the, the, [000:00:00;00] the hello and welcome to cross cut bullhorn john peter lavelle. here we just got some real news, or rand has retaliated, is the us getting ready for a wider war? and how many wars is the binary administration planning on fighting? how many can it when to discuss these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess george, send me while we in budapest, he's a pod cast. read the goggle, which can be found on youtube and locals, and america,

cash. we have martin j e as an award. winning journalist and commentator, gentleman cross stock role is in effect, that means you can jump anytime you want, and i always appreciate it. all right, let's start out as usual with george in budapest. well, george, you and i have talked about it so much on this program and on our podcast as well we, we like everyone else was waiting for you around to react to the april 1st bombing of it's consulate in damascus. well, it is happened and it's about $331.00 different types of projectiles. israel claims they've destroyed almost all of them, minor damage, but that's their version of the story. and ran says it was an overwhelming success . we would, if we wouldn't have expected differently from both parties. what does this all mean? because really what it gets down to is that all the discussion now is not about the genocide, but will or israel react in kind or escalate your thoughts. george? where is the city right? them is the that is now the discussion because,

um the united states. and this is, i think, a surprise of all of this the united states, united kingdom, friends, joined israel in, in fighting office. um, i drove in in the miss, i'll attack, that's a very explicit to commit, but yes, and that is a, a surprise. no pending made this a commitment. it seems as if the united states, so far as we can believe, the media posts the united states is now pressing israel, not to retaliate and kind not to be provoked into uh, into launching an attack against the wrong. well, that's a hopeless in depth. i is, that isn't just good to say what all right, well, enough is enough. well, we'll call it a day, which is iran that's around this position which is, well, we regard this affair is now over. but is where it is, but it's,

i know this is not over a, this is just the beginning. so at this stage, i mean, is the why the united states and said, well, we don't want lives in the yahoo to do this. and they've lived in the yahoo does attack iran. we will not join him. well, that's not really, you know, within the american jurisdiction because it goes, if it is well, it does attack iran, then, you know, all bets are off. i mean, it's like you, you know, united states isn't going to be able to say, well, we, we, we didn't have anything to do with it because you've already made this commitment. you already helped israel. and what was, after all, a retaliatory strike of it is around stop of the whole thing. iran retaliated the united states britain from you know, i joined israel is sliding off this retaliation. well, you are now off is do the conflict. exactly. iron clad commitment during and now it's going to a i am glad commitment afterwards. you know,

martin is very interesting. if you look at the reaction in western capital's, um, uh, there is no condemnation even at the united nations security council. but israel did in, in the bombing the uranian consul, it in damascus. but now they're coming out in lock step, saying this is out of self defense. but they, it's, it's really quite a whimsical, isn't it? is that it ran, did it be, did it's action in self defense against an action taken against it? the half the story is not reported. oh, yeah, certainly. and that's a very, very typical. so western media, british made assessing me is that we haven't got the notes that we haven't got the correct perspective. so john is right in the narrative, which is really what you know, the, the doing simply to please the most is the intel. so this isn't the government in the state in germany just in the last few days a conference happened supposedly hosted by you on his very focus from the greek

clement of finance minister was canceled by the government. please just shut it down completely. you know, i believe you will not have debate, you will not talk well martin, it's really interesting. it was pointed out to me that if that conference had occurred, we never would have heard about it because it was shut down. we've all heard about . this is the, the name getting negative returns. keep going. yeah. it's, it's stupid. i mean, the classic way of promising a book is going to find, you know, and it's the same with media. so now they've got more, you know, and the, the published in june academic from, from alaska, and couldn't actually fly in and give his speech. she was threatened also with even putting online. so this gives you an idea of just how, how far she's sweet because we all know. so she societies and the very thing that we claim into default in the 2nd level now is devouring all of a sudden, this is partly, you know, why you have a situation where by iran can do what it did over the weekend. and it doesn't get reported that quickly, and it gets important in a certain way,

