the russian states never as tired as i'm one of the most sense community best in most all sense and up in the system must be the one else holes. question about this, even though we will then in the european union, the kremlin media mission, the state on the rush coding and split the ortiz full neck, keeping our video agency roughly all the band on youtube tv services. for the question, did you speak to a request, which is the, [000:00:00;00]

the imagine the, you are a hard working, idealistic, young deputy with the u. s. marshal service. you're doing hard dangerous work and you're succeeding at it. you like this where it gets difficult, but you're making a real contribution to the security of the american people. and besides, you enjoy it. you're optimistic about the future. but then much to your surprise to your past over for promotion. you're not chosen for interesting new assignments and then you learn that this is all happening for the simple reason that you just happen to be black. i'm john kerry onto welcome to the whistle blowers the . 2 2 2 2 2 dr matthew fog is one of those rare individuals who is utterly relentless,

but that relentlessness comes with incredible patience when he realized that he was a victim of racial discrimination within the federal government. he file a lawsuit. but let's start at the beginning, matthew fogg joined. the marshal service in 1978 and quickly became a highly decorated officer. he was crossed designated as a supervisory special agent in charge of a us drug enforcement administration joint drug and gun introduction task force. he was later promoted to the position of inspector in charge of the marshal service unit for the international criminal police organization. and he receives multiple awards for tracking down more than $300.00 of america's most wanted and most dangerous criminals. as you can see, there was no legitimate reason to pass this man over for promotion or to deny him new assignments. it was all about race. he won that case, any one big. but the marshal service and by extension,

the broader american government didn't make any of the necessary changes to ensure that this didn't happen again, that racism didn't play a role in personnel decisions. and so matthew led a class action lawsuit that included more than $700.00 current and former black deputy marshals and detention enforcement officers, plus thousands of black applicants who are not hired in the 1st place. that case was stuck in legal limbo for almost 30 years. you heard that right 30 years, the case was dismissed, it was reinstated, and it was expanded over the course of those 3 decades. but lee, last year, matthew and his fellow plaintiffs finally won that case. it wasn't the huge, devastating when that they had hoped for, but it was a when none the less. and it seems that the bite and ministration wanted to actually fix the problem. matthew fogg joins us today. matthew, thank you so much for being with us. it's a pleasure to have you as good to be with you and we just gotta make some

corrections or something. you just say we didn't win. the case case hasn't been one yet, is just been a proposed settlement, which we're not in agreement with. uh well, that's a much more important point. yeah. okay, so let's, let's get to that. i want to start then back in the mid 19 eighties. you're going gang busters at the marshal service in just 7 short years. you made quite an impressive career for yourself. you, you're highly decorated at that point. what happened to make you think that wait a minute? it's, something's not exactly right here, as well as it started in one and 85. i found my individual complaint once i got on the mall, sir. and you know, being a black person and coming into an environment such as a command and control environment, law enforcement. i saw the racism across the board of just what do you keep your mouth shut when your you, when you say so. i mean, you see it all, you see it and everything you're doing. so found at some point we had

a particular manager that was targeting, it is due to african americans, people was most likely to succeed and he came up to me and once he did, i entered for back a lot of people didn't want me to, didn't want to be decided, except it is a little wait till you become the director, will go to the top and you'll be ok. but it seems like anybody else in up with my son on my door, i'd want somebody to step up to the to them. and step up in and be uh, speak up for them. and if, if the system is wrong, the problem is that our system is, is a big machine. once you start speaking out against something that's in a commanding, strong environment, they circle the wagons on you and they try to discredit you. and that's the whole battle. did i begin to fight all the way through to that one that big lawsuit and 98. finally made it to 12 and 98. garrett came back and found the whole united states mazda. it'd be a race, will house down environment for all african american w as marches or the didn't to pay me for me in order to make me a g. s. 15,

oregon to go back and fix the system. but then adjust the problem. it turned around it took a 10 year before he paid me, they say for that verdict, put 10 whole years. oh my god, 1800. reduced to 10000000 down 230-0000. 0 my god. so it's a, it's, it's, it's, it's a constant battle and they sick the address on me by withholding all of the taxes and withholdings that they took out of the judgment. they stuck in on a slice one and ira stuart. i had it and came out to me for 77 more years. gone and see my paycheck and everything. when the government popped up later said oaks, we had the money, we didn't realize we had. now my tax to this day is all messed up. so it just like constant battle. and then on top of that, the class action, all the stuff that you look at, the history of this class action and the number of people that it has affected. and it just blows my mind that nobody on capitol hill use. all of that is as been

