. the other line is that they seem to be trying to say to me, suggest to me that i am disappointed that there isn't a big ride down there caused by donald trump. what i said all along is i didn't expect it. my prediction was there will be nothing. no one will turn out. they will be very peaceful.

and, they are. the people who do show up every peaceful. there's very few of them. everyone else is being very ne peaceful at home or work. the other 70 million who voted for trump are being very, very peaceful and their workplaces are at home, as i expected them to be. >> the criminal justice system, the workings of the criminal e justice system, it is not just a concept, it is a thing that is getting done every day, is a cooling saucer, in a way. in it is slow and boring and indoors. there isn't a big public er performance of this trial. the fact that you may or may not want cameras in the courtroom but the fact that people are having it describe a to them by people who have seen it or being sketched for them by artists who are sitting there and then they hear about it, it is kind of a slowed down, cool process that has a grind element to it that isn't something that lends itself well to hot emotions, despite how great it seems when you

watch law and order or perry mason. this is going to take a long time. he's never going to get that dopamine it from seeing his mi people out there going crazy for him the way he has commanded him to do. >> o.j. simpson got a much bigger so turnout every single day of his trial. donald trump is stuck without the crowd. >> thanks, lawrence. today, donald trump's favorite judge, who was appointed by donald trump, judge aileen canon, federal judge in florida, released the transcript of donald trump's codefendant testimony to the grand jury, walt nauda, which took place month before the fbi executed a search warrant at donald trump's florida club. the grand jury testimony differs significantly from what walt nauda had already told the fbi. count 39 of the indictment charges walt nauda with making false statements to the fbi in his voluntary interview with

the fbi a month before his grand jury testimony. this is one of the lies walt nauda is accused of telling the fbi in that interview. are you aware of any boxes being brought to his home, his suite? answer, no. the indictment says that that one word, no, was a lie and a crime. in his interview with the fbi, walt nauda told them that the first time he ever saw the boxes at the florida club was when he was helping to move about 15 of the boxes onto a truck to send them back to the government. question, so, to the best of your knowledge, you are saying that those boxes that you brought onto the truck, the gh first time you ever laid eyes on them, was just today when trump employee to need you to answer?

correct. help them with the boxes. t the indictment says that that word, correct, was a lie. then the fbi asked walt nauda this more general question. do you have any information that could, that would, that could help us understand where they were kept, how they were kept, were they secured? were they locked? d? something that makes the intelligence community feel better about these things, you know? answer, i wish. i wish i could tell you. i don't know. i don't, i honestly just don't know. the indictment says that answer was a lie. a month later, walt nauda's testimony to the grand jury also in effect says that his interview with the fbi was a lie. walt nauda admitted under oath to the grand jury that he moved boxes before he helped move boxes to be sent back to the government. question you've taken multiple boxes rnsince january 2022 to t presidents private residence.

answer correct. that is what walt nauda, under oath, that is him directly contradicting what walt nauda told the fbi a month earlier. another question in the grand jury, question, it is your testimony before the grand jury today that in fact, you moved boxes up from the basement to pine hall, right? answer, weeks prior, yes. that under oath answer is, again, a direct contradiction to what walt nauda said in his interview with the fbi. at the end of his grand jury testimony, the grand jurors hadm some good questions. grand jury, was pine hall a skiff? witness, no. it is a very important question. important point to establish, get on the record that the room called pine hall where many of the boxes were was not a secure location. another grand jury asked, before you said that some of that you did not know what was in any of the boxes but some of them were labeled.

i guess what i'm confused about is how is it that only the specific boxes with label pens are labeled but none of the others were? walt nauda did not give an answer that made any sense and it remained a mystery how he knew what boxes to bring upstairs to the boss when the boss asked for boxes. so, another grand jury were picked up on that point. grand jury room. so, you're instructed to take some of these boxes up to pine hall ? but you are not instructed to take any particular boxes? witness . correct. grand jury. you just pick some off of the top? witness. yes. grand jury. so, you don't know what the contents of the boxes you are taking? witness. i do not. walt nauda's credibility as a witness in his own defense under oath, during trial, if he takes the witness stand, appears now to be a major challenge for him.