which presumably will promote these, right? is us your says to them, take it to the next level. you know, what's interesting, what's really interesting about what happened over the weekend was it, it was by message, it was very precise and i think it was very small. and the rightness to do exactly that. they sent over 300 tribes. they knew the most, those trends to be intercepted. they knew the minimal casualties. but you know, it must a little miss. a little miss, you know, the main one. well, we, we haven't set it yet, but there was the 1st time in ran was attacked, is really right. yeah. even you didn't think that was possible. yeah, you said of the last show that probably is so the proxies would get involved, but actually i run so, so that's something for these ladies to really think about, you know, that. okay, next time we decide to hit iranians in syria. we know what to expect or perhaps was perhaps it would be not $300.00 tribes, but $600.00. but the point is, is they wouldn't have been able to defend themselves if it wasn't for the americans . the british, unable to control dania. so, you know, and then another mist busted,

you know, joe dang, children's king up to the opened up us base for his rate. he checked some british already of just into set these trends. so there were a lot of lessons love and i think it is around wanted to deliver a message very clearly, it really succeeded. i think it was a moral victory for you, right? unless for israel, because this role isn't going to learn the lessons as well, is going to look at now how it converts on the 8th. and that will be the breaking point of the west. you say the cost on agreement. so the, i think, i think the bible's mind is very clear and it won't go further. if israel goes further, you know, now where would israel, here's what is good, what is the stop? these really is what is, what is what they're getting. a green line here, you know, church, it's interesting. we have a some interesting cemetery here. you said in your answer interrupted barton. you know, the, the main, the headline story is that it ran, attract israel in response. least on this by the response to the attack on its embassy. but you had

a missiles coming in from iraq 11 on the m. and you've already mentioned how the u, the u. k, and france and others of helped israel. we're getting symmetry here. this is something we all have talked about for weeks and weeks now. is that the, the of the access of resistance is real. go ahead, george. well, it certainly is a real look, but the question is then, where do you take this? how far do you want to take this because when you're dealing with israel, of you're dealing with a pilot that isn't restrained by the normal constrains that bind um, other paolo's. so when, when does it get that? apparently, i mean like again, we're only going by medium because apparently the bindings has on has told lives in the abo, hey, you want take the wind. don't take it any further. um,

well let's say he did say this. um that doesn't bind this in the yahoo in any way it's oh and um, and we know, you know, and there's a long history of this. that is royal, has one to 2 embroiled the united states and a war with iran for many, many years. and this has been going on ongoing thing quickly, this prime minister of i is really exactly in the notes in the our, in the policy was always, oh, we're going to hit the wrong, the nuclear facilities. we're going to hit the around new bip as soon as knowing that if you're around retaliates, then somehow the united states gets sucked into the war. well, chances are, that's what's gonna happen now, is there a will hit iran's nuclear facilities of your own will. doubtless, originally it's going to be hot. so the united states, the stay out of this war will be no doubt bite in the blink. i'm sorry, no, no, no, we don't want any escalation. we're not gonna get involved, you know, and auto body to accomplish. it's going to be quite hot once you've made this initial commitment,

going to be hard to say out. judge martin to the 1st question i wrote down for this program in my notes, and i'll pitch it to martin right now. the good, the last program is that i always give the good question to george on give a good one to, you know, who's controlling the narrative. martin? yeah. yeah, that's, that is a very good question. um, who is an adult? what wagging the tail, wagging the tail all the time is like an adult. a thing in the next 24 hours or 48 hours. we'll see. we'll see what the biden is able to actually show how i think most of america is and how much israel needs america and breast some of the few other key allies on that side. but i don't agree with george. i don't think these writing these off that stupid. i don't think them cuz that fall to fit nuclear installations inside iran. i think that well, they've assassinated their scientists. i mean the, the survive to, i mean, i don't see how they're, i think it, let me finish it. it's only limited now, not limited, unlimited. go have

a minute. let me make my point. i think whether it will sit where they, if they do want to escalate it further and make that point. but i think they'll do is they'll go for it writing and soldiers in syria, which there are many, you know, the last 2 or 3 years. a lot of them, every radian ministry installations been built, which isn't reported so much, i'm gonna write them in the minutes. just wanted to see what the right i think that will be and it will be strikes and you know that they don't want to make that point . that way. now at that point, when we get to that point, then we have a real tipping point because then london and washington will have to decide, you know, we need some common sense here. you know, is, is by doing really going to still in election campaign with the, with the, with the, with a 3rd war. you know, a opening up. i mean, it just seems not so, you know, we, we never been this fall. no, this is new ground, the americas. no american president was ever really wanting to take on around, you know, war and what, edging towards the, you know, this, it would seem suicide. full for the bottom administration. i'm from the west in