written on was mess grassley. everybody spoken out against the, the, the problems of the mazda service. i got a website up big gets with badges right behind us, right. your prose res, 97. so it's not like nobody knows by the washington post. cbs news, everybody's done stories on it, but yet, no one is fix it and no president is unbelievable. you know, and just listening to that little bit of your story makes me think that that's the same story i've heard at the c, i a at the f, b i n s a d o j at the state department. it's the same exact story and you're right to about what the very 1st thing that you said the government is a great, big, slow, lumbering bureaucracy. and they know that they have years, decades that they can use to for you and to ruin you. if they have to that's so true and the problem is, see if we got e o c and got the last saying where it is,

say, okay, if the government is going to use out to expand dollars, the price us, then the government should pay us the price do is out. yes it dollars we as a complainant. if you truly you got a problem, a place a case of discrimination, then the government should pay your legal fees. that's right. them back. that's right. don't say don't at a disadvantage. and then on top of that, the government does a lot of illegal things. the, remember, we gotta understand the government. it's just not just you drop it. is that, but i mean, it just is not some type of inanimate object. it's people, a lot of races, individuals who don't believe that pretty much blacks african americans should be in the government or used to be happened. you've got a job using that be on their level. and so you've got a lot of people in the app places and always when you got a companion control environment is the same as on the street. in model commander is a big it with a bed. and he expects me to treat people badly. and i don't do it,

he can come turn right around and saw me and the next. so you read the roxy is against me. so i got to do what he wants. and that's the way the system works. i want to hear more about your lawsuit and i'm going to preface this by saying, i believe it was along the sea ice torture program in december of 2007. and i knew that i had done the right thing. but wouldn't you know, for the very 1st time in my life, the iris audited me in 2008, 2009201011121314 and 15. and i wasn't making any money. but this is one of those mechanisms that they use to beat up the you. so you ended up learning that lawsuit and you want it a little on paper. it looked like you wanted handsomely, but right, that was just the beginning. so you've got this lawsuit on the one hand that you know, it looks like you want it, but then there's

a class action suit. on the other hand, can you tell us about how that happened? are you a part of both suits? yes. what happened was it personally lawsuit i had that started the 85 and network is way all way around the 2008. in the meantime, the same things that was happening to me, and of course, to continue wasting the retaliation that continued happening to me. after i filed the other complaint which made new new issues arise. man, so by turns we get the on the zillow problem. this is happens all afternoon monday . so you've got a big case here. you've proven now discrimination. what is before we even what the court. but in 94 we filed, we filed the class action lawsuit number. my individual days was still running it. so yes, there we go. that route in the drink come back in and you notice on the british going to do is said, do you find us these monster? it'd be a racial, hostile environmental, african american deputies before 1991 and after 1991. yes. i checked both scratch,

so we were, we had a good time appraisal the case been, we got a firm law firm, different law firm steps and it takes the class action, which that's the case as running. now, in the meantime, my personal case ran it. scores day was when he caught it, appealing it, but then oh he is in 2008. my name's valley paid me. it was so messed up with what they had done to me and then holding again, holding the withholding, holding the payment that they were supposed to get be they don't report it to the arrows in iris since i got money and come up to me for a whole years. oh my just missed my taxes and my state taxes mess. everything kept me from getting my drivers license. oh my god being registered. it just so many things that occurred didn't change the difference in the salary that i would have gotten while i was out of work discrepancies. and it was so many things they kept doing it to me that you know, you just gotta say it again. these are individuals that somebody could pick up the

phone just like in your case, somebody says, well, call the iris and tell me the audit this mean. that's right. and you guys know we course i included. yeah. you can't protect yourself from something like that because you don't have any idea that it happened. i want to ask you to about this class action usually when there is a class action suit, there are hundreds, sometimes thousands of victims. that yeah, that was the case here, but also the most class action suits the accused is so guilty and that guilt is so well documented that they try to settle the suit as quickly as possible. we see that all the time with big companies. the government however, responded in exactly the opposite way and they drag this suit out for 30 years. tell us about that. what were the negotiations like over the course of those decades? or is it that there were no negotiations because the government was just trying to stall you a good note to be honest with you the whole time the class is going the only thing

that made the adjustment room and added to us from a just as that supervisor view as mazda service. the only thing that made them come to the table was the washington post article that came out in $22.00. that basically said that there was a lawsuit and that is possibility that this thing has been going on for 30 years of possibility of maybe going to drown. they can run into the table and they said, we want to settle. the problem is our attorneys went in and started doing stuff that we didn't want to now. so now we had a, a problem between the priority. uh, now we know there's a lot of stuff goes on behind closed or we don't know what's happening. but the bottom line with the amount of money you've got 10000 right now, and i'll put dental a potential 10000 individuals claims. and we come up with $15000000.00, which is a joke. i mean, your asset that in watts or pro, as i said by john decline is get us started at the uncle sam's product to get 5 me the data spread out with 10000 people. you got gift cards at montgomery. yeah. so