another document released by judge aileen canon shows walt nauda promised a pardon, was promised a pardon for lying to the fbi, according to person 16 in a heavily redacted 10 page fbi report of an interview with the witness identified as person 16 in this heavily redacted fbi report. y donald trump is referred to as former president of the united states. the document says person 16 has not spoken to walt nauda since the white house and did not e know him. walt nauda was told by fpotus people that his investigation was not going anywhere, that it was politically motivated , and much ado about nothing. walt nauda was also told that even if he gets charged with lying to the fbi, fpotus will pardon him in 2024. walt nauda still speaks to person 34. person 16 is clearly someone

who worked in the trump white house and told the fbi of the great "risk for him and thought trump world," because he was secretly doing a voluntary interview with the fbi. the entire second page of the report is redacted. most of the names of the people in the report are redacted. in addition to present 16, there is person 14, person 34, person 37, person 47, and so on. the report says while at the white house, person 16 was generally aware through conversation with person 14, person 34, person 37, and the n redacted was not getting records back. there was no process for fpotus to designate records as personal records. fpotus routinely took documents from the oval office to the residence. person 16 was not aware of fpotus declassify in any records other than the crossfire hurricane documents . according to person 16, there

was no standing declassification order. person 16 believed no one in the white house would testify that there o was such an order, with the exception of possibly person 24. person 24 was unhinged and crazy. present 16-week-old the kim jong-un letters, the obama letter, and the hurricane map being specific records that the national archives and records administration was missing. at some point person 16 learned that fpotus had not returned them and multiple people tried to convince fpotus to return the records in late october, early november 2021. person 16 made his own appeal to fpotus. person 16 was on a conference call with fpotus, told fpotus, "whatever you have, give it all back."

fpotus wanted to know how anyone knew about the issue. fpotus was informed it was all documented in writing. the response was essentially, "we'll check and think about it." person 16 spoke to multiple people around fpotus to send the message that he needed to give the stuff back , that it belongs to the u.s. government and was not worth all of the aggravation. on 21 november, 2021, person 16 visited fpotus at mar-a-lago. fpotus was dressed in golf attire. person 16 told him "whatever you have, give everything back." let them come here and get everything. don't give them every a noble reason to indict you because they will.

person 16 walked away from the 50 minute meeting with the impression that fpotus was going to return the records to the national archives and records administration. not once during any of rcthese discussions did fpotus or anyone else say these records had been designated as personal records or had been declassified by fpotus. leading off discussion is andrew weissman, former fbi general counsel and former chief of the criminal division in the eastern district of new york, he is a msnbc legal analyst and co-author of the "new york times" best-selling book "the trump indictments, the historic charging document with commentary." also with us, bradley maas, w national security attorney rep since people who the intelligence community. andrew weissman, what are we learning by this document released ? this is just a portion of 400 pages of io material that judge aileen canon has released . >> a number of things. first, if walt nauda had been represented by mr. maas, he would have asserted the fifth amendment in the grand jury and not given testimony that was going to be extremely

helpful to convicting him. and, i think the answer is that in public corruption cases, very often people speak when they should not because of the general repercussions, it be known that they took the fifth or they think they can get away with it. and, something that i saw in the mueller investigation, which is the pernicious waving around of the potential for pardons, which makes it very hard to flip people to get them to cooperate. here, it is, there is at least one witness who is going to sing there was an overt use of pardons to do just that, to sort of toward the ability of the department of justice to be able to bring a case in its normal course.

normally, somebody like walt nauda would be somebody who would cooperate and just tell the truth and would rarely be charged for what he knows because, given how low-level he is, but, you know, he would plead and not to jail time. so, this, to me, everything you read is sort of a real sense, it gives people an inside look not just at corruption in ju public corruption investigations but really, a window, another window into the trump presidency and post- presidency and it makes you understand why there are so rs many people who work there who would never endorse him in 1 million years. >> bradley maas, andrew has just raised a great question r for you, which i hadn't framed and i just heard him say this, which is that, so, let's put you in the position of defense counsel presenting walt nauda. walt nauda has gone in to do that voluntary interview . and, he has said what he has said.