general. you know, i mean, and the other, all the other thing which i wanted to make point about is that there must be people in the minutes in israel, or close to nothing. you know, who, which are telling him about the practicalities of having a side front. you know, can we really take on a run when we go gossip of this boys in point we're about to go in to rough. uh, you know, if we, if we took the escalation to the next to the next level and started looking at around as an enemy, that would mean husband, it was stop pissing us on northern border as wells. and the big fear list have been talking about some months now. is that hezbollah this time, as opposed to 2006, this time will go in for land invasion of a northern strip on this? well, that's, that's part of the defense. that's part of this trusty, which is probably the wisc kept secret in the middle east. yes, i always at the end of the day is that they have their, their high card. it's called the united states. and given the rhetoric coming out of the united states, they have not put themselves into

a position where they cannot say no to israel. they can say no to a genocide. they won't say no to a war. gentleman, i'm going to jump in here. we're going to go to a short break, and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on some real need. stay with our t. the . at the end of the 18th century, great britain began to conquer and colonize australia. from the very beginning of the british penetration to the continent, natives were subjected to severe violence and deliberate extra patient. according to modern historians, in the 1st 140 years, there were at least 270 massacres of local be both of any resistance to the british was answered with double cruelty. hundreds of natives were killed for the murder of

one settler. indigenous australians were not considered complete people. no wild beast of the forest was ever hunted down with such unsparing perseverance as they are. men, women, and children are shot when ever they can be met with squatter. henry myrick wrote in a letter to his family in england, in $1846.00 plus strategy as fast as these rightly described as blood. so in races, if at the beginning of colonization, there were one and a half 1000000 indigenous people living on the continent, then by the beginning of the 20th century, their number had the 3 still 100000 people. despite the indisputable historical facts, the problem of full recognition of the crimes of white australians against the aborigines has not been resolved so far.

the door that those portraits of the month and you said i will talk you soon. so the media search for the new settings for me with some great things. i'm really from it on the know me? yes it personally. so the money to the sale be the name is the at the was the east you permission to complete it? you think you should get us the bush, which is such as to me and i don't i thought a soup. inducing that to to see vegetables past the welcome back to cross that full barnes. i'm peter lavelle here. we just got some real news. george,

let me go to you. one of the 1st things that came out of the bite in ministration, which i think. so for most people, western audiences they wouldn't pick up on it. but i certainly did a bite and wants to contact his g 7 counter parts. again, this is the post colonial masters, making decisions about them. it's like sikes pico all over again here. i'm sure they're not aware of it. there. they have no sense of irony about their um, the way the how they see the world. the world sees them in a very specific way. these old, colonial bowers, they gonna come in and intervene again. it's amazing, george. that's a very good question. um, because the j 7 is a very narrow group of uh, countries. um, i think of, oh, pretty much all of them are all members of nato. think 6 of them with the exception of the japan. japan is essentially kind of a satellite state of the united,

the space at least as far as foreign policy is concerned. and it's in a very interesting binding this. the initial response is, oh, well, we're going to go to the, the g 7 is on the, on a allies. and that somehow this helps in any way because of who you're dealing with, the countries that are not allies of the united states, and they are aligned with other countries that are also not allies of the united states. so it's a very narrow focus. and um, you know, obviously the normal place you had to go is, or it will have a meeting at the un security council. but that was in the united states as the initial uh, response. and if i click on the, you know, the, the un security council, but other than that, you make the usual condemnations of the iran and suggest that the ron was acting as the address. oh, which is what the americans are me saying, which are the bab up of thing with the origin soon i was saying that and no doubt