this is, this is what we're saying. you possibly fighting discrimination even when you're talking about legally fighting these people. it's always something going on to try to discredit this class and cut it down. dr. matthew fogg, stay with us. we're going to take a short commercial break and when we come back we're going to continue our conversation with matthew fox about the current situation. that minority employees face in government say to the. 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 the world's largest democracy folks, the rest of the planet watches in emerging multi polar world. india's voice matters . but who will be the power behind watches, almost 1000000000 people decide and billions more, react the

the as a result of why it was, can be cited by lines. these can be cited by true importance of we can never be kind of a study since that transparency is extraordinary. john mystic patrice then just succeeded in finding the documents that existed in making them available to the world public. i mean, what could be more holding back by publishing information and sharing information with the public. he was exercising the right to free speech. he did so in the

public interest lies 10 smith and golf and, and honestly, the biggest of late continuously. i know why advice may assume that no one who is the guy that illegal anymore wisely for to just for to be on box weighing a 174, he used to go through the sentence. all. we're going to let that stay the welcome back to the with the blows. 2 and john kerry onto we're speaking with united states marshal service whistleblower, matthew, fog about discrimination in the marshal service in the in the broader us government . dr. fod good to have you with us. thanks for staying. thank you. thank you. one of the things that bothers me very much about this case, and there are actually several things that bother me is that it is dragged on for

so long it dragged on through the administrations of 5 presidents that is in this rateable to me. why is it that no marshal service director wanted to settle this thing and just make it go away? why didn't word never come down from the white house just as just to settle it. so i think is when you're dealing with racism in the united states, department of justice, you're talking about the premium law enforcement agency in the world. i mean, you get like right behind the big gets with badges that com does. so you can go to my website and read about it, but that was on the front page of the new york post and 1997 that you would have thought the fall out from that. we had congressional hearings, maxine waters and big hearing an adult at that time or it code. a black deputy attorney general was a black with the deputy attorney general. and we had these marries, we laid it all out at the one why deputy who showed up a big old rap. they gave him because he testified against the government because of

his black pod now who was sitting next to me at the table. now that man got killed later, somebody ran to stop the road broke his neck. you know we, we've very suspicious of that, my god. but the reality of it is that i think when you're dealing with racism in the us department of justice, they wanted to dig in and say, and the judge said that it much router courtney as my attorney. so you're telling me you're just brahman doug. it's use it on his e, okay. and he was basically saying, yes, i mean, bottom line is where we all look all the years. it's taking us to resolve this matter. so i think what happens is somebody over there in a d o j, they just don't want to be seen as the culprits of the things that they're supposed to be going around the country to go against other police departments and organizations. so be holding them accountable. yeah. can you hold somebody accountable when you yourself have been found guilty of it in a federal court most of the time there's none of the route most of the time does

a settlement and you know and settlements. they always say we didn't do anything wrong. in my case, more with the drought, we got a judgement. so there is a wrong doing a wrong finding. now, within the last election. yes, you get people over this thing that we, we don't want to deal with racism. we rather do with anything other than that, accepting the fact that we're agreeing that somehow we are racially wrong. we've done the legal things. now you've got drag note operations going on at the us box, who is responsible for around the country, and you've got people being shot in the back. and then after the americans, big disproportionately locked up. targeted all it is bodies, us margin, drag net operating with state and local, and the state local don't do what we do. they don't follow us. what have we, whatever we allow them to get away what they want to do. why do you think that change your let me rephrase that. why do you think that has begun to change with at

least this proposed settlement here? so i don't i again, i don't see it as changing it. see because the proposed settlement is so low. yes. that is making mark rita says that my me to be honest with you. this settlement would set a precedent for anybody who decides to fight the institution transport. do we have 10000 things? if you have 10000 folks that have a leg discrimination over 30 years, and you want though, 15000000 of them come on. the same attorney's said back in 2008, when they took a portion of this case a, a case had coincided with this one same us monitors in the federal court. the same attorney said the case of worth 300000000. now we had at that time, 700 people. now today we got 10000 and we dropped down to 15000000. something's the matter with that. yes, there's a problem going on behind the curtains. another thing that bothers me about this

case is, as you just said, the thousands of plaintiffs involved are offering this, this $15000000.00. at 1st glance, that sounds like a great deal of money. it's not, not at all. here in the united states, the law firms that handle class action suits take a bulk of the money for their work, their expenses. i'll give you an example. i've been a plaintiff in 3 class action suits in the past year. and my portion of this settlement has been 7 dollars, 20 dollars and a $100.00. what, what you're talking about here, let's say there are $10000.00 plaintiffs and a $15000000.00 settlement. the. busy law firm at the very least is going to take $5000000.00. you're talking about a $1000.00 a piece for each of these, you know that you can't do anything. it's going to be less than the 30. ringback for 39 years of discrimination. so why is it, why is it that the plaintiffs attorneys seem to have dropped the ball on this?