now it is time for the grand jury. and, you know he can't say that again. you know he can't go in there again and say hey, i had no idea about these boxes until i was loading them on the truck. i knew nothing. that story is not going to hold up. obviously, he gets into this, sl what he did choose to do is go into the grand jury and give different answers. is there a way to do that, is there a way to go into the grand jury and steer away from the answers you gave before in a way that will avoid this kind of indictment by saying now that i have thought about it, in some way, i've refreshed my memory, or, as andrew suggests,y given what he said in the fbi interview, was this a case where you go in there and just hang onto the fifth amendment in the grand jury and see what happens? >> it is difficult. looking back on this, trying to

imagine putting yourself in the shoes of the lawyer, you have to almost wonder how much did his lawyer actually know about what his client had or hadn't done? you can assume they were confident they would ask questions but did they know the full extent of what had ll actually occurred compared to what walt nauda had told the fbi a month before? based on what we know now, there's no way i could ever imagine a great intellect that client walk in there and testify without some kind of arrangement or agreement in advance with the justice department waters coming back and saying look, i have been retained, here is what we want to clean up, we want immunity discussion, we are not going to talk to the grand jury at all unless we have something in place. otherwise, you bring him in there, he's going to plead the fifth and you get nothing. we don't know what was told to the lawyers back then but it was certainly risky to put walt nauda saying what he did. g

he read to the grand jury testimony, it, all i could think of was sergeant schultz k from hogan's heroes. is like i heard nothing, i saw nothing, i know nothing. of course, as we know from text messages, from photos, he knew a lot and he wasn't providing accurate descriptions. >> andrew, this goes straight to the problem of how walt nauda is being represented and that it is basically a trump provided defense, trump provided defense counsel that is doing this for him. that raises questions of where the attorneys interests are because it does seem, as bradley says, this is a classic case of where you would want to go to the prosecutors and say, look, he can be helpful and he can be helpful in a grand jury but he needs immunity right now. that balances against this talk about walt nauda being offered a parting. if you are offered a parting and if you are naove enough to trust that over immunity from

prosecutor, maybe that is why ec you go into the grand jury this way, knowing how much trouble k you are in. e but, you see the pardon at the end of the line. >> that is a very risky strategy to do that. obviously, a lawyer could not advise that if they knew that her client was planning on lying for a higher up. you are ethically precluded. one thing i can tell you that is a little bit of insider information about how the law rm developed for grand jury secrecy, because what happens in a grand jury is a secret under federal rule of criminal procedure six and two of the justices who people may have heard of who were real fans of grand jury secrecy where justice neil brennan and justice marshall, who are very well known for being liberal justices and people might think

well, why is that? one of the reasons that they gave for grand jury secrecy is they were very concerned about lower-level people being able to tell the truth and be able to speak truth to power and the thought that if there was grand jury secrecy, it would encourage that ability for people like a walt nauda to be able to go in and do that without the fear of their higher-ups monitoring what they were doing. obviously, that is something that ideally could work but obviously, if you are a lawyer, is compromised and not saying that's true with respect to 's walt nauda's lawyer but if your lawyer is really doing something unethical and representing the boss and not you, that defeats the very purposes that justices brennan, marshall were trying to encompass. >> bradley maas, person we16 seems to give the prosecutors a lot of really interesting leadso to pursue. for example, the talk about a

pardon. the way the talk about a parting is presented in the fbi report, it sounds like you're saying that could not get into the trial through a person 16 but maybe that leads them on an investigative trail to a way to get that information into the trial, someone who, possibly walt nauda actually told directly . >> correct. what person 16 says about the pardon is complete hearsay, as we currently know it and could not be admitted for the truth of that statement right there. it could, but as a rebuttal context, depending on what else comes up in the course of the trial, if we ever have one in florida, depending on what kindd of case walt nauda and donald trump put on in terms of their defense presentation. but, for the moment, looking back at that testimony, that was clearly a significant investigative lead for the fbi and the justice department. it gave them a lot of insight