they gonna spout this thing. i think at the un security council meeting. but what is a really interesting here is that by doing this, essentially the united states is escalating things you try. i mean, that's a bit precisely if you go to this narrow group, this narrow a bunch of states that are closely aligned with the united that always support us foreign policy that never criticize you as long as you are essentially escalate to because you're centrally of say, that hey, we are all with israel, we are all committed to israel and whatever happens next, we have israel's backs. well, that's an escalation as well. you know, martin, you already brought it up here, but, you know, in an election year, joe biden, who is not doing bit, were very well in the polls. but as i always say to our audience, here's an maybe summer time. i'll start looking at some of the holes more seriously . but, you know, you have under biden's watch, you have the catastrophic withdrawal from afghanistan. those images from couple are still with us here. we have the, the,

the proxy war and ukraine award that never should have happened in the 1st place. and obviously the genocide going on and gaza, there is and stationing troops in tie one, of course it ran into the perennial enemy here and has blow they got in on the act over the weekend as well. um, how many wars can bite and um, um give attention to. okay. and as i said in my introduction, how many can a, when you have, how many can you mess up? you know, because there you go. bit better, you phrased it better than i did. yeah. if you just put, if you just run off the list even before him, you know, going back to the 2nd one. well, i mean, they'll just dozens of examples where america with this west and button is often britain, you know, just plowed into countries and just got involved in internal conflict and messed up . i left just a, a trailer, have a clemency behind. so, you know, just more recently, you know, you, you mentioned ukraine. i'm now garza and,

and it's, i think the american public when they look at it, i remember buttons administration. but when they look back at it and they reflect on it. and some of the more, no less leaning media to these kind of a video montage in the last few weeks. selections of, of buttons from policy footprint. and you can, you have that classic like chronic, you know, i'm footage of thousands of people running along the, the s trip a couple apple with that sees one search and i think it was, you know, these images, people, people who start to come understand foreign policies yeah, we have is blue color, look in america, but they can't understand. you know, how constantly there was this repetitive same, went by the ministry. industrial complex makes a huge amount of money. a politician seem to be very happy in oral driving around a new cause and buying glitches. and yet, food of the supermarkets getting more expensive gas front gas pump prices are coming up. you know,

more americans are losing the homes. people will start to understand the fund minutes rise for them for on policy is just basically does offices are for the country? well, i, you know, i have to push back on that a little bit, george, because the, the, the, the, we're all veterans of how this propaganda machine works me of. yeah, well, prices are up because it ran ok because a ran is about a threatening is real. okay, it's a mazda is fault. okay. they, they never take responsibility for their own actions. it's always, of course, and of course rush is always had filed for whatever you want with climate change may be even. so. um, but you know, i think really to the point here, george is it with all of the complex that i mentioned and went in with martin had to say, here is the united states vulnerable. and it is the, is the west vulnerable? because if there seems to be some kind of tipping point going on here, now, is that, you know, this was there, there's a swarming effect trying to get the, the, i mean, you got to feel the profit bad for the zalinski crowd. be good. everybody is going

to be just about them because of the 1st order of business and congress. you know what it's going to be on monday morning. george support for israel. go ahead. but what was right say that is it is easy to say, oh yeah, so go go back to 1945. it's old. you know, us incompetent us foreign policy, but there have been years since 1945 in which the us exuded competence. the us achieved foreign policy goals. i mean, you know, the boss complex treaties was signed with above by the united states. you know, a boss network of agreements sign and by the united states. i mean, we will help set the helsinki process to speak of the we talked about the, the nixon era. and we talked about these, you know, again, one major agreement officer and all the, and these work foreign policy accomplishments. now, something has gone wrong in recent decades, wasn't meant to say, hey, the influence of the neo cons. but because what we have now is the united states

kind of reacting from one crisis to another, getting itself involved in one crisis, offering another without any overarching vision. of what it's trying to achieve because it's somehow, well, you know, we, we, we, we have to support the landscape as opposed to crated. we have to have these rails back. but at no point does the united states think, well, what is, what is the united states go? what does the united states trying to achieve? what, what, what is the, you know, what, how does the united states envisage the world in the next 1015 years? and that's what believes what you had back, you know, 3040 years ago where at least you had a, you know, a president who was thinking in those terms. so i think there's been a drastic decline in us foreign policy leadership. and the both of us as of all of this is by the payment was they get a little hopelessly incompetent. is head filled with some of the logical platitudes