why the government not me? go ahead. let me just what i, what i think is you gotta remember where the e l. c were not in federal court. now this is the e o c. so we, it's called administratively and we've been in federal court, i think is what have been resolved long time ago at the attorney that the lead attorney that was handling the case for the same law firm. he passed away a couple of years ago when he passed everything changed, right? i think to be now i always wanted with them and i can tell you this always told them that we need to take this thing in the photo. what i was ran this long, long time ago, but it never happened. and i think what happened was we thought they thought that maybe the pipe would get bigger and bigger and everybody would be better off. it didn't turn out to be that way. it turned out to be that it turned out to be the opposite and it turned out to be where the product gets smaller. right? and, and the distribution is gotta be spread out with all of these people, which is absurd. it makes no sense at all. so yeah, i think right now we're in a,

we're in a very difficult situation, but we still administratively, if we pull this thing in the front of port is gonna be a lot of media behind it. because i believe that at that point now in the world, everybody's thoughts are here. what's been going on and thought that this thing was, these are the brand that it wasn't. and you have had a front row seat for racial discrimination. the marshal service for almost 40 years, has it has anything improved over that period of time understanding that it's a never ending fight? is it at least better than it was? or is it still has to be, you know, i was just that brought it literally before the general assembly about the same thing about a particular building and one opposite 1100. let's lays at that same for us. huh. and i looked around us and yeah, things have improved. that's it. the technology and i showed up my camera, i said we would come up please do tally and all the words i said before, nobody had it on caramel. we was beaten them down and doing whatever the status on . yeah, i said,

so that's what it is. people and social media. more people are hearing about this stuff now. yes, that's what's in as far as the attitudes and i'm a job man, i'm telling you, i can tell you here and down up the 40 years, it blows me a way that how this stuff actually you're talking about taking back america is one back. which, yeah, is going backwards. race up there, we're talking about here in law enforcement, the police brutality on the street and everything that was saying, why would it be any different if we're riding bigots with badges working right next to us? why would i expect them to treat somebody on the street? you know, you don't stand a chance. i'll be on that street one against one of these bigots with a badge. and that's why i was so glad when at new golf pro said it's a weird said it in $97.00 isn't related uh, just to be. they did a comprehensive report on the us martin's or with anybody go to and read all about it. and all of this, sabrina stories is one of the law enforcement stories. so that there was

a culture in place, a call to really difference. that was really something you would normally would have thought would have been in the us department of justice. i regret that we are even having to, to have this conversation in 2024. you know, like so many americans think that this, this nonsense was dispensed with. 40 years ago, and that's just not the case. it's, it's an ongoing fight. it is and, and, and is so sad because, you know, being a black person and having see is one thing to say, okay, you know, you, you file a complaint to get it fixed, and you might have a few individuals that all have some, you know, a home a big uh, ideas and thoughts, but when you get into a system and you see that the system project and so at all course, then and then it shows me how that's what i tell about command and control environments. once you want to stay in a command and control environment operates,

if you come into the system and you happen to have a boss as a racist or whatever years, don't like blacks or whatever. but he's a boss. he's got a lot of power. at that point and it does something to oh, you got to just turn, you'll hear the same way that guy put his knee on the neck of the doors fluid. yes . and we did kill them. i guarantee you want him opposite or jumped up. it points him opposite. man, that's too much force and do it more. it is a bad they would have bought that all the supplement. jobs without industry is really names of these duties without the type of problem that you're dealing with in the whole law enforcement mechanism. dr matthew fogg. thank you for joining us. matthew, fog one because he was on the side of righteousness and because he was patient, winston churchill, one said that success is not final and failure is not fatal. it is courage to continue that counts. he was right,

just ask matthew fog. i want to thank our guests, matthew fogg for joining us and for the courage and selflessness that he has displayed to out of his adult life. and thanks to our viewers for joining us for another episode of the whistle blowers, i am john to yahoo and we will see you next time the . 2 2 the take a fresh look around this life kaleidoscopic isn't just a shepherd, reality distortion by power to division with no real opinions fixtures designed to simplify. it will confuse who really wants a better wills,

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