into different players. person 24, as far as we can tell, the one listed as unhinged and crazy seems to be kash patel. all of the areas of personal records being designated, it is not a formal process, it is we just believe it automatically happens, we don't have to do anything about it. >> bradley maas, andrew weissman, thank you very much for starting off our discussions tonight. coming up, yale history professor timothy snyder will join us next with his reading of the supreme court's arguments that they heard on the questions they asked about whether donald trump should have immunity from all crimes as resident of the united states. that is next. is next. new sensodyne clinical white provides 2 shades whiter teeth and 24/7 sensitivity protection. i think it's a great product. it's going to help a lot of patients. i was stuck.

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the framers did not put an immunity clause and the constitution. they knew how to. there were immunity classes in some state constitutions. they knew how to give legislative immunity. they didn't provide immunity to the president. and, you know, not so surprising, they were reacting against a monarch who claims to be above the law. wasn't the whole point that the president was not a monarch and the president was not supposed to be above the law? >> our next guest, yale history professor timothy snyder wrote "right-wing justices postulate

trumps immunity. the objection is that this makes him a king. not so. it's much worse. a king can be subject to law. even george iii was subject to law. the american revolution was justified by the notion he had overstepped the law. this discussion of immunity is something else. the justices are not discussing any constitutional system at all, including a constitutional monarchy. justices are instead flirting with the idea that a single person can be outside any constitutional system, outside the rule of law as such." joining us now is timothy snyder, professor of history at yale university. he is the author of "the road to unfreedom, russia, europe, america." professor snyder, so, there is something worse than a king. >> of course there is. there are lots of kings ruling lots of perfectly democratic countries right now in europe. our tradition coming from the

declaration of independence holds that there is natural law but also british law, which george iii violated and that was the basis for our rebellion. it is not our tradition that there are people who can be above the law as such. the constitution is that every office is given a firm basis of regulation. there is nothing in the constitution which suggests there are people, whatever office they may hold, who can be above the constitution outside of the rule of law. and, that is the danger which i think hasn't been quite specifically expressed here, that the idea of immunity means there could be a person who is outside of the whole system. >> if supreme court arguments fascinate me because they are limited, of course, to legal practitioners. yet, they involve so much more, so much of the time. sometimes

it involve science, sometimes it involves medical science, sometimes it involves history. obviously, a lot of history, american history, other history. i am often wondering what people who have a lot of the authority that the supreme court wishes it had, what their reaction is to supreme court arguments, which is why i'm thrilled to have you here tonight. i'm just wondering, what was going through your mind as a historian as you were listening to it, what did you wish you could have told the court, if you had a chance? >> it would be three very basic points. the one in holding a hearing on the idea of immunity, you are calling a concept into existence where it hadn't existed before. number two, the u.s. history point would be if you are a textual list or something like that, there is nothing like immunity in the text of the constitution. number three, most fundamentally, what the history of comparative law teaches us is that there is a tradition in

which you say the constitution is just there for us to wait and find out who is going to break it and then we are going to endorse that person and give them special rights. that tradition, again, this is history of comparative law, is the tradition. this is what worries me. on january 6, 2021, in the weeks before that, we encountered an individual who tried to put himself above the law and now we are flirting with the idea that, perhaps that might be all right. >> that is one of the things they never do, is look beyond the narrow borders of american mom to figure out their own guidance forward. >> and, i think this is a very good example of how this is a mistake. if you read the 193 pages, or whatever it was, of that hearing, you find a lot of back and forth but you find no real conceptual challenges, except by counsel and a couple of the justices to the idea that there is such a thing as of this

personal immunity. and, in our traditions, in the constitution or not, and other traditions, it is something you are drawn by. you celebrate it, you find the person who will break the law and that person becomes the leader, that is the definition of the fascist leader, the person who is outside the law. in this, as in a lot of other cases, i sometimes worry americans don't really see what they are starting with because we are not looking around. >> yale professor timothy snyder, thank you very much for joining us tonight. coming up, vice president kamala harris made her third camping trip to the battleground state of georgia today to talk about the biden administration's policies to help black-owned businesses and promote economic opportunities. charles blow joins us from atlanta, where the vice president was today. that is next. that is next. of protein. (♪♪)

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today, vice president, harris made her third campaign trip to georgia this year. in atlanta, vice president harris met with small business owners. >> you are worthy of and entitled to receive an investment in your dream and your ambition. and, to seek out the resources that exist and we are trying to make it easier for you to find those resources. but, seek them out.

it is interesting. there is some studies that show that black entrepreneurs are often less likely than others to actually apply for a loan for fear they will be rejected. it is pretty significant data that supports that point. so, part of my advice is to go for it. apply for it. and get the word out. we don't like for really incredible vision and entrepreneurial creative thought. so, it is just a matter of let's not let society or history impede or silence those ambitions. >> president biden will deliver this spring's commencement speech address at morehouse

college, and all black, historically black college in atlanta on may 19th, during today's event at the georgia international convention center, vice president harris said this. >> the access to capitol push that we have made has been about adding more federal dollars into community banks. it has been about getting the private sector and the big banks to invest because they will admit, and we know, they are not necessarily in the place where we need them to be situated to know the community. access to capitol is, it encompasses a commitment to also making sure that we are doing the teaching to then create the access to markets. so, it is about financial literacy. a lot of what we talked about before, around helping people know how to start a business and keep a business going. the work we have been doing

over the last three years has been focused on all of these areas. and, also understanding the context in which we exist, which is the long-standing disparities and understanding that in spite of those who in certain parts of our country want to attack the ei, we understand that you can't truly invest in the strength of our nation if you don't pay attention to diversity, equity, and conclusion. >> vice president harris also spoke with msnbc's tremaine lee. >> i come from a place of understanding that, yes, it is very significant that our economic policies have resulted in black unemployment being at historic lows and it is important to understand that, like all people, when we are focused on the dreams and desires of black men and young black men, it is just to have a

job but to have a career, to be able to grow wealth, to build wealth, to be able to buy a home, to be able to go on a nice vacation from time to time. to take care of their family, to build equity so that when their children want to go to college, they have some resources to help pay for the tuition. the work that i'm doing in this tour is really to speak to that part of a broader and a very broad-based economic policy that is about strengthening the economy for everyone as a whole. but, truly understanding the hopes and the desires and the ambitions and making sure that we are meeting folks where they are. >> joining us now, charles blow, columnist for "the new york times" and a msnbc political analyst joining us from atlanta. charles, how does this kind of campaigning and, by the way, delivering the message of what the biden/harris administration has done economically to people who need to know, so, for example, they can possibly benefit from some of these programs, how does it, how does it get communicated in atlanta,

in georgia that she is there and she's doing this, does it have a real impact and local news coverage? >> this is very interesting because the economic piece is really big for people here in atlanta, including for many black people. what you have to understand about georgia is it is an incredible incubator for small business startups and ownership and we often think about small businesses as people producing things but very often it is people producing services. so, during, a lot of people look back on the trump years positively who produced those services. i talked to people during the primaries here, contested here, of course, some of the like business owners, the men were saying, you know, they thought well of those years. the reason for that is complicated. one of the reasons is that, you know, during covid-19, the red state governors, and we have a republican governor here, the lockdowns were very short.

that probably killed more people, made them more sick and die. but, it also hope to these small businesses that provided services, barbershops were able to reopen, bars selling drinks out of the windows. in addition to that, the covid- 19 impact payments helped into those businesses. they have a good feeling about that, many of them, from an economic standpoint. the biden/harris administration is doing something much bigger than these emergency measures. they are like mapping out how to increase black wealth over very long periods of time. but, the counterpoint to that is that you don't feel it immediately. because you don't feel it immediately, people don't always register that as something happening. part of the writing administration's job here is to help people to see that this is not an emergency stop gap measure, this is something that will impact you for

generations, possibly, definitely over the next decade. how does that translate and if it does translate into more enthusiasm for the biden economic policies. >> how valuable does the vice president appear to be to the biden/harris campaign? >> i think that the vice president is emerging as a very powerful agent in the reelection campaign. for a very long time, people were trying to figure out, and i think she was trying to figure out where her past was, to carve out space for her to be, which is kind of odd because the vice president's job is to be in charge of the senate and step in if the president is incapacitated in some way, and to do whatever the president asks them to do. nobody looks back on cheney, we knew what he did but gore or biden and say these are the

things that they did separately from the president. that's not how it works. so, she was being measured by this strange yardstick that had no precedent. why are we saying she was failing? what is she feeling at? she is completely competent. it is not a lot to do in this job. now she has issues that really tap into her history and resume, the issue of abortion and reproductive access and also on black community and black prosperity. i think those really tap into who she is. so she becomes an incredible agent to the reelection campaign . >> charles blow, thank you very much for joining our discussion tonight. coming up, donald trump had three days off from his criminal trial. three days where he could have campaigned anywhere in america. and, he did absolutely no campaigning at all, none.

always complaining that the trial is keeping him from campaigning. but, on the days off from the trial, zero campaigning. the biden campaign is reaching out to nikki haley supporters who keep voting against donald trump in republican primaries. simon rosenberg joins us, next. nothing dims my light like a migraine. with nurtec odt, i found relief. the only migraine medication that helps treat and prevent, all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment

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nikki haley problem, even though she dropped out of the presidential campaign in early march. "the wall street journal," reports as early as last week's republican primary in pennsylvania, nikki haley pulled in 17% of the vote, including strong showings in the suburban counties. nikki haley voters, largely insignificant in the primary, could play an outside rome come november in swing state contests that could decide the election by razor thin margins. when trump will have to overcome the challenges the results in pennsylvania and the primaries highlight, persuading voters in the cities and their surrounding suburbs where the deletion is younger, has more college education, and higher household incomes. the biden campaign announced a six-figure ad buy in pennsylvania targeting the nearly 158,000 voters who chose nikki haley in the republican primary. on thursday, the biden/harris campaign posted this on social medium. on the left, president biden spending yesterday speaking to

fired up union workers as he accepted their enforcement. on the right, trump spending yesterday sitting in his golf cart. joining us now, author of "hopium chronicles," . the nikki haley voter looks to be an influence on the outcome in november. >> trump is facing a rebellion in the republican party. two former vice presidents, former party nominee, former party chair, lots of leaders of his own administration who have said openly, chris cristi just came out and said they have said openly they are not going to vote for him. we have never seen anything like this in the modern era of american politics. it is going to matter. i think this is an existential threat to trump is one of the reasons he has continued to underperform public polling in all of these states, like he just did in pennsylvania. there is a big chunk of the republican party that is not

really sure they are going to follow maga. they didn't do it in 2022 in the battleground states and i think it is going to be very difficult for him, particularly when he came out and said that he's not interested in nikki haley endorsing him. he's not interested in nikki haley voters supporting him. it was one of the most idiotic things we've ever seen. luckily, so, i think this is a really big issue and it is, the commission structure these folks are going to create for republicans to not vote republican in this election will be unprecedented and far greater than what we saw in either 2020 or 2022. >> another big difference between the campaigns is that donald trump doesn't have a vice presidential nominee to send around the country while he is staying home and playing golf, which is what he's actually doing. but, to see vice president harris in atlanta today, i mean, i played as much of that video as we head to 10 four. there is more, such effective, strong message delivery.

>> i have known her for a long time. we talked on the phone a few weeks ago and i just get the sense from her publicly and privately that she is operating with a high degree of confidence right now. she, you just saw it. i watched that clip. she is connecting, she is smart, she knows the material but she's got this confidence about her, this strength in her performance on the stump that is really important. i think, as charles said, she's going to play a major role in this election for us. i'm really proud of her. she has worked really hard and she has now reached the pinnacle of the game here and she's adding a lot of value everyday to the presidency and the campaign. >> simon rosenberg, thank you very much for joining us again today. >> thanks, lawrence. >> we will be right back. t bac ugh. how do i protect myself? with the new scotts healthy plus lawn food. it's the only product that prevents 27 diseases

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simon rosenberg gets tonight's last word kirker the 11th hour with stephanie ruhl