that you never really understood the go back to the 19 ages and i think now you list all of these things. you know, we had the, the bite and meeting with the japanese prime minister there in the, with, with the philippines. the problem is that, um that's, that's directed at the china. we got the hope zalinski thing ongoing, still demanding that the more of them will be sent to your grades. and now we've got this. so it's a, you know, a past, you know, complex of, of issues and the arts. this has no idea what to do. other than go continue down this path as well as they, it's certainly not to um, entertain ideas of diplomacy is george rightly pointed out. okay. so the, the great for him, the great struggle as we all 3 were coming up was the cold war and it was managed, okay, it was manage, we avoided war. but more, i'm, i'm very cynical about this. and of course, you know, i've looked at the major headlines before we started here. it is very pro israel. what, what, what else would you expect from western media?

but it seems to me, it's more of a cover. i think they've very little coverage and will on the almost none in western media is what's going on in the west bank. it is target for risk take what is going on right there to the, the, the, the, um, the, the destruction of the land and people of gas. it continues unabated, but we're not talking about it. okay. and i think this is all very intentional. it was israel that started the probably cation by attacking the the consulate in damascus. and that's exactly why i ask you that question. who was controlling the narrative? i think they are. go ahead, martin. we're taking a rise of the boat and was that's of the sofa. exactly. exactly. the settlers and the westbank taking advantage of this window to doing whatever risk, costly ex. um they think that justified doing it cause it's not getting a pull to the other thing is not getting reported about westbank is that it's

becoming completely notice that these various searches that now just losing control completely was that correct downs with the data, assess the nations and it could not things and legal arrests, you know, as off the scale was also scale, which is also not being reported. is the number of iranian um, is which of being pumped into the west bank. so this is something else which is bubbling in the background. you have now, you know, an insurgency in the making. iran is using this in fluids in the region to continue to use georgia to ship by roads, a lot of legal ops, more homes. so that's another cool drugs that we would expect to stop bubbling up, you know, in the future. but you know, i'm, i think we're, we're, we're, we're looking at a, a catastrophe now on a level that we've never really been able to understand to, to, to, to, to, to go back to george's point. yeah. the americans might have a lot of headway in the 60 seventy's and perhaps eighty's when they were super. but when they were the sole superpower, you know, we receive a part of that science and that i mention,

you can make mistakes because everybody's, it gives you, everybody says tea, that's america. you know, you can pull out of them as a right of, of it. now and then one says yeah, okay, so, so what, you know, americans big enough to carry on with that scene a is a venue cuz callous. well i, i think there is a general thing towards be that they really were there mishaps i have occurred and let you got like a 40 seconds here is that they abuse the unit polar moment and that moment is closed. go ahead, george. i think so. and i think that i'm back in the 6th and 7th is a, it is they was a rival which was a piece of military rival, which was the, the soviet union. and the united states was back to the united states of bel pay. what kind of share of a planet with them, we kind of get into a, in a dangerous escalation with them this since the uni pulled a moment, you know, i say, says we, you know, we won the cold war, we dissolve the winnings. and we're going to take the winnings phone with us. and

even though you know all the others are suggesting that way and we'll take it, we'll take the winnings and, and this is how they use their, their victory and pirate can make 3. i would say that's all the time we have gentlemen, when think, my guessing marrow cash and in budapest and of course i want to thank our viewers for watching us here. are to see you next time. remember profits? apple's the, the water is part of is it that the is it a poly would posted? isn't the deepest view of us and bidding the word, or is it something deeper, more complex might be present there?

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the big issue on all the dates that it was making. obviously, she's the worst and consumer should appreciate these, let me, republican forensic strain and responsible actions toward disability and safety, 3 as concerns balance of and even broad a war rough thing in the middle east. iran says the west to be praising is measured response to israel and not condemning it. and we get feedback in the program or from a jewish iranian mtv, the seasons right there. the idea if we use it strikes on god the following and not a relative. com displaced palestinians trying to reach out to what's left of the homes in the north. they